NATION

PASSWORD

Anglican church against gay marriage

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

Advertisement

Remove ads

User avatar
Baltenstein
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 11008
Founded: Jan 25, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Baltenstein » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:48 pm

Zoo Trouble wrote:Didn't know there were over a million Angelicans in the US.

Does anyone know what the Christians are called that reject the Pauline Epistles? I believe most of the marriage mumbo jumbo comes from Paul in the NEw Testament, but I could be wrong.


Aren't they called Episcopalians in the US?
O'er the hills and o'er the main.
Through Flanders, Portugal and Spain.
King George commands and we obey.
Over the hills and far away.


THE NORTH REMEMBERS

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:49 pm

Kannap wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:Wait...are you a girl or a boy?


Remember back to your freshman year health class, which couple has sex and produces a baby thus so?

From your very first comment I thought you were talking about a lesbian relationship :?
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Lancaster of Wessex
Senator
 
Posts: 4999
Founded: Feb 21, 2004
New York Times Democracy

Postby Lancaster of Wessex » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:49 pm

Baltenstein wrote:
Zoo Trouble wrote:Didn't know there were over a million Angelicans in the US.

Does anyone know what the Christians are called that reject the Pauline Epistles? I believe most of the marriage mumbo jumbo comes from Paul in the NEw Testament, but I could be wrong.


Aren't they called Episcopalians in the US?


They are, the rest of the world (pretty much) uses the term Anglican. England uses The Church of England, Ireland, the Church of Ireland. We in Canada use Anglican Church of Canada.
Lancaster.
Duke of the Most Ancient and Noble House of Lancaster of Wessex

The Most High, Potent, and Noble Prince, Lancaster, By the Grace of God, Duke of Wessex, Protector of the Enclaved Pious Estates of The Church of Wessex, Lord of Saint Aldhelm Islands, Prince and Great Steward of Celtic Wessex, Keeper of the Great Seal of the Duchy and House of Lancaster of Wessex, Sovereign of the Most Ancient and Illustrious Order of the Gold Gryphon, etc.

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76676
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:49 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:God deserves the glory because He created us, and the air we breath and food we eat that maintains our lives. He deserves our praise. Humans who are selfish do not deserve the glory because all of their achievements were accomplished with something that they would not have without God.

God deserves the glory because he made us for his own amusement and punishes us for acting in a manner that he has specifically created us to. But hey, he made us, so... that makes him good? What kind of morality is that? Does an abusive mother deserve eternal praise because she birthed and fed her kids?
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

User avatar
Zoice
Minister
 
Posts: 3041
Founded: Oct 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Zoice » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:50 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:
Zoice wrote:Again, no. That's just not a fact, STD's were all over the place before the sexual revolution. As for the individual level, well, there is no good reason.

Well ultimately the only way to fight sexual temptation is to be devoted to something greater than yourself (i.e. God) which is why teaching abstinence does not work in a secular society. That's my point.

Abstinence only education has never worked, not in secular societies, not in theocracies.

Constantinopolis wrote:And finally, one last point before I sign off: The conversation about STDs is misguided. Sexual promiscuity is not wrong because it might give you STDs. That's just a potential side effect.

Sexual promiscuity is wrong because it injures your soul by promoting selfishness. As Christians, we are called to love our neighbors as ourselves, to erase the mental distinction between us and others, to empty ourselves of concerns for the self. We must strive to not even think of ourselves at all. To always think of others. To allow the concern for others to fill our minds and souls completely. Living in communion. That is the Way. Few attain it, but all should strive towards it.

Sexual promiscuity makes it impossible to follow the Way, because one who is promiscuous uses sex for individual gratification. Promiscuity makes sex about me and my desires, when it should always be about my partner. Ideally, it should be entirely about my partner, and not at all about myself. The proper Christian attitude to sex is to use it as an expression of selfless love. To give pleasure to another, whom you love. Of course, it's fine to also receive pleasure from them, but one should never seek it. Sexual pleasure should be seen as a gift. It's nice to receive gifts, but we don't go around asking people, "so, I want a gift right now, can I have one?"

And for the vast, overwhelming majority of people, only a long-term, committed monogamous relationship can cultivate the kind of absolutely selfless love that makes the Christian approach to sex possible. That doesn't mean that every committed monogamous relationship will contain this kind of love, but it does mean that a committed monogamous relationship is (usually) required as a starting point.

TL;DR - Promiscuity is wrong because sex should always be about making your partner happy, and those who are promiscuous seek to make themselves happy.


That's. . . more thoughtful than I expected, but still full of shit. There's nothing wrong with seeking pleasure in sex, and as long as both people understand what's going on, no one is hurt by it. If you want to be monogamous that's fine, but some people don't - and that is fine too.

Grand Calvert wrote:
Washington Resistance Army wrote:
No I've read it, multiple times. But no matter what I was never able to actually wrap my mind around why these things are wrong beyond arbitrary reasons that didn't make much sense to me. Which ended up being one of the major reasons why I left the religion.

Ultimately humans are created for God's glory and pleasure, and so when we seek to pleasure ourselves over Him who created us, we are acting sinfully. We are putting ourselves above our Creator, which He takes as an insult (and it is).


This. . . is disgusting, frankly. What a horrible anti-humanist nihilist narrowminded view of the world.
♂♀Copy and Paste this in your sig if you're ignorant about human sexuality and want to let everyone know. ♂♀
Or if you're an asshole that goes out of your way to bully minorities and call them words with the strict intent of upsetting a demographic that is already at a huge risk of suicide, or being murdered for who they are. :)

For: Abortions, Anomalocaris, Atheism, Anti-theism, Being a good person, Genetic Engineering, LGBT rights, Sammy Harris, the Sandman, Science, Secular humanism
Against: AGW Denialism, Anti-Semitism, Banning religion, Ends, Hillary Clinton, Islamophobia, Means, Mother Theresa, Organized religion, Pacifism, Prejudice, the Pope, Political Correctness, Racism, Regressive Lefties and Righties, Republican Candidates, Theism, Violence

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:51 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:God deserves the glory because He created us, and the air we breath and food we eat that maintains our lives. He deserves our praise. Humans who are selfish do not deserve the glory because all of their achievements were accomplished with something that they would not have without God.

God deserves the glory because he made us for his own amusement and punishes us for acting in a manner that he has specifically created us to. But hey, he made us, so... that makes him good? What kind of morality is that? Does an abusive mother deserve eternal praise because she birthed and fed her kids?

What? He never punishes us for acting the way He created us for, He punishes us for acting sinfully (which because of Adam and Eve's sin is now a part of human nature). And I would say that a mother does not deserve eternal praise because ultimately it was God who created those children.
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 67527
Founded: May 07, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kannap » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:52 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:
Kannap wrote:
Remember back to your freshman year health class, which couple has sex and produces a baby thus so?

From your very first comment I thought you were talking about a lesbian relationship :?


Then you jumped to a foolish assumption.
Luna Amore wrote:Please remember to attend the ritualistic burning of Kannap for heresy
T H E M O U N T A I N S A R E C A L L I N G A N D I M U S T G O
G A Y S I N C E 1 9 9 7
.::The List of National Sports::.
27 years old, gay demisexual, they/them agnostic, South Carolinian. Pumpkin Spice everything.
TET's resident red panda
Red Panda Network
Jill Stein 2024

User avatar
Setgavarius
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1087
Founded: Mar 21, 2013
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Setgavarius » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:53 pm

Zoice wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:Well ultimately the only way to fight sexual temptation is to be devoted to something greater than yourself (i.e. God) which is why teaching abstinence does not work in a secular society. That's my point.

Abstinence only education has never worked, not in secular societies, not in theocracies.

Constantinopolis wrote:And finally, one last point before I sign off: The conversation about STDs is misguided. Sexual promiscuity is not wrong because it might give you STDs. That's just a potential side effect.

Sexual promiscuity is wrong because it injures your soul by promoting selfishness. As Christians, we are called to love our neighbors as ourselves, to erase the mental distinction between us and others, to empty ourselves of concerns for the self. We must strive to not even think of ourselves at all. To always think of others. To allow the concern for others to fill our minds and souls completely. Living in communion. That is the Way. Few attain it, but all should strive towards it.

Sexual promiscuity makes it impossible to follow the Way, because one who is promiscuous uses sex for individual gratification. Promiscuity makes sex about me and my desires, when it should always be about my partner. Ideally, it should be entirely about my partner, and not at all about myself. The proper Christian attitude to sex is to use it as an expression of selfless love. To give pleasure to another, whom you love. Of course, it's fine to also receive pleasure from them, but one should never seek it. Sexual pleasure should be seen as a gift. It's nice to receive gifts, but we don't go around asking people, "so, I want a gift right now, can I have one?"

And for the vast, overwhelming majority of people, only a long-term, committed monogamous relationship can cultivate the kind of absolutely selfless love that makes the Christian approach to sex possible. That doesn't mean that every committed monogamous relationship will contain this kind of love, but it does mean that a committed monogamous relationship is (usually) required as a starting point.

TL;DR - Promiscuity is wrong because sex should always be about making your partner happy, and those who are promiscuous seek to make themselves happy.


That's. . . more thoughtful than I expected, but still full of shit. There's nothing wrong with seeking pleasure in sex, and as long as both people understand what's going on, no one is hurt by it. If you want to be monogamous that's fine, but some people don't - and that is fine too.

Grand Calvert wrote:Ultimately humans are created for God's glory and pleasure, and so when we seek to pleasure ourselves over Him who created us, we are acting sinfully. We are putting ourselves above our Creator, which He takes as an insult (and it is).


This. . . is disgusting, frankly. What a horrible anti-humanist nihilist narrowminded view of the world.

I wouldn't say it's neccessarily nihilistic to slaver to a cosmic dictator. Seems damn creepy, sure.
The Planetary Administration of Setgavarius,
The World of Snark

Core Colony of The United Colonies of Earth.

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:53 pm

Zoice wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:Well ultimately the only way to fight sexual temptation is to be devoted to something greater than yourself (i.e. God) which is why teaching abstinence does not work in a secular society. That's my point.

Abstinence only education has never worked, not in secular societies, not in theocracies.

Constantinopolis wrote:And finally, one last point before I sign off: The conversation about STDs is misguided. Sexual promiscuity is not wrong because it might give you STDs. That's just a potential side effect.

Sexual promiscuity is wrong because it injures your soul by promoting selfishness. As Christians, we are called to love our neighbors as ourselves, to erase the mental distinction between us and others, to empty ourselves of concerns for the self. We must strive to not even think of ourselves at all. To always think of others. To allow the concern for others to fill our minds and souls completely. Living in communion. That is the Way. Few attain it, but all should strive towards it.

Sexual promiscuity makes it impossible to follow the Way, because one who is promiscuous uses sex for individual gratification. Promiscuity makes sex about me and my desires, when it should always be about my partner. Ideally, it should be entirely about my partner, and not at all about myself. The proper Christian attitude to sex is to use it as an expression of selfless love. To give pleasure to another, whom you love. Of course, it's fine to also receive pleasure from them, but one should never seek it. Sexual pleasure should be seen as a gift. It's nice to receive gifts, but we don't go around asking people, "so, I want a gift right now, can I have one?"

And for the vast, overwhelming majority of people, only a long-term, committed monogamous relationship can cultivate the kind of absolutely selfless love that makes the Christian approach to sex possible. That doesn't mean that every committed monogamous relationship will contain this kind of love, but it does mean that a committed monogamous relationship is (usually) required as a starting point.

TL;DR - Promiscuity is wrong because sex should always be about making your partner happy, and those who are promiscuous seek to make themselves happy.


That's. . . more thoughtful than I expected, but still full of shit. There's nothing wrong with seeking pleasure in sex, and as long as both people understand what's going on, no one is hurt by it. If you want to be monogamous that's fine, but some people don't - and that is fine too.

Grand Calvert wrote:Ultimately humans are created for God's glory and pleasure, and so when we seek to pleasure ourselves over Him who created us, we are acting sinfully. We are putting ourselves above our Creator, which He takes as an insult (and it is).


This. . . is disgusting, frankly. What a horrible anti-humanist nihilist narrowminded view of the world.

How is it nihilist? Nihilism means that life is meaningless. Living your life for God is the opposite of nihilism.
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:54 pm

Kannap wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:From your very first comment I thought you were talking about a lesbian relationship :?


Then you jumped to a foolish assumption.

Sorry.
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 67527
Founded: May 07, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kannap » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:54 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:God deserves the glory because he made us for his own amusement and punishes us for acting in a manner that he has specifically created us to. But hey, he made us, so... that makes him good? What kind of morality is that? Does an abusive mother deserve eternal praise because she birthed and fed her kids?

What? He never punishes us for acting the way He created us for, He punishes us for acting sinfully (which because of Adam and Eve's sin is now a part of human nature). And I would say that a mother does not deserve eternal praise because ultimately it was God who created those children.


Unless God intends to go around zapping people into virgin births in 2016, the parents of the child deserve credit for having the child.
Luna Amore wrote:Please remember to attend the ritualistic burning of Kannap for heresy
T H E M O U N T A I N S A R E C A L L I N G A N D I M U S T G O
G A Y S I N C E 1 9 9 7
.::The List of National Sports::.
27 years old, gay demisexual, they/them agnostic, South Carolinian. Pumpkin Spice everything.
TET's resident red panda
Red Panda Network
Jill Stein 2024

User avatar
Zoice
Minister
 
Posts: 3041
Founded: Oct 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Zoice » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:55 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:
Zoice wrote:Abstinence only education has never worked, not in secular societies, not in theocracies.



That's. . . more thoughtful than I expected, but still full of shit. There's nothing wrong with seeking pleasure in sex, and as long as both people understand what's going on, no one is hurt by it. If you want to be monogamous that's fine, but some people don't - and that is fine too.



This. . . is disgusting, frankly. What a horrible anti-humanist nihilist narrowminded view of the world.

How is it nihilist? Nihilism means that life is meaningless. Living your life for God is the opposite of nihilism.

Life is meaningless. The only thing worth doing is being God's yesman. So, life has no meaning without heaping praise on him. Horrible.
♂♀Copy and Paste this in your sig if you're ignorant about human sexuality and want to let everyone know. ♂♀
Or if you're an asshole that goes out of your way to bully minorities and call them words with the strict intent of upsetting a demographic that is already at a huge risk of suicide, or being murdered for who they are. :)

For: Abortions, Anomalocaris, Atheism, Anti-theism, Being a good person, Genetic Engineering, LGBT rights, Sammy Harris, the Sandman, Science, Secular humanism
Against: AGW Denialism, Anti-Semitism, Banning religion, Ends, Hillary Clinton, Islamophobia, Means, Mother Theresa, Organized religion, Pacifism, Prejudice, the Pope, Political Correctness, Racism, Regressive Lefties and Righties, Republican Candidates, Theism, Violence

User avatar
Anywhere Else But Here
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5651
Founded: Mar 05, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Anywhere Else But Here » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:55 pm

Constantinopolis wrote:And finally, one last point before I sign off: The conversation about STDs is misguided. Sexual promiscuity is not wrong because it might give you STDs. That's just a potential side effect.

Sexual promiscuity is wrong because it injures your soul by promoting selfishness. As Christians, we are called to love our neighbors as ourselves, to erase the mental distinction between us and others, to empty ourselves of concerns for the self. We must strive to not even think of ourselves at all. To always think of others. To allow the concern for others to fill our minds and souls completely. Living in communion. That is the Way. Few attain it, but all should strive towards it.

Sexual promiscuity makes it impossible to follow the Way, because one who is promiscuous uses sex for individual gratification. Promiscuity makes sex about me and my desires, when it should always be about my partner. Ideally, it should be entirely about my partner, and not at all about myself. The proper Christian attitude to sex is to use it as an expression of selfless love. To give pleasure to another, whom you love. Of course, it's fine to also receive pleasure from them, but one should never seek it. Sexual pleasure should be seen as a gift. It's nice to receive gifts, but we don't go around asking people, "so, I want a gift right now, can I have one?"

And for the vast, overwhelming majority of people, only a long-term, committed monogamous relationship can cultivate the kind of absolutely selfless love that makes the Christian approach to sex possible. That doesn't mean that every committed monogamous relationship will contain this kind of love, but it does mean that a committed monogamous relationship is (usually) required as a starting point.

TL;DR - Promiscuity is wrong because sex should always be about making your partner happy, and those who are promiscuous seek to make themselves happy.


Nonsense. Promiscuity=/=selfishness. You just asserted that.
The post then falls apart.

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76676
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:55 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:What? He never punishes us for acting the way He created us for, He punishes us for acting sinfully (which because of Adam and Eve's sin is now a part of human nature).

Remind me, who is the creator of everything in the universe in your religion, including the Garden of Eden and the tree of knowledge? Including the very ideas of knowledge and sin?

You see, there are only two possibilities. Either morality is independent from God, in which case God is not the decider of good and evil, or morality is not independent from God, in which case he must answer for all of his choices, such as creating the idea of sin, making humans biologically programmed to be aroused when they see attractive humans they aren't in a monogamous relationship with, making plagues and wasps that birth their young inside their prey and goddamn spiders.
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:55 pm

Kannap wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:What? He never punishes us for acting the way He created us for, He punishes us for acting sinfully (which because of Adam and Eve's sin is now a part of human nature). And I would say that a mother does not deserve eternal praise because ultimately it was God who created those children.


Unless God intends to go around zapping people into virgin births in 2016, the parents of the child deserve credit for having the child.

They deserve credit, but they do not deserve God's glory.
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76676
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:57 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:How is it nihilist? Nihilism means that life is meaningless. Living your life for God is the opposite of nihilism.

It's actually very nihilist. Living your life solely for another being without any values or principles independent of that being is nihilist. If God tells you left is right, it's so, even if he's not telling the truth. If God tells you to rape and murder, you go and get your murderin' boots on, because God is your only meaning in life.
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

User avatar
Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 67527
Founded: May 07, 2012
Democratic Socialists

Postby Kannap » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:57 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:What? He never punishes us for acting the way He created us for, He punishes us for acting sinfully (which because of Adam and Eve's sin is now a part of human nature).

Remind me, who is the creator of everything in the universe in your religion, including the Garden of Eden and the tree of knowledge? Including the very ideas of knowledge and sin?

You see, there are only two possibilities. Either morality is independent from God, in which case God is not the decider of good and evil, or morality is not independent from God, in which case he must answer for all of his choices, such as creating the idea of sin, making humans biologically programmed to be aroused when they see attractive humans they aren't in a monogamous relationship with, making plagues and wasps that birth their young inside their prey and goddamn spiders.


I have questions about the wasps and spiders too. What were you thinking, God?
Luna Amore wrote:Please remember to attend the ritualistic burning of Kannap for heresy
T H E M O U N T A I N S A R E C A L L I N G A N D I M U S T G O
G A Y S I N C E 1 9 9 7
.::The List of National Sports::.
27 years old, gay demisexual, they/them agnostic, South Carolinian. Pumpkin Spice everything.
TET's resident red panda
Red Panda Network
Jill Stein 2024

User avatar
Arthurious
Civilian
 
Posts: 1
Founded: Jan 13, 2016
Ex-Nation

WHAT?

Postby Arthurious » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:58 pm

I thought everything was alright with same sex marriage. :oops:

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:58 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:What? He never punishes us for acting the way He created us for, He punishes us for acting sinfully (which because of Adam and Eve's sin is now a part of human nature).

Remind me, who is the creator of everything in the universe in your religion, including the Garden of Eden and the tree of knowledge? Including the very ideas of knowledge and sin?

You see, there are only two possibilities. Either morality is independent from God, in which case God is not the decider of good and evil, or morality is not independent from God, in which case he must answer for all of his choices, such as creating the idea of sin, making humans biologically programmed to be aroused when they see attractive humans they aren't in a monogamous relationship with, making plagues and wasps that birth their young inside their prey and goddamn spiders.

What? I choose option c, where God is the very definition of good, which is what pretty much all Christians believe. And anyways, He did not create sin, Adam and Eve chose to sin. You see, in order for Adam to truly be loyal to God, which is what He wants, there has to be something else. Something besides God. So that's what the Tree was there for. For Adam to prove his loyalty (which he failed at).
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:59 pm

Conserative Morality wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:How is it nihilist? Nihilism means that life is meaningless. Living your life for God is the opposite of nihilism.

It's actually very nihilist. Living your life solely for another being without any values or principles independent of that being is nihilist. If God tells you left is right, it's so, even if he's not telling the truth. If God tells you to rape and murder, you go and get your murderin' boots on, because God is your only meaning in life.

Except that God has never told me to do those things.
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
The Flutterlands
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15157
Founded: Oct 02, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Flutterlands » Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:02 pm

Anywhere Else But Here wrote:
Constantinopolis wrote:And finally, one last point before I sign off: The conversation about STDs is misguided. Sexual promiscuity is not wrong because it might give you STDs. That's just a potential side effect.

Sexual promiscuity is wrong because it injures your soul by promoting selfishness. As Christians, we are called to love our neighbors as ourselves, to erase the mental distinction between us and others, to empty ourselves of concerns for the self. We must strive to not even think of ourselves at all. To always think of others. To allow the concern for others to fill our minds and souls completely. Living in communion. That is the Way. Few attain it, but all should strive towards it.

Sexual promiscuity makes it impossible to follow the Way, because one who is promiscuous uses sex for individual gratification. Promiscuity makes sex about me and my desires, when it should always be about my partner. Ideally, it should be entirely about my partner, and not at all about myself. The proper Christian attitude to sex is to use it as an expression of selfless love. To give pleasure to another, whom you love. Of course, it's fine to also receive pleasure from them, but one should never seek it. Sexual pleasure should be seen as a gift. It's nice to receive gifts, but we don't go around asking people, "so, I want a gift right now, can I have one?"

And for the vast, overwhelming majority of people, only a long-term, committed monogamous relationship can cultivate the kind of absolutely selfless love that makes the Christian approach to sex possible. That doesn't mean that every committed monogamous relationship will contain this kind of love, but it does mean that a committed monogamous relationship is (usually) required as a starting point.

TL;DR - Promiscuity is wrong because sex should always be about making your partner happy, and those who are promiscuous seek to make themselves happy.


Nonsense. Promiscuity=/=selfishness. You just asserted that.
The post then falls apart.

Actually... Yeah. I agree with this. As long as you're not cheating on your mate.
Call me Flutters - Minister of Justice of the Federation of the Shy One - Fluttershy is best pony
Who I side with - My Discord - OC Pony - Pitch Black
White, American, Male, Asexual, Deist, Autistic with Aspergers and ADHD, Civil Liberatarian and Democratic Socialist, Brony and Whovian. I have Neurofibromatosis Type 1. I'm also INTJ
Political Compass
Economic Left/Right: -4.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.77
Pros: Choice, Democracy, Liberatarianism, Populism, Secularism, Equal Rights, Contraceptives, Immigration, Environmentalism, Free Speech and Egalitarianism
Con: Communism, Fascism, SJW 'Feminism', Terrorism, Homophobia, Transphobia, Xenophobia, Death Penalty, Totalitarianism, Neoliberalism, and War.
Ravenclaw

User avatar
Zoice
Minister
 
Posts: 3041
Founded: Oct 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Zoice » Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:03 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:
Conserative Morality wrote:It's actually very nihilist. Living your life solely for another being without any values or principles independent of that being is nihilist. If God tells you left is right, it's so, even if he's not telling the truth. If God tells you to rape and murder, you go and get your murderin' boots on, because God is your only meaning in life.

Except that God has never told me to do those things.

Instead He told you that homosexuality is wrong, promiscuity is bad, abortion is murder, and His Glory is the meaning to life. And you believed Him.
♂♀Copy and Paste this in your sig if you're ignorant about human sexuality and want to let everyone know. ♂♀
Or if you're an asshole that goes out of your way to bully minorities and call them words with the strict intent of upsetting a demographic that is already at a huge risk of suicide, or being murdered for who they are. :)

For: Abortions, Anomalocaris, Atheism, Anti-theism, Being a good person, Genetic Engineering, LGBT rights, Sammy Harris, the Sandman, Science, Secular humanism
Against: AGW Denialism, Anti-Semitism, Banning religion, Ends, Hillary Clinton, Islamophobia, Means, Mother Theresa, Organized religion, Pacifism, Prejudice, the Pope, Political Correctness, Racism, Regressive Lefties and Righties, Republican Candidates, Theism, Violence

User avatar
Grand Calvert
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1332
Founded: Feb 12, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Calvert » Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:04 pm

Zoice wrote:
Grand Calvert wrote:Except that God has never told me to do those things.

Instead He told you that homosexuality is wrong, promiscuity is bad, abortion is murder, and His Glory is the meaning to life. And you believed Him.

Umm...ok? So?
17 year-old Conservative Reformed Baptist
“So when the devil throws your sins in your face and declares that you deserve death and hell, tell him this: "I admit that I deserve death and hell, what of it? For I know One who suffered and made satisfaction on my behalf. His name is Jesus Christ, Son of God, and where He is there I shall be also!” -Martin Luther

Saved...

Sola Gratia (by grace alone)
Sola Fide (through faith alone)
Solus Christus (in Christ alone)
Sola Scriptura (according to scripture alone)
Soli Deo Gloria (for the glory of God alone)

User avatar
Zoice
Minister
 
Posts: 3041
Founded: Oct 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Zoice » Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:05 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:
Zoice wrote:Instead He told you that homosexuality is wrong, promiscuity is bad, abortion is murder, and His Glory is the meaning to life. And you believed Him.

Umm...ok? So?

. . . The point is that your post of "Except that God has never told me to do those things" completely misses the point, and is pretty funny. Yeah, he didn't tell you to do THOSE things, but he did tell you to do OTHER things, and you obeyed.
♂♀Copy and Paste this in your sig if you're ignorant about human sexuality and want to let everyone know. ♂♀
Or if you're an asshole that goes out of your way to bully minorities and call them words with the strict intent of upsetting a demographic that is already at a huge risk of suicide, or being murdered for who they are. :)

For: Abortions, Anomalocaris, Atheism, Anti-theism, Being a good person, Genetic Engineering, LGBT rights, Sammy Harris, the Sandman, Science, Secular humanism
Against: AGW Denialism, Anti-Semitism, Banning religion, Ends, Hillary Clinton, Islamophobia, Means, Mother Theresa, Organized religion, Pacifism, Prejudice, the Pope, Political Correctness, Racism, Regressive Lefties and Righties, Republican Candidates, Theism, Violence

User avatar
Conserative Morality
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 76676
Founded: Aug 24, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby Conserative Morality » Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:05 pm

Grand Calvert wrote:What? I choose option c, where God is the very definition of good, which is what pretty much all Christians believe.

That's option a. God necessarily defines morality. He is good. Else he is either not omnipotent or not omnibenevolent.
And anyways, He did not create sin, Adam and Eve chose to sin.

God decides what sin is. God decides that there is such a thing as sin. God can make eating shellfish sinful and murdering everyone in a town holy. He's the legislative, executive, and judicial branch all in one. He makes the rules. He interprets the rules. And, to some degree, he enforces the rules. He who makes the rules must answer to them. If there are concepts independent of God, then God necessarily is not the beginning of all things in the universe, not the lone creator Christian mythology relies upon. God has created these concepts, so he has to answer for why he did so and why he uses them so.
You see, in order for Adam to truly be loyal to God, which is what He wants, there has to be something else. Something besides God. So that's what the Tree was there for. For Adam to prove his loyalty (which he failed at).

You assume that's the reason the tree of knowledge was there. Where in the bible does it say that, again?
On the hate train. Choo choo, bitches. Bi-Polar. Proud Crypto-Fascist and Turbo Progressive. Dirty Étatist. Lowly Humanities Major. NSG's Best Liberal.
Caesar and Imperator of RWDT
Got a blog up again. || An NS Writing Discussion

PreviousNext

Advertisement

Remove ads

Return to General

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: A United American Empire, Abarri, Alanermia, Heldervin, HISPIDA, Hypron, Ifreann, Imperializt Russia, Indomalfil, Libyrossa, Neu California, Pale Dawn, Philjia, Port Carverton, Stellar Colonies, The Holy Therns, The Lone Alliance, The Notorious Mad Jack, The Rebel Army, The Wyrese Empire, Wheath

Advertisement

Remove ads