Santa Should be Banned

[New DeCapito]

In part, I agree with the OP, albeit for different reasons. I'll be firmly in the minority but I think Christmas ought to be about Christ and celebrating Him and the message he brought into the world. If you don't believe in any of that, or don't wish to observance any religious element, that's fine but don't secularize it: just don't celebrate it.

I think Christmas, even from a secular point of view, is massively over-commercialized. It's no longer about Christ, it's not even about being together with family and friends anymore: it has become about showing your kids how much you love them by emptying your bank account. Even if you're a parent who wishes to steer well clear of that element, the commercials your kids see and the peer pressure from friends will inevitably drive that element of "spend to show love" in your child. It's so ridiculous that Christmas now seems to last for 2 months; 3 if you include January sales! When I was a kid, decorations and the whole Christmas season began days (maybe a week at most) before Christmas and ended on 6 January.

Perhaps "Christmas" as the majority in the US and the West currently celebrate it ought to become a Thanksgiving II and leave Christmas to the Christians. After all, we don't secularize Hanukkah, Diwali or Ramadan. We just don't celebrate them if we don't believe in the message behind them or practice the faith they're apart.

Forget Santa Claus altogether. A Christian holiday should be all or nothing: celebrate it for what it is or don't celebrate it.

You do realise that both the 'winter solstice" celebration and the precursor character of Santa predate christianity I hope ?
So if you want to keep the feast pure, it is Christ who should be removed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas#History

Can I talk about Saturnalia, and Jesus' birth being celebrated on January 6th around that time? It's not just pagans.

[New DeCapito]

Well, we still have religious people. Ergo, childish beliefs only strengthen with age.

Religion is not a childish belief.

That depends. If you were taught to be religious as a child, and believe in religions just because you don't know what else there is, then yes, it is childish.

[Saskisdi]

Who are you to ruin tradition of telling tales about a fictional character?


I might be late, but I can still make a good point.
*reads through different pages of thread*
Well, almost all the good points have been taken, so I rest my case. Well, maybe not rest, but...I dunno, I'll give it my best shot.
I might be repeating some others, but, as a Civil Rights Activist, I can immediately say that banning Santa Claus from books, and oral traditions, is a violation of human rights. It's all on the parents on how they choose to tell their child what is real and what is not, and if it isn't real, let them be the ones to decide how they let their children know, because I can tell you this much, if a ban on Santa was en-acted, parents and children would freak out.

Another thing, a ban on Santa would have a heavy impact on many companies. One of which, might be Coca Cola, seeing as pretty much every Christmas, Coca Cola's cans and bottles feature Santa on the wrapping/can itself. What are they going to put on it then? A red snowman? Or how about a red christmas tree?

A Red Wedding maybe?

[Obexer]

;_;

Be gone old man! We are determining your relevance to our modern age.

[Royal Denmark]

Who are you to ruin tradition of telling tales about a fictional character?


I might be late, but I can still make a good point.
*reads through different pages of thread*
Well, almost all the good points have been taken, so I rest my case. Well, maybe not rest, but...I dunno, I'll give it my best shot.
I might be repeating some others, but, as a Civil Rights Activist, I can immediately say that banning Santa Claus from books, and oral traditions, is a violation of human rights. It's all on the parents on how they choose to tell their child what is real and what is not, and if it isn't real, let them be the ones to decide how they let their children know, because I can tell you this much, if a ban on Santa was en-acted, parents and children would freak out.

Another thing, a ban on Santa would have a heavy impact on many companies. One of which, might be Coca Cola, seeing as pretty much every Christmas, Coca Cola's cans and bottles feature Santa on the wrapping/can itself. What are they going to put on it then? A red snowman? Or how about a red christmas tree?

A Red Wedding maybe?

RED ROBIN

[Saskisdi]

A Red Wedding maybe?

RED ROBIN

yum

[Saskisdi]

A point was brought up earlier in this thread that I would like to add onto. The fact is that it is impossible to regulate an idea short of regulating what people think in general. Totally banning Santa Claus, whether the benefits are real or not, means that we have lost the right to personal freedom. Cults, religious sects, and certain ideas may be given flak, but they aren't outright banned because that would be the sincerest violation of our rights as citizens of our countries. What you are proposing is a totalitarian police state that regulates people's thoughts and actions. If our rights can be violated so much as to ban Santa Claus, why not ban other "undesirable" things? Why not do away with religion, dissent, and My Little Pony? (*delighted murmuring through the audience* OH SHUT UP; IT'S TO MAKE A POINT.) Look, what you're proposing is thought-crime in its most basic form, and the most complete violation of not just American rights, but human rights in general. In the end, it doesn't matter what you're proposing, because if you're proposing the criminalization of an idea then the result is the same.

repost because spam made no one see it

[Bermon]

Is believing in Santa Claus really such a threat to society and to a child's health that it necessitates violating an individual's most basic rights? "Santa Claus sets a bad example so lets ban him outright", that's like banning Thanksgiving because it promotes gluttony. You're talking about throwing the constitution out the window, I am pretty sure that would have greater consequences than allowing children to believe in Santa. Why not focus on banning something that will actually benefit the populace like getting rid of cigarettes?

This is all just so ridiculous. Talk about excessive!

[New DeCapito]

Is believing in Santa Claus really such a threat to society and to a child's health that it necessitates violating an individual's most basic rights? "Santa Claus sets a bad example so lets ban him outright", that's like banning Thanksgiving because it promotes gluttony. You're talking about throwing the constitution out the window, I am pretty sure that would have greater consequences than allowing children to believe in Santa. Why not focus on banning something that will actually benefit the populace like getting rid of cigarettes?

This is all just so ridiculous. Talk about excessive!

The reason we cannot outright ban cigarettes everywhere is because:
1. Everyone who was buying the things will have to get them illegally.
2. The companies making them are sponsoring the people making the rules about them.
Good luck.

EDIT: Then again, I was thinking of a chemical you could add after production which would make the smoker vomit after smoking excessively.

[Bermon]

Is believing in Santa Claus really such a threat to society and to a child's health that it necessitates violating an individual's most basic rights? "Santa Claus sets a bad example so lets ban him outright", that's like banning Thanksgiving because it promotes gluttony. You're talking about throwing the constitution out the window, I am pretty sure that would have greater consequences than allowing children to believe in Santa. Why not focus on banning something that will actually benefit the populace like getting rid of cigarettes?

This is all just so ridiculous. Talk about excessive!

The reason we cannot outright ban cigarettes everywhere is because:
1. Everyone who was buying the things will have to get them illegally.
2. The companies making them are sponsoring the people making the rules about them.
Good luck.

I don't support a ban on cigarettes. Banning things is never an effective form of regulation. I am saying that if the OP wants a ban it should actually be on something that is a problem. Santa Claus is not a problem.

[Gauthier]

Santa Claus is an old man who has children sit on his lap in exchange for gifts. Clearly he's a child molestor who needs to be put away. Why stop at Jerry Sandusky?

[New DeCapito]

The reason we cannot outright ban cigarettes everywhere is because:
1. Everyone who was buying the things will have to get them illegally.
2. The companies making them are sponsoring the people making the rules about them.
Good luck.

I don't support a ban on cigarettes. Banning things is never an effective form of regulation. I am saying that if the OP wants a ban it should actually be on something that is a problem. Santa Claus is not a problem.

You do make a good point.

[Saskisdi]

Santa Claus is an old man who has children sit on his lap in exchange for gifts. Clearly he's a child molestor who needs to be put away. Why stop at Jerry Sandusky?

The lap sitting is a mall-santa-only thing. If anything, they should require background checks on all mall Santa applicants, if they don't already.
We wouldn't want someone to get mall-ested, now would we?

[Immoren]

Clearly Santa should be replaced with the Hogfather.

[Conscentia]

Don't support a ban, do support scrapping the whole lying to children thing.

I concur.

[Conscentia]

Clearly Santa should be replaced with the Hogfather.

Is it worth watching the adaptation of that?

[Immoren]

Clearly Santa should be replaced with the Hogfather.

Is it worth watching the adaptation of that?

I liked the TV-movie adaption, and it's apparently thought to be best of the adaptations, but then again I like many things that others have dismissed as trash.

[New DeCapito]

Clearly Santa should be replaced with the Hogfather.

Yes, and we need an anthropomorphic personification to be Death, and Death should occasionally give up his job to work on a farm...
The Discworld doesn't make such a good real world.

[The Jaclean Empire]

No, just no.

[New Carloso]

Oh... didn't know there were two of you now.

[Republic of the Cristo]

The cultural custom of Santa Claus is unethical and counterproductive to the greater good. It is not only wrong to teach children to believe in the existence of a fictional character, it sets up an unhealthy mindset lacking in skepticism. But more concerningly, an immoral and criminal character is being glorified as a benevolent figure of goodness. A character who spies on people without their knowledge or consent (stalking), a character who breaks into people's houses (breaking and entering).

Some may handwave this criminal behaviour away by saying Santa gives gifts. But it's a cruel lie. A cruel lie that normalizes the act of parents lying to their own children. Surely it would be more healthy for children to be aware of having recieved gifts from their parents than to be told it came from a stalker with a habit of breaking into people's houses at night. This cultural custom skews the moral compass of children by teaching them to be good for the sake of a reward, normalizes lying, promotes an unhealthy mindset detached from fact-checking, and glorifies an individual who would be despised if anyone else were to partake in those criminal actions like stalking and breaking and entering.

We can celebrate the holidays without Santa in it. The cultural practice of Santa Claus should be done away with, perhaps going so far as a ban if that's what it takes. Thoughts?

Your trolling right?

[Immoren]

Clearly Santa should be replaced with the Hogfather.

Yes, and we need an anthropomorphic personification to be Death, and Death should occasionally give up his job to work on a farm...
The Discworld doesn't make such a good real world.

Neither does real world. *nods*

[New DeCapito]

Yes, and we need an anthropomorphic personification to be Death, and Death should occasionally give up his job to work on a farm...
The Discworld doesn't make such a good real world.

Neither does real world. *nods*

Well, go find me some octiron and I'll make your magic world. Until then, the real world will suffice.

[Omega America II]

I don't really see how it causes a problem. A kid matures and eventually learns the truth anyways. No harm is really done.

[Omega America II]

I don't really see how it causes a problem. A kid matures and eventually learns the truth anyways. No harm is really done.

Plus, I mean, it's meant to kinda give kids something to believe in, something to make them behave and be happy. Really, banning it would be breaking people's right to believe in what they wish.