NationStates

Mattopilos wrote:

The Princes of the Universe wrote:Even before I was religious, I found them obnoxious.

The fact many atheists like myself wish they never formed, it means they are not popular, and the message they are sending is too aggressive.

The Alexanderians wrote:

Mattopilos wrote:
The fact many atheists like myself wish they never formed, it means they are not popular, and the message they are sending is too aggressive.

Not to mention completely hypocritical since they just as bad as many forms of religious fundamentalism while decrying them at the drop of a hat, some of my greatest and closest friends are atheist and I've never gotten a vibe from them that I get from NA members.

Stormopolis wrote:Why isn't asatru in the list?

Veceria wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:Why isn't asatru in the list?

Pagan.

Stormopolis wrote:

Veceria wrote:Pagan.

That's...actually kind of offensive.

Neutraligon wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:
That's...actually kind of offensive.

Why is it offensive?

It is crucial to stress right from the start that until the 20th century people did not call themselves pagans to describe the religion they practised. The notion of paganism, as it is generally understood today, was created by the early Christian Church. It was a label that Christians applied to others, one of the antitheses that were central to the process of Christian self-definition. As such, throughout history it was generally used in a derogatory sense.
— Owen Davies, Paganism: A Very Short Introduction, 2011[6]

The term pagan is from Late Latin paganus, revived during the Renaissance. Itself deriving from classical Latin pagus which originally meant 'region delimited by markers', paganus had also come to mean 'of or relating to the countryside', 'country dweller', 'villager'; by extension, 'rustic', 'unlearned', 'yokel', 'bumpkin'; in Roman military jargon, 'non-combatant', 'civilian', 'unskilled soldier'. It is related to pangere ('to fasten', 'to fix or affix') and ultimately comes from Proto-Indo-European *pag- ('to fix' in the same sense).[7]

The adoption of paganus by the Latin Christians as an all-embracing, pejorative term for polytheists represents an unforeseen and singularly long-lasting victory, within a religious group, of a word of Latin slang originally devoid of religious meaning. The evolution occurred only in the Latin west, and in connection with the Latin church. Elsewhere, "Hellene" or "gentile" (ethnikos) remained the word for pagan; and paganos continued as a purely secular term, with overtones of the inferior and the commonplace.

Stormopolis wrote:

Neutraligon wrote:
Why is it offensive?

It infers that it is less than a religion like Christianity or Judaism.

It is crucial to stress right from the start that until the 20th century people did not call themselves pagans to describe the religion they practised. The notion of paganism, as it is generally understood today, was created by the early Christian Church. It was a label that Christians applied to others, one of the antitheses that were central to the process of Christian self-definition. As such, throughout history it was generally used in a derogatory sense.
— Owen Davies, Paganism: A Very Short Introduction, 2011[6]

The term pagan is from Late Latin paganus, revived during the Renaissance. Itself deriving from classical Latin pagus which originally meant 'region delimited by markers', paganus had also come to mean 'of or relating to the countryside', 'country dweller', 'villager'; by extension, 'rustic', 'unlearned', 'yokel', 'bumpkin'; in Roman military jargon, 'non-combatant', 'civilian', 'unskilled soldier'. It is related to pangere ('to fasten', 'to fix or affix') and ultimately comes from Proto-Indo-European *pag- ('to fix' in the same sense).[7]

The adoption of paganus by the Latin Christians as an all-embracing, pejorative term for polytheists represents an unforeseen and singularly long-lasting victory, within a religious group, of a word of Latin slang originally devoid of religious meaning. The evolution occurred only in the Latin west, and in connection with the Latin church. Elsewhere, "Hellene" or "gentile" (ethnikos) remained the word for pagan; and paganos continued as a purely secular term, with overtones of the inferior and the commonplace.

Neutraligon wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:
It infers that it is less than a religion like Christianity or Judaism.

Shrug I thought at this point that the word had been reclaimed by those who had religions that where not abrahamic or atheistic and had many gods. I wonder is Hinduism is considered pagan. Hmm must think on this.

Stormopolis wrote:

Neutraligon wrote:
Shrug I thought at this point that the word had been reclaimed by those who had religions that where not abrahamic or atheistic and had many gods. I wonder is Hinduism is considered pagan. Hmm must think on this.

It is, if you go with the original meaning. Anything but Judaism and Christianity (article includes islam, but that's not a religion, and also part of a discussion we aren't going to have here until I complete my essay on it.)

Stormopolis wrote:

Neutraligon wrote:
Why is it offensive?

It infers that it is less than a religion like Christianity or Judaism.

It is crucial to stress right from the start that until the 20th century people did not call themselves pagans to describe the religion they practised. The notion of paganism, as it is generally understood today, was created by the early Christian Church. It was a label that Christians applied to others, one of the antitheses that were central to the process of Christian self-definition. As such, throughout history it was generally used in a derogatory sense.
— Owen Davies, Paganism: A Very Short Introduction, 2011[6]

The term pagan is from Late Latin paganus, revived during the Renaissance. Itself deriving from classical Latin pagus which originally meant 'region delimited by markers', paganus had also come to mean 'of or relating to the countryside', 'country dweller', 'villager'; by extension, 'rustic', 'unlearned', 'yokel', 'bumpkin'; in Roman military jargon, 'non-combatant', 'civilian', 'unskilled soldier'. It is related to pangere ('to fasten', 'to fix or affix') and ultimately comes from Proto-Indo-European *pag- ('to fix' in the same sense).[7]

The adoption of paganus by the Latin Christians as an all-embracing, pejorative term for polytheists represents an unforeseen and singularly long-lasting victory, within a religious group, of a word of Latin slang originally devoid of religious meaning. The evolution occurred only in the Latin west, and in connection with the Latin church. Elsewhere, "Hellene" or "gentile" (ethnikos) remained the word for pagan; and paganos continued as a purely secular term, with overtones of the inferior and the commonplace.

Stormopolis wrote:

Neutraligon wrote:
Why is it offensive?

It infers that it is less than a religion like Christianity or Judaism.

It is crucial to stress right from the start that until the 20th century people did not call themselves pagans to describe the religion they practised. The notion of paganism, as it is generally understood today, was created by the early Christian Church. It was a label that Christians applied to others, one of the antitheses that were central to the process of Christian self-definition. As such, throughout history it was generally used in a derogatory sense.
— Owen Davies, Paganism: A Very Short Introduction, 2011[6]

The term pagan is from Late Latin paganus, revived during the Renaissance. Itself deriving from classical Latin pagus which originally meant 'region delimited by markers', paganus had also come to mean 'of or relating to the countryside', 'country dweller', 'villager'; by extension, 'rustic', 'unlearned', 'yokel', 'bumpkin'; in Roman military jargon, 'non-combatant', 'civilian', 'unskilled soldier'. It is related to pangere ('to fasten', 'to fix or affix') and ultimately comes from Proto-Indo-European *pag- ('to fix' in the same sense).[7]

The adoption of paganus by the Latin Christians as an all-embracing, pejorative term for polytheists represents an unforeseen and singularly long-lasting victory, within a religious group, of a word of Latin slang originally devoid of religious meaning. The evolution occurred only in the Latin west, and in connection with the Latin church. Elsewhere, "Hellene" or "gentile" (ethnikos) remained the word for pagan; and paganos continued as a purely secular term, with overtones of the inferior and the commonplace.

Freefall11111 wrote:Nobody uses the term like that anymore.

Stormopolis wrote:

Freefall11111 wrote:Nobody uses the term like that anymore.

Ah. So you know what the 400 million L1 speakers of English use the word for, and what the 2 billion L2 speakers use the word for? Where were you when I had Advanced English Syntax?

Freefall11111 wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:
Ah. So you know what the 400 million L1 speakers of English use the word for, and what the 2 billion L2 speakers use the word for? Where were you when I had Advanced English Syntax?

Yea, I do. Go ask someone on the street what paganism means. You'll be hard pressed to find someone who responds "A religion that's worse than Judaism or Christianity". Seriously, go ahead. Film your attempts, please.

The Scandinavian Kingdom Of Norway wrote:Sunni Muslim.

Stormopolis wrote:

Neutraligon wrote:
Shrug I thought at this point that the word had been reclaimed by those who had religions that where not abrahamic or atheistic and had many gods. I wonder is Hinduism is considered pagan. Hmm must think on this.

It is, if you go with the original meaning. Anything but Judaism and Christianity (article includes islam, but that's not a religion, and also part of a discussion we aren't going to have here until I complete my essay on it.)

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:
It is, if you go with the original meaning. Anything but Judaism and Christianity (article includes islam, but that's not a religion, and also part of a discussion we aren't going to have here until I complete my essay on it.)

Al-Islam is a religion. Cause we believe in Allah (SWT), believe in a hereafter, base our lives around the Deen...pretty sure that's a religion.

Stormopolis wrote:

El-Amin Caliphate wrote:Al-Islam is a religion. Cause we believe in Allah (SWT), believe in a hereafter, base our lives around the Deen...pretty sure that's a religion.

You disqualifiy yourselves in various areas. But more on that once I complete my essay.

Stormopolis wrote:

Veceria wrote:Pagan.

That's...actually kind of offensive.

Kubumba Tribe wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:
You disqualifiy yourselves in various areas. But more on that once I complete my essay.

What 'disqualifications' do we have?

Stormopolis wrote:

Kubumba Tribe wrote:What 'disqualifications' do we have?

Tons. I told you, you'll read it when it's done. Which it isn't.

Freefall11111 wrote:

Stormopolis wrote:
Ah. So you know what the 400 million L1 speakers of English use the word for, and what the 2 billion L2 speakers use the word for? Where were you when I had Advanced English Syntax?

Yea, I do. Go ask someone on the street what paganism means. You'll be hard pressed to find someone who responds "A religion that's worse than Judaism or Christianity". Seriously, go ahead. Film your attempts, please.

Stormopolis wrote:Why isn't asatru in the list?