Mass Shooting in California, 20 victims

[Wdkckms]

In Europe, despite a recent cluster of attacks by radical jihadists, it looks like most are carried out by separatist groups. That was my entire point. I wasn't talking about anywhere else, so I'm not sure why you chose to bring up worldwide statistics. Finally, I think that we're getting a little off track.

From which date do you count? If you consider the last 50 years than yes, but I am speaking about now about the present. If you see the list almost all are caused by Islam, the only separatis group I notices here are the East Ukrainian rebels and the UCK who are also Islamists at the same time (it is an Albanian army).

[Yumyumsuppertime]

In Europe, despite a recent cluster of attacks by radical jihadists, it looks like most are carried out by separatist groups. That was my entire point. I wasn't talking about anywhere else, so I'm not sure why you chose to bring up worldwide statistics. Finally, I think that we're getting a little off track.

From which date do you count? If you consider the last 50 years than yes, but I am speaking about now about the present. If you see the list almost all are caused by Islam, the only separatis group I notices here are the East Ukrainian rebels and the UCK who are also Islamists at the same time (it is an Albanian army).

I believe that I said that we were getting off track. If you want to continue the topic, feel free to create a thread on it. I may or may not decide to participate, but I'll at least give my answer to that.

[Wdkckms]

The list is incomplete. How about the daily terrorist attacks the US Air Force and its Allies are organizing in the Middle East since 2001?

Making war is not the same as terrorism, I would rather also have that Islam declares us officially war instead of cowardly attacking civilians. Note this are carries by muslims living in Europe.

[Wdkckms]

I believe that I said that we were getting off track. If you want to continue the topic, feel free to create a thread on it. I may or may not decide to participate, but I'll at least give my answer to that.

Since were are speaking about the present than yes it was caused by Islam. The list also prooves my point. Today, separatist attacks are non-existend today in western europe. This is my conslusion and answer.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

I believe that I said that we were getting off track. If you want to continue the topic, feel free to create a thread on it. I may or may not decide to participate, but I'll at least give my answer to that.

Since were are speaking about the present than yes it was caused by Islam. The list also prooves my point. Today, separatist attacks are non-existend today in western europe. This is my conslusion and answer.

My point is that this has nothing to do with the shooting in San Bernadino. Either start another thread to cover terrorism in Europe, or move on.

[The Lone Alliance]

"freedom"

Just the cycle of revenge.
Sadly it seems radical Islam is under the belief that doing the same thing over and over again will eventually make it end.

[Wdkckms]

My point is that this has nothing to do with the shooting in San Bernadino. Either start another thread to cover terrorism in Europe, or move on.

You asked for this:

Source that most terrorist attacks in Europe are carried out by Muslims? The numbers I've seen don't indicate that at all, but you may have a more objective source than I do.

Well, if you think what I sourced has nothing to do with San Bernadino, than ok. The US has not many Muslims so it is understandable that it is peacefull for now.

[Wallenburg]

My point is that this has nothing to do with the shooting in San Bernadino. Either start another thread to cover terrorism in Europe, or move on.

You asked for this:

Source that most terrorist attacks in Europe are carried out by Muslims? The numbers I've seen don't indicate that at all, but you may have a more objective source than I do.

Well, if you think what I sourced has nothing to do with San Bernadino, than ok. The US has not many Muslims so it is understandable that it is peacefull for now.

The US peaceful?

[Murovanka]

The list is incomplete. How about the daily terrorist attacks the US Air Force and its Allies are organizing in the Middle East since 2001?

Making war is not the same as terrorism, I would rather also have that Islam declares us officially war instead of cowardly attacking civilians. Note this are carries by muslims living in Europe.

So when we kill their civilians, it's "making war" and "collateral damage" but when they kill ours it's terrorism?

How is it that Islam is to blame? So I Christianity is to blame for the attack on the abortion clinic?

"freedom"

Just the cycle of revenge.
Sadly it seems radical Islam is under the belief that doing the same thing over and over again will eventually make the west stop killing them.

Sadly it seems that the West is under the belief that doing the same thing over and over again will eventually make radical Islam stop "terrorizing" them.

[Natapoc]

This must have been difficult: Apparently their family was initially worried that they may have been victims of the shooting and it was not until the media got a hold of them that they realized that Syed Rizwan Farook, and Tashfeen Malik were actually the suspected attackers.

Shooting suspects left their baby with her grandmother, spokesman says

"The suspects in the shooting rampage were a married couple of who had just dropped off their 6-month-old daughter with a grandmother, family representatives said.

Syed Rizwan Farook, 28, and Tashfeen Malik, 27, were married two years ago, according to Malik’s brother, Farhan Khan, shown above.

On Wednesday morning, Farook and his wife dropped their daughter off with Farook’s mother in Redlands, saying they had a doctor’s appointment, said Hussam Ayloush, executive director of the Council on American-Islamic Relations’ Los Angeles office.

The grandmother grew worried when she heard of the shooting attack in San Bernardino, and “she started calling. No answer,” Ayloush said.

The family was worried the couple were shot in the attacks, but then they started receiving calls from media outlets indicating Farook was a person of interest.

Farook was born in Illinois, and his parents immigrated to the U.S. from Southeast Asia, Ayloush said."

[The Lone Alliance]

Sadly it seems that the West is under the belief that doing the same thing over and over again will eventually make radical Islam stop "terrorizing" them.

Yet it will continue.

The bodies pile up without end in a war that neither side can win,
Yet peace is impossible, both ideas are incomptable with the other and some wish an endless war to justify their existence

It's all so depressing, and if this shooting is part of it, then it's just another statistic to the powers that be, that's already how it's being treated in some cases.

The whole thing is depressing.

[Wallenburg]

This must have been difficult: Apparently their family was initially worried that they may have been victims of the shooting and it was not until the media got a hold of them that they realized that Syed Rizwan Farook, and Tashfeen Malik were actually the suspected attackers.

Shooting suspects left their baby with her grandmother, spokesman says

"The suspects in the shooting rampage were a married couple of who had just dropped off their 6-month-old daughter with a grandmother, family representatives said.

Syed Rizwan Farook, 28, and Tashfeen Malik, 27, were married two years ago, according to Malik’s brother, Farhan Khan, shown above.

On Wednesday morning, Farook and his wife dropped their daughter off with Farook’s mother in Redlands, saying they had a doctor’s appointment, said Hussam Ayloush, executive director of the Council on American-Islamic Relations’ Los Angeles office.

The grandmother grew worried when she heard of the shooting attack in San Bernardino, and “she started calling. No answer,” Ayloush said.

The family was worried the couple were shot in the attacks, but then they started receiving calls from media outlets indicating Farook was a person of interest.

Farook was born in Illinois, and his parents immigrated to the U.S. from Southeast Asia, Ayloush said."

This just in: Illinois is a province in Syria, and "Southeast Asia" is the name of a secret terrorist organization.

[AiliailiA]

The suspects seems to be migrated to the US from somwhere else. Not shocking at all.

Odd that you find that to be the likeliest scenario for a mass shooting, as statistics show that white males are responsible for such actions.

It would be surprising if it was otherwise, as most murderers of any kind are men, and whites are the majority.

Interesting tidbit there though:

"If you look at the whole list, it turns out that whites and blacks are pretty proportionate to their population, very close," said Dave Cullen, author of the book "Columbine," which tells the story of the 1999 massacre at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado. Harris and Klebold, the shooters there, were white.

Historically, Latinos and Asians have been the exception.

The Virginia Tech massacre was carried out by Seung-Hui Cho, who was born in South Korea.

"Latinos are almost nowhere to be seen," Cullen told CNN's "New Day." "Asians continue to be heavily overrepresented -- more than 2½ times their size in the population."

Whites make up about 63% of the U.S. population, blacks 13%, and Asians 5%, according to the latest census numbers. Latinos account for some 17% of the total population.

Unlike common murder ... in which Hispanics commit slightly more than non-Hispanic whites though less than Blacks, and Asians are very unlikely to commit murder.
The figures are a bit sketchy (FBI didn't even collect ethnic background info until 2013) but it's clear that common murder and mass shootings have a different perpetrator profile.

[Gauthier]

This must have been difficult: Apparently their family was initially worried that they may have been victims of the shooting and it was not until the media got a hold of them that they realized that Syed Rizwan Farook, and Tashfeen Malik were actually the suspected attackers.

Shooting suspects left their baby with her grandmother, spokesman says

"The suspects in the shooting rampage were a married couple of who had just dropped off their 6-month-old daughter with a grandmother, family representatives said.

Syed Rizwan Farook, 28, and Tashfeen Malik, 27, were married two years ago, according to Malik’s brother, Farhan Khan, shown above.

On Wednesday morning, Farook and his wife dropped their daughter off with Farook’s mother in Redlands, saying they had a doctor’s appointment, said Hussam Ayloush, executive director of the Council on American-Islamic Relations’ Los Angeles office.

The grandmother grew worried when she heard of the shooting attack in San Bernardino, and “she started calling. No answer,” Ayloush said.

The family was worried the couple were shot in the attacks, but then they started receiving calls from media outlets indicating Farook was a person of interest.

Farook was born in Illinois, and his parents immigrated to the U.S. from Southeast Asia, Ayloush said."

This just in: Illinois is a province in Syria, and "Southeast Asia" is the name of a secret terrorist organization.

So when they're saying close off immigration from Syria, they mean "Wall off the Great Lakes Area".

[Natapoc]

This just in: Illinois is a province in Syria, and "Southeast Asia" is the name of a secret terrorist organization.

So when they're saying close off immigration from Syria, they mean "Wall off the Great Lakes Area".

Ted Cruz just said that when he becomes president, he'll appoint Donald trump to build a wall around the great lakes to keep america safe.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

So when they're saying close off immigration from Syria, they mean "Wall off the Great Lakes Area".

Ted Cruz just said that when he becomes president, he'll appoint Donald trump to build a wall around the great lakes to keep america safe.

Good. It's not like we need the Great Lakes area anyways.

[The Lone Alliance]

Ted Cruz just said that when he becomes president, he'll appoint Donald trump to build a wall around the great lakes to keep america safe.

Seeing how that would require closing any city or town hugging the lakes I wouldn't joke about it.
I'm sure a few Republicans would love to wall off Chicago and Detroit.

[Murovanka]

Sadly it seems that the West is under the belief that doing the same thing over and over again will eventually make radical Islam stop "terrorizing" them.

Yet it will continue.

The bodies pile up without end in a war that neither side can win,
Yet peace is impossible, both ideas are incomptable with the other and some wish an endless war to justify their existence

It's all so depressing, and if this shooting is part of it, then it's just another statistic to the powers that be, that's already how it's being treated in some cases.

The whole thing is depressing.

Yes Islamism and Islamic fundamentalism are incompatible with our western values, but peace is not impossible. I believe that the biggest driver of these radical movements are- the West itself.

Think about it. The oil that we buy en masse from the Gulf gives Saudi Arabia all the money it needs to propagate its fundamentalist version of Islam, the basis of many Islamist groups, all over the world. A party in our neighbouring Malaysia (live in Singapore) is pushing for the implementation of the Hudud laws, and they might actually manage to make it law. Secondly, the US is actively instigating sectarian violence and chaos. Syrian rebels, who turned out to consist of a lot of radicals and Al-Qaeda affiliates, were supplied by the CIA and the Brits (Why? Trace the oil, or the pipes they flow through). These Sunni extremists are helped by Turkey, who also happen to be supporting ISIS. Finally, the US cannot seem to get rid of its obsession with bombing the Middle East with air strikes and drone strikes, and unfortunately there is no way of avoiding civilian casualties (not that military officers care about that anyway). And then we wonder how these "false representatives of Islam" get so much support.

So why is the West driving this conflict? Eventually, I think, it comes down to oil and access to it. Look at the article, there was one advisory report which stated that support for extremist groups and instigating sectarian violence could prove to be beneficial to the West. The conflict could be stopped, but when you mix in geopolitics into it the lines become a little muddled.

[Gravlen]

I believe that I said that we were getting off track. If you want to continue the topic, feel free to create a thread on it. I may or may not decide to participate, but I'll at least give my answer to that.

Since were are speaking about the present than yes it was caused by Islam. The list also prooves my point. Today, separatist attacks are non-existend today in western europe. This is my conslusion and answer.

Your conclusion is false, and your answer is wrong.

A total of 152 terrorist attacks occurred in five EU Member States. The majority took place in France (63), Spain (33) and the UK (35).1 After an increase in 2012, the number of terrorist attacks in 2013 fell below the number recorded in 2011. As in previous years, the majority of attacks can be attributed to separatist terrorism. The number of attacks related to left-wing and anarchist terrorism rose in 2013, thereby ending the downward trend observed in previous years.

https://www.europol.europa.eu/content/te-sat-2014-european-union-terrorism-situation-and-trend-report-2014


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_the_European_Union

[Alyakia]

so do we actually know anything about what happened or why yet

[Second Blazing]

so do we actually know anything about what happened or why yet

The fact that there were multiple suspects and they tried to get away says wasn't a tps report released incident of workplace violence. That and how the American Islamic center said its madness not jihad,probably points to it being jihad.

[Kilobugya]

How many such terrible tragedies will the US need before it bans guns ?

[Second Blazing]

How many such terrible tragedies will the US need before it bans guns ?

You want to see an end to Sandy hook style ahootigs? Label them terrorist attacks and prevent the media from getting ahold of the perpetrator's name and picture. They get weeks of coverage, their entire lives dissected and examined on national TV and plastered across the internet for the world to see. The people who do those types of attacks are social outcasts, who are almost completely isolated and have been abused by society in someway and because they are alone, that anger and bitterness has no where to go besides build until they snap. They want people to know who they are, why they did what they did.

You want to end those types of tragedies, tackle the root causes not the tools.

[Teemant]

Since were are speaking about the present than yes it was caused by Islam. The list also prooves my point. Today, separatist attacks are non-existend today in western europe. This is my conslusion and answer.

Your conclusion is false, and your answer is wrong.

A total of 152 terrorist attacks occurred in five EU Member States. The majority took place in France (63), Spain (33) and the UK (35).1 After an increase in 2012, the number of terrorist attacks in 2013 fell below the number recorded in 2011. As in previous years, the majority of attacks can be attributed to separatist terrorism. The number of attacks related to left-wing and anarchist terrorism rose in 2013, thereby ending the downward trend observed in previous years.

https://www.europol.europa.eu/content/te-sat-2014-european-union-terrorism-situation-and-trend-report-2014


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_the_European_Union

This is based on 2012-2013 numbers.
In this report is said that in at least two attacks which were not classified as religiously inspired terrorism the religious radicalization is evident. So religious terrorism is not called religious terrorism?
Also this report shows that religious terrorism is rising every year.

You posted terrorist attack graph but why didn't you post the arrest graph that was next to it? The most arrests are related to religious terrorism. According to arrests it seems that there would be a lot more religious terrorism if it wasn't prevented by police.

So the trend is that religious terrorism is increasing and there are less separatist terrorism each year. I think that 2014 and 2015 statistics would show increased number of religious terrorism.

[Allet Klar Chefs]

so do we actually know anything about what happened or why yet

Yeah they were married and the guy spazzed out at some kind of work do earlier in the day, not that the "why" really matters.