NationStates' Transgender Thread II

[FelrikTheDeleted]

I just found out that 1/5 trans people get assaulted with weapon in Australia. Guess I have to learn a martial art then.

I'm rather sceptical of that statistic. Source?
( I find that I wouldn't be surprised; Australia is rather conservative, too conservative for my taste.)

[Socialist Tera]

I just found out that 1/5 trans people get assaulted with weapon in Australia. Guess I have to learn a martial art then.

I'm rather sceptical of that statistic. Source?
( I find that I wouldn't be surprised; Australia is rather conservative, too conservative for my taste.)

It's a PDF so I can't link it. Google transgender assault rates Australia and it is the link provided by aph.gov.au

[Socialist Tera]

I just found out that 1/5 trans people get assaulted with weapon in Australia. Guess I have to learn a martial art then.

If it is an assault with a weapon, you'd be better off running away or carrying a weapon yourself, there's hardly any use trying to fight someone armed when you're not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFuN9Vb2Gos

Weapon laws in Australia make it tough to carry a weapon. I would have to conceal a switchblade, even then if it is for weapons purposes I might be jailed for it.

[FelrikTheDeleted]

I'm rather sceptical of that statistic. Source?
( I find that I wouldn't be surprised; Australia is rather conservative, too conservative for my taste.)

It's a PDF do I can't link it. Google transgender assault rates Australia and it is the link provided by aph.gov.au

Cheers.

[United Marxist Nations]

If it is an assault with a weapon, you'd be better off running away or carrying a weapon yourself, there's hardly any use trying to fight someone armed when you're not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFuN9Vb2Gos

Weapon laws in Australia make it tough to carry a weapon. I would have to conceal a switchblade, even then if it is for weapons purposes I might be jailed for it.

Then carry something like an umbrella or mace, because seriously, something like martial arts isn't going to cut it against a guy with a knife, especially for a girl. It would not be advisable to stand and fight.

[Socialist Tera]

Weapon laws in Australia make it tough to carry a weapon. I would have to conceal a switchblade, even then if it is for weapons purposes I might be jailed for it.

Then carry something like an umbrella or mace, because seriously, something like martial arts isn't going to cut it against a guy with a knife, especially for a girl. It would not be advisable to stand and fight.

Mace is illegal...

[United Marxist Nations]

Then carry something like an umbrella or mace, because seriously, something like martial arts isn't going to cut it against a guy with a knife, especially for a girl. It would not be advisable to stand and fight.

Mace is illegal...

God, Australia really is awful, how the hell do they expect you to defend yourself?

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Then carry something like an umbrella or mace, because seriously, something like martial arts isn't going to cut it against a guy with a knife, especially for a girl. It would not be advisable to stand and fight.

Mace is illegal...

Umbrella?
Poke them to death?

[Aphryss]

Real talk, though; I don't understand why you keep picking fights with the conservatives. You've gotta know you're not going to change their minds, right? They're wrong, sure, but the world has enough wrong people in it that - even if by some miracle you change one person's mind in an internet message board - there are still millions out there, and if you try to argue them into changing their minds you'll only die tired.

I think the mistake your making is that you think I'm actually trying to change anyones mind.

Then what are you doing? Because I really don't understand what you get out of it.

Weapon laws in Australia make it tough to carry a weapon. I would have to conceal a switchblade, even then if it is for weapons purposes I might be jailed for it.

Then carry something like an umbrella or mace, because seriously, something like martial arts isn't going to cut it against a guy with a knife, especially for a girl. It would not be advisable to stand and fight.

Weapons laws in New Zealand are even more ridiculous, really; basically, anything you carry with the intent of using it to defend yourself is considered a weapon, and thus if you defend yourself with it it's considered assault with a weapon. If you defend yourself. Needless to say, I think this is going too far. You're legally expected to flee a violent altercation, and I think that's reasonable, but it's also not always possible, and so there needs to be some provision to get assailants to back off. I'd support the legalization of mace, personally.

I also have the strangest sense of deja vu, like this has come up before.

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Mace is illegal...

God, Australia really is awful, how the hell do they expect you to defend yourself?

You're not.
We used to be able too, but after the Port Arthur Massacre, we put it too the vote, and now we can't have a gun, unless it's for sport.

[Socialist Tera]

Mace is illegal...

Umbrella?
Poke them to death?

Australian weapon laws suck. It sucks being able to not defend yourself against raving lunatics with weapons.

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Umbrella?
Poke them to death?

Australian weapon laws suck. It sucks being able to not defend yourself against raving lunatics with weapons.

Well blame that on the Australian people, they voted on it after all.

[Socialist Tera]

Australian weapon laws suck. It sucks being able to not defend yourself against raving lunatics with weapons.

Well blame that on the Australian people, they voted on it after all.

I feel it was voted at a bad time. John Howard used it as an opportunity to do it.

[The Serbian Empire]

If it is an assault with a weapon, you'd be better off running away or carrying a weapon yourself, there's hardly any use trying to fight someone armed when you're not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFuN9Vb2Gos

Weapon laws in Australia make it tough to carry a weapon. I would have to conceal a switchblade, even then if it is for weapons purposes I might be jailed for it.

This is when I suggest a line from Terry Pratchett.

But I lack the Flint to make it work. Too much lead.

[FelrikTheDeleted]

Well blame that on the Australian people, they voted on it after all.

I feel it was voted at a bad time. John Howard used it as an opportunity to do it.

If I remember correctly, it was the Australian people who suggested it.

[Aphryss]

I think there's a degree of difference between "mace" and "a gun". Unless they're fatally allergic to capiacin (or however you spell the fundamental ingredient in hot stuff you don't want to get in your eyes) I don't think mace can kill, or even really harm, anyone.

[Socialist Tera]

I think there's a degree of difference between "mace" and "a gun". Unless they're fatally allergic to capiacin (or however you spell the fundamental ingredient in hot stuff you don't want to get in your eyes) I don't think mace can kill, or even really harm, anyone.

It's classed as a noxious chemical weapon in Australia...

[Nature-Spirits]

Mace is illegal...

God, Australia really is awful, how the hell do they expect you to defend yourself?

(I can only speak for Canada, but it sounds like it's really similar to Australia in terms of weapons laws.)

Well, since most people don't own weapons, defending yourself from armed civilians isn't normally a concern that people have. In my experience, people only carry a gun with them if they're going hunting or they live on a farm (and I'm not sure of the legislation, but I think if anyone was carrying a gun around within a city the police would be on them within minutes), and the weapons laws are so strict that you actually have to be pretty creative if you want to carry one with you.

That said, it can make self-defence rather difficult if someone's illegally carrying a weapon. Because I'm aware of how dangerous it is to be trans or gender nonconforming, I carry a Swiss Army knife around with me, and I'd like to take self-defence courses. The knife is at least excusable because it's meant to be a tool more than a weapon, but if I were to be attacked it would be impractical to dig through my bag to retrieve it, and then to unfold the blade. That's why when I'm in public, and especially when I'm alone, I tend to be very aware of my surroundings. Even if someone gives me a dirty look and they're heading in the same direction as I, or I hear someone make a derogatory comment, I usually reach into my bag to hold onto my knife. At least that's better than nothing.

But you know, even if your attacker doesn't have a weapon, it's still really dangerous for people like us. I have a few friends who've had rocks thrown at them from passing cars. I have friends who've been followed by people.

Weapons laws in New Zealand are even more ridiculous, really; basically, anything you carry with the intent of using it to defend yourself is considered a weapon, and thus if you defend yourself with it it's considered assault with a weapon.

It's similar in Canada; anything you use or have the intention of using as a weapon is legally classified as a weapon in that context, even something like a pen. Self-defence laws take precedence, though, so if it's determined by the court that you were defending yourself and that you didn't use excessive force (which is incredibly subjective, so I'm not sure how they determine that), you're cleared of the weapon charges. Unless it's a prohibited weapon altogether, I assume.

I think there's a degree of difference between "mace" and "a gun". Unless they're fatally allergic to capiacin (or however you spell the fundamental ingredient in hot stuff you don't want to get in your eyes) I don't think mace can kill, or even really harm, anyone.

*capsaicin

And I agree. I don't think anyone should be carrying guns around with them, but mace should be legal for self-defence purposes, and possession of mace in the first place should be legal. Of course attacking someone with it outside of a self-defence context would just fall under the pre-existing assault laws, so I don't think that's too much of a concern.

[Nature-Spirits]

I think the mistake your making is that you think I'm actually trying to change anyones mind.

Then what are you doing? Because I really don't understand what you get out of it.

I would like to know this too. Bailey, at this rate you're going to end up DOS. Needless to say, that would be bad. Why don't you just stay out of threads you know are going to get you riled up?

[Linux and the X]

Then carry something like an umbrella or mace, because seriously, something like martial arts isn't going to cut it against a guy with a knife, especially for a girl. It would not be advisable to stand and fight.

Mace is illegal...

What about bear spray?

I think there's a degree of difference between "mace" and "a gun". Unless they're fatally allergic to capiacin (or however you spell the fundamental ingredient in hot stuff you don't want to get in your eyes) I don't think mace can kill, or even really harm, anyone.

Nitpick: Strictly, mace is phenacyl chloride (CN). Pepper spray is oleoresin capsicum (OC) or, sometimes, nonivamide (PAVA). OC is more potent, and usually more concentrated, than PAVA. Both PAVA and OC sprays are typically stronger than OC, but they work by causing severe pain (which can sometimes be overcome) whereas CN directly induces lachrymation.

[Aphryss]

Mace is illegal...

What about bear spray?

I think there's a degree of difference between "mace" and "a gun". Unless they're fatally allergic to capiacin (or however you spell the fundamental ingredient in hot stuff you don't want to get in your eyes) I don't think mace can kill, or even really harm, anyone.

Nitpick: Strictly, mace is phenacyl chloride (CN). Pepper spray is oleoresin capsicum (OC) or, sometimes, nonivamide (PAVA). OC is more potent, and usually more concentrated, than PAVA. Both PAVA and OC sprays are typically stronger than OC, but they work by causing severe pain (which can sometimes be overcome) whereas CN directly induces lachrymation.

Surely you can legally carry bear spray?

We have no bears. No large predators at all, actually. If you're somewhere where wild pigs are, you've probably already got a gun and a hunting dog. I don't know if I could beat a weasel in a fair fight, but I'm also highly unlikely to ever have to fight one.

[Linux and the X]

What about bear spray?


Nitpick: Strictly, mace is phenacyl chloride (CN). Pepper spray is oleoresin capsicum (OC) or, sometimes, nonivamide (PAVA). OC is more potent, and usually more concentrated, than PAVA. Both PAVA and OC sprays are typically stronger than OC, but they work by causing severe pain (which can sometimes be overcome) whereas CN directly induces lachrymation.

Surely you can legally carry bear spray?

We have no bears. No large predators at all, actually. If you're somewhere where wild pigs are, you've probably already got a gun and a hunting dog. I don't know if I could beat a weasel in a fair fight, but I'm also highly unlikely to ever have to fight one.

Drop bears?

[Aphryss]

We have no bears. No large predators at all, actually. If you're somewhere where wild pigs are, you've probably already got a gun and a hunting dog. I don't know if I could beat a weasel in a fair fight, but I'm also highly unlikely to ever have to fight one.

Drop bears?

Are Australian. We have enough trouble with introduced possums, nobody's going to let drop bears into the country! The customs officials are all "are you, or have you ever been, a drop bear".

[Nature-Spirits]

Mace is illegal...

What about bear spray?

In Canada, it's legal for use against bears only.

Looking into it again, it looks like you can use pepper spray in Canada for legitimate self-defence, but if you're caught carrying it around you could be charged with carrying a concealed weapon. And if I'm interpreting the legislation correctly, the defence that you're carrying it in case of attack wouldn't work, because then they can say that you have the intention of using it against someone.

Mace, meanwhile, is illegal altogether.

[Linux and the X]

Drop bears?

Are Australian. We have enough trouble with introduced possums, nobody's going to let drop bears into the country! The customs officials are all "are you, or have you ever been, a drop bear".

Sorry, confused you for ST. Feral dogs?