Militia Cleanup: Did you say take away their kids?

[Teemant]

Well people who I was talking about most likely would disagree with me.

Indeed. We tend to disagree with those who generalize and misremember the past.

Sure. Obviously there hasn't been a single generalisation about right wingers in this forum.

[Ifreann]

Logic dictates that if you take guns to a hostile federal building takeover, you have every intention of using them. Either by firing, or has been mentioned several times already, by threatening to use them. They would not have brought guns if they did not intend to use them, or they would not have brought them.
Hell, even carrying a gun implies intent to use.

Some people carry guns everyday and that is the reason why I don't think carrying = using. But I think that when police would show up and surround the building and they would point guns at police or something like that, then it would be using guns.

But the police aren't surrounding them. Because they fear for the safety of both their officers and the people occupying the refuge. Do you think they're concerned about getting shot at if they approach, or about startling people and causing them to trip and sprain their ankles?

[Valaran]

Indeed. We tend to disagree with those who generalize and misremember the past.

For sure there haven't been a single generalisation about right wingers in this forum.

I don't see how that excuses generalisations about leftwingers. Surely both are inaccurate, so don't do either.

[Teemant]

For sure there haven't been a single generalisation about right wingers in this forum.

I don't see how that excuses generalisations about leftwingers. Surely both are inaccurate, so don't do either.

Just pointing out that the "we" who disagrees with "those who generalize" generalize themselves too.

[Alvecia]

I don't see how that excuses generalisations about leftwingers. Surely both are inaccurate, so don't do either.

Just pointing out that the "we" who disagrees with "those who generalize" generalize themselves too.

Any time you want to address my point would be nice.

[Valaran]

I don't see how that excuses generalisations about leftwingers. Surely both are inaccurate, so don't do either.

Just pointing out that the "we" who disagrees with "those who generalize" generalize themselves too.

Are you saying that Iffy generalises?
Or Alvecia?
Or Imperializt Russia?

And if not, who are you saying generalises?

[Salus Maior]

Considering this isn't anything close to terrorism, any kind of comparison to terrorist group would be incredibly over-dramatic.

Well Al Qaeda just wanted the US to change its policies wrt the Middle East when they attacked the US government. Yall Qaeda here are trying to get the government to actually cede land to them. "Terrorist" might be an understatement.

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

[Ragnarum]

Its a fucking wildlife reserve.

[Sucrati]

It's Sedition! https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384 lolwhoops

[Gauthier]

Well Al Qaeda just wanted the US to change its policies wrt the Middle East when they attacked the US government. Yall Qaeda here are trying to get the government to actually cede land to them. "Terrorist" might be an understatement.

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

It's not terrorism.

It's open rebellion against government.

[Frank Zipper]

Clearly the US police need their own reaper drones to clear out these moochers safely.

[Salus Maior]

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

It's not terrorism.

It's open rebellion against government.

That's what I'm saying.

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Political parties in the judicial system? Where?

well for one the justices are appointed by the President and approved by the Congress(senate)

Yes, and from that point on they answer to no-one but the law itself. It doesn't matter who you're appointed by, when that institution has no power to remove you. If you get appointed by the president and then act completely against his interests? Good job, no-one can remove you. Supreme judge 4 life.

[Alvecia]

Its a fucking wildlife reserve.

What of it?

[Ifreann]

Well Al Qaeda just wanted the US to change its policies wrt the Middle East when they attacked the US government. Yall Qaeda here are trying to get the government to actually cede land to them. "Terrorist" might be an understatement.

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

Yes, pretty much.

[New Chalcedon]

I've seen people say, "Well, this isn't anything so bad...", as well as specifically stating why they think it's not a declaration of war against the US Government. Well, I have only this to say. It's said that actions count for more than words, so here's what Bundy Jr. and his band of yahoos are essentially saying by taking the actions they've taken:

Hello. I have a rifle. I’m taking over your building. Make this particular change to the law. I’ll be here for years. Oh, and I’ll shoot anyone who tries to throw me out of this building.

That's a declaration of war. So my response is simple: don't throw them out. Jam cellphone frequencies, cut off power and water, and impose a no-go zone around the building. Above all, do not fire unless fired at, and even then only if absolutely necessary. Maintain the manpower in place to detain anyone who tries to enter or leave - anyone, including journalists - then just sit there.

When this batch of redneck yahoos has tired of their "internet tough guy" schtick (along with the loss of power, water and probably food) inform them that unconditional surrenders will be accepted, along with their fingerprints for treason trials.

Then try them for treason. And yes, this is treason:

Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them,

When they're found guilty - as they almost certainly will be - throw the book at them.

[Asherahan]

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

It's not terrorism.

It's open rebellion against government.

Not its sedition for now at least

[New Chalcedon]

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

Yes, pretty much.

There's a word for it. It's called "treason", not "terrorism". Bundy and his bunch of assholes aren't trying to instill fear in anyone - they're trying to seize territory of the United States by force of arms, while being citizens of same.

[Gauthier]

It's not terrorism.

It's open rebellion against government.

That's what I'm saying.

The terrorism related cracks and nicknames are just pointing out the plain sight hypocrisy that had they been a mostly minority group like Black Lives Matter or a bunch of Muslims there would have been a crackdown already.

If anything, the longer the militia gets preferential treatment the more it's likely to inspire some BLM activists that the only way *their* movement will be given serious deference is if they started arming up as well. Hey, if they get shot dead just for having toy guns, well as might go all the way with the genuine articles after all.

[Ragnarum]

Its a fucking wildlife reserve.

What of it?

Well, its hardly the pentagon.

I would just leave them to it until they realised they where being ignored.

[New Chalcedon]

What of it?

Well, its hardly the pentagon.

I would just leave them to it until they realised they where being ignored.

Or attracted more yahoos, them decided they needed a bit more space, and so on and so forth.

No. Nip it in the bud. Appeasement is almost never the right policy.

[Alvecia]

What of it?

Well, its hardly the pentagon.

I would just leave them to it until they realised they where being ignored.

It's still federal ground. Besides, I get the feeling that mostly ignoring them is the current strategy being taken.

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Well Al Qaeda just wanted the US to change its policies wrt the Middle East when they attacked the US government. Yall Qaeda here are trying to get the government to actually cede land to them. "Terrorist" might be an understatement.

And Al-Qaeda tried to force this change by ramming planes into buildings killing thousands of people and leaving the rest in fear of what they might do next.

Bundy-squad squats in an empty federal building in the middle of the wilderness basically saying "nyeh nyeh come and get us feds".

Such terrorism.

Criminal law forbids reasoning per analogy. You can't say something isn't terrorism because other instances of terrorism are worse. In this case, the armed gang of marauders, however small their actions may be, fulfil all the requirements of domestic terrorism. Whether or not they actually performed acts of domestic terrorism is for a judge to decide. They fit the bill, however. The worst instances of a fact do not determine the boundaries of such a fact.

[Ifreann]

Clearly the US police need their own reaper drones to clear out these moochers safely.

But they might shoot down the drones. Clearly the police need low orbit ion cannons.

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Yes, pretty much.

There's a word for it. It's called "treason", not "terrorism". Bundy and his bunch of assholes aren't trying to instill fear in anyone - they're trying to seize territory of the United States by force of arms, while being citizens of same.

The two aren't mutually exclusive.

---

What of it?

Well, its hardly the pentagon.

I would just leave them to it until they realised they where being ignored.

It doesn't do to ignore such blatant criminality.

Though now that I think of it, I do like the idea of letting them get bored and leave, then arresting them safely, without any stand-offs or shoot-outs, from their homes and places of work.

[Ragnarum]

Well, its hardly the pentagon.

I would just leave them to it until they realised they where being ignored.

Or attracted more yahoos, them decided they needed a bit more space, and so on and so forth.

No. Nip it in the bud. Appeasement is almost never the right policy.

No, just ignore them.

Let them destroy whatever they like to try and make a point. If more of them come, still ignore them. They are hardly a threat to the public. If they become a threat to the public, people will no longer join them.
Give them zero attention. Not worth the resources.

Well, its hardly the pentagon.

I would just leave them to it until they realised they where being ignored.

It doesn't do to ignore such blatant criminality.

Yes it does.