It's time for leftists to wake up before they destroy Europe

[Ostroeuropa]

I want to known by what mechanism you think Islamic communities are magically better than western ones on these issues. I had no idea the middle east was such a bastion of women and LGBT rights so as to cause their culture to be ahead of ours in those respects.

A claim I have never put forward and never tried to put forward.

Thereby I'm going make make a claim that I rarely do - that you're putting down a strawman argument, Ostro.

So you accept that, in fact, women and minorities are in danger of abuse when passing through muslim majority areas?

[Imperializt Russia]

Begging the question a smidgen aren't we?

Yes. I believe they face similar risks in other areas as well and that the difference in what risk is faced is superficial at best.
Unless you can demonstrate to me otherwise, which you seemed to say that you couldn't.

[Greater Hunnia]

The mockery in your responses is completely irrelevant. As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one. You will be all right, after all, these rapefugees are normal people just like anyone else...

[Saiwania]

Do you have any evidence that this was more than like five people ever?

The constant making of excuses for Muslim immigrants at the expense of regular European citizens show that leftists on more on the immigrants' side than they are of Europeans who unfortunately made the mistake of voting them into power repeatedly. If the right ever sweeps Europe and fully takes over, the left should be prosecuted for treason.

I do not object to people having left wing policies by itself- such as wanting higher taxes for example. But what I do take exception to are the policies which intentionally set out to destroy Europe through the imposition of cultural Marxism. An example being the mass immigration which will change the UK into a nation which is majority non-Briton within our lifetime.

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/3 ... of_britain

[Ostroeuropa]

Begging the question a smidgen aren't we?

Yes. I believe they face similar risks in other areas as well and that the difference in what risk is faced is superficial at best.
Unless you can demonstrate to me otherwise, which you seemed to say that you couldn't.

Alright, so let's move on to your actual claim.

Can you explain the mechanism by which you suppose that participants of cultures which have not had an ongoing discussion of gender and sexual equality in a democratic society would be our moral equals on these issues?

Let me point out, that western european society has significant atheist and agnostic populations. I do not deny that a wholly christian community would likewise see an upswing in crime, including sexual crime, as statistics tend to indicate, though I would be skeptical that it would be as large a difference as islamic communities (Unless these christian communities were, for instance, eastern european or a similar in lacking a modern dialogue on these issues.)


You shy away from the claim they are our betters, and so accept it occurs.
I would like to know on what basis you claim they are our equals on it.

The mechanism for the opposite seems abundantly clear to me.
Their culture and their religion has not had the modernizing influences ours has had, and as a result of ghettoization and segregation of the communities, they are isolated from modern sentiments and backward in their practices.

Does non-muslim western society have a problem with female genital mutilation?
Or honor killing?

It is ridiculous to pretend these communities do not have significant problems with backwardness.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

The mockery in your responses is completely irrelevant. As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one. You will be all right, after all, these rapefugees are normal people just like anyone else...

I'll take you up on that challenge.

[Imperializt Russia]

The mockery in your responses is completely irrelevant. As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one. You will be all right, after all, these rapefugees are normal people just like anyone else...

I used to, frequently. I have only ever felt in fear, whether at home or at university, from whites.

[Imperializt Russia]

Begging the question a smidgen aren't we?

Yes. I believe they face similar risks in other areas as well and that the difference in what risk is faced is superficial at best.
Unless you can demonstrate to me otherwise, which you seemed to say that you couldn't.

Alright, so let's move on to your actual claim.

Can you explain the mechanism by which you suppose that participants of cultures which have not had an ongoing discussion of gender and sexual equality in a democratic society would be our moral equals on these issues?

Let me point out, that western european society has significant atheist and agnostic populations. I do not deny that a wholly christian community would likewise see an upswing in crime, including sexual crime, as statistics tend to indicate, though I would be skeptical that it would be as large a difference as islamic communities (Unless these christian communities were, for instance, eastern european or a similar in lacking a modern dialogue on these issues.)


You shy away from the claim they are our betters, and so accept it occurs.
I would like to know on what basis you claim they are our equals on it.

The mechanism for the opposite seems abundantly clear to me.

This is another claim I haven't made.

I don't believe it matters.

[Ostroeuropa]

Alright, so let's move on to your actual claim.

Can you explain the mechanism by which you suppose that participants of cultures which have not had an ongoing discussion of gender and sexual equality in a democratic society would be our moral equals on these issues?

Let me point out, that western european society has significant atheist and agnostic populations. I do not deny that a wholly christian community would likewise see an upswing in crime, including sexual crime, as statistics tend to indicate, though I would be skeptical that it would be as large a difference as islamic communities (Unless these christian communities were, for instance, eastern european or a similar in lacking a modern dialogue on these issues.)


You shy away from the claim they are our betters, and so accept it occurs.
I would like to know on what basis you claim they are our equals on it.

The mechanism for the opposite seems abundantly clear to me.

This is another claim I haven't made.

I don't believe it matters.

In what sense doesn't it matter?

[Alsheb]

The mockery in your responses is completely irrelevant. As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one. You will be all right, after all, these rapefugees are normal people just like anyone else...

It won't make much difference walking there or in a standard pious christian town in Eastern Europe. Many people might not approve, but the chances of anything happening are tiny.

[Imperializt Russia]

This is another claim I haven't made.

I don't believe it matters.

In what sense doesn't it matter?

Because areas populated mostly by poor whites have similar attitude problems, though superficially different.
That recent Muslim immigrants don't hold "western values" (also not held by sizeable proportions of western citizens) should only surprise absolute cretins and is frankly immaterial. When these attitudes result in threatening behaviours up to and including flavours of assault or harassment, that is a crime.

[Ifreann]

The mockery in your responses is completely irrelevant. As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one. You will be all right, after all, these rapefugees are normal people just like anyone else...

Some friends of mine live near a mosque. The worst problem they face is the buses running late.

[Liriena]

As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one.

Been there, done that. Visited Buenos Aires' largest mosque and Islamic centre. Nice people, all in all. Felt safe throughout.

See, Muslims are not a single, monolithic, homogeneous community, all with the same lifestyles and beliefs. Not every Muslim community is a mini-dystopia of pure evil.

Shocking, I know.

Honestly? I'm far more scared of the overwhelmingly Catholic "villas miseria" than I am of our local Muslim population.

[Liriena]

If the right ever sweeps Europe and fully takes over, the left should be prosecuted for treason.

So, you're a fascist and want to relieve the glorious 1930's. Got it.

cultural Marxism.

Ewwwww! A dogwhistle?

[Ifreann]

As I said, I dare you personally, especially if you are a gay person, to take a walk in the nearest muslim-populated place in your city, if you have one.

Been there, done that. Visited Buenos Aires' largest mosque and Islamic centre. Nice people, all in all. Felt safe throughout.

See, Muslims are not a single, monolithic, homogeneous community, with the same lifestyles and beliefs. Not every Muslim community is a mini-dystopia of pure evil.

Shocking, I know.

Honestly? I'm far more scared of the overwhelmingly Catholic "villas miseria" than I am of our local Muslim population.

There are definitely parts of Dublin I wouldn't want to go walking around on my own at night. Can't imagine Muslims would either.

[Haritopia]

Do you have any evidence that this was more than like five people ever?

The constant making of excuses for Muslim immigrants at the expense of regular European citizens show that leftists on more on the immigrants' side than they are of Europeans who unfortunately made the mistake of voting them into power repeatedly. If the right ever sweeps Europe and fully takes over, the left should be prosecuted for treason.

I do not object to people having left wing policies by itself- such as wanting higher taxes for example. But what I do take exception to are the policies which intentionally set out to destroy Europe through the imposition of cultural Marxism. An example being the mass immigration which will change the UK into a nation which is majority non-Briton ethnically speaking within our lifetime.

http://www.thecommentator.com/article/3 ... of_britain

Mass and uncontrolled immigration isn't just to be blamed on the left wing of politics, but on the right one too. Germany's CDU, Britain's Conservatives and so forth, are equally to blame for all of this as their left-wing counterparts. We can not even blame it all on the ghost of "cultural marxism" as the blame again falls partially on globalism and the very nature of uncontrolled capitalism. The outsourcing of jobs inside the country, without the thought of wasting money to help integrate those people, is a part of the agenda to make as much money as possible, hence someone profits from the poor man who came from Africa, to which he will give a smaller loan than to the native which he will either fire or not employ. The immigrant is exploited, the native betrayed, and the nation gained yet another citizen who lost his job and another one who will not become a part of the nationality and culture, the only one that profits there is the capitalist.

I will not blame each employer, as some are decent and caring, but greed exists, and there are such people who wish to exploit everything so they can earn more money.

Shifting the blame to someone specific here is useless, as everyone takes a part of the blame. Are the people who shout "Stop ALL immigration" any better than those on the oppossite side? Who is right?
Simply no one yet both, for both adress correct issues but offer the wrong solutions. Must we stop mass immigration? Yes we must. Do developed countries need immigrated workforce, especially in fields which require high qualifications? Yes, they do.
Thus neither a full stop on immigration nor uncontrolled immigration is the answer, one always solwes one problem but creates another in it's place. The solution is controlled immigration.

Each nation should let only those immigrants in which can fully adapt, and integrate into the culture, life and nationhood there, and of course that that person's field of work is needed in that country. A "foreigner" who is ready to not just work and live as a member of that nation, but also defend it and cherish it, and it's culture, is fully equal to the one born in that country. Now this is mostly a reference to actual immigrants, especially immigrants born in one European country and moving to another. I do not view these refugees as immigrants, as I personally view that they should, once the war quiets down, be deported out of the countries they reside in, if they do not meet the needed criteria to be citizens there, which most don't (count also the fact that they propably themselves want to return home).

In the end, the thread's name should not be "It's time for leftists to wake up before they destroy Europe", but rather "It is time for all Europeans to wake up and save Europe". In the end, left and right, conservative and liberal, atheist, christian and muslim, are just tags and terms, the true divsion is on those who wish to save Europe, it's cultures and values, and those who do not care or even fight agaist those values.

[Gravlen]

If the right ever sweeps Europe and fully takes over, the left should be prosecuted for treason.

So, you're a fascist and want to relieve the glorious 1930's. Got it.

cultural Marxism.

Ewwwww! A dogwhistle?

Cultural Marxism n. 1. A meaningless phrase used to signal that the writer or speaker has no idea what he or she is talking about.

[Legitimists]

So, you're a fascist and want to relieve the glorious 1930's. Got it.


Ewwwww! A dogwhistle?

Cultural Marxism n. 1. A meaningless phrase used to signal that the writer or speaker has no idea what he or she is talking about.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Frankfurt_School

A good overview. Though it's not what the specific people in this thread seem to be talking about. Here it is simply the fact that extremists on both sides of the political spectrum often resort to conspiratorial forces, or make very hackhanded cultural criticism in order to justify there position.

[Greater Hunnia]

So, you're a fascist and want to relieve the glorious 1930's. Got it.


Ewwwww! A dogwhistle?

Cultural Marxism n. 1. A meaningless phrase used to signal that the writer or speaker has no idea what he or she is talking about.

So it's basically like "racism", "xenophobia", "islamophobia", "homophobia", "bigot(ry)", "transophobia", "fatphopbia", "fascist" (as an insult)?

[Liriena]

Cultural Marxism n. 1. A meaningless phrase used to signal that the writer or speaker has no idea what he or she is talking about.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Frankfurt_School

I read their works. Hardly the scary SJW boogeymen reactionaries make them out to be. Mosly Marxists disillusioned with the aftermath of the Enlightenment and the liberal revolutions.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Cultural Marxism n. 1. A meaningless phrase used to signal that the writer or speaker has no idea what he or she is talking about.

So it's basically like "racism", "xenophobia", "islamophobia", "homophobia", "bigot(ry)", "transophobia", "fatphopbia", "fascist" (as an insult)?

Those are traits people who say cultural Marxism tend to possess, yes.

[Liriena]

Cultural Marxism n. 1. A meaningless phrase used to signal that the writer or speaker has no idea what he or she is talking about.

So it's basically like "racism", "xenophobia", "islamophobia", "homophobia", "bigot(ry)", "transophobia", "fatphopbia", "fascist" (as an insult)?

Not really. Those words can be misused, but they are not inherently vacuous.

[Greater Hunnia]

So it's basically like "racism", "xenophobia", "islamophobia", "homophobia", "bigot(ry)", "transophobia", "fatphopbia", "fascist" (as an insult)?

Not really. Those words can be misused, but they are not inherently vacuous.

Of course.

[Liriena]

Not really. Those words can be misused, but they are not inherently vacuous.

Of course.

"Cultural Marxism", on the other hand, is pretty vacuous, in light of the fact that the works of the Frankfurt School, the people most regularly accused by reactionaries of creating "cultural Marxism", never really proposed any sort of evil Marxist conspiracy to destroy Western civilization through gayness, crossdressing in primary schools and white genocide.

[Ifreann]

Of course.

"Cultural Marxism", on the other hand, is pretty vacuous, in light of the fact that the works of the Frankfurt School, the people most regularly accused by reactionaries of creating "cultural Marxism", never really proposed any sort of evil Marxist conspiracy to destroy Western civilization through gayness, crossdressing in primary schools and white genocide.

Everyone knows that Marx did all of his writing in a little black dress and frilly lingerie.