Who is to blame for the start of WW1?

by **Coccygia** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:33 pm

Obama.

by **Trotskylvania** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:34 pm

Austria-Hungary is the principle antagonist, for escalating immediately to war against Serbia for acts committed by non-state actors.

The French political class's obsession with La Revanche was pointlessly bellicose. They worked very hard to make a negotiated settlement impossible.

Germany wrote the blank checks to its allies, and had certainly been eagerly awaiting this eventuality to catapault them to the top of the world stage. But their illegal invasion of neutral countries as a military expedience was not only morally outrageous, but made it impossible for Great Britain to remain neutral.

by **The Salvatagard Republic** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:37 pm

The Socialist Siverian State wrote:
The Salvatagard Republic wrote:HELLO? stop skipping me!

WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!

it seems like people are skipping me/history geek.

by **The Salvatagard Republic** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:37 pm

The Socialist Siverian State wrote:
The Salvatagard Republic wrote:HELLO? stop skipping me!

WHAT IS THE PROBLEM?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!

by **Glorious KASSRD** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 5:48 pm

Lots of people are too blame. It would be unfair to claim one group only was responsible for World War 1.

by **Gim** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:43 pm

Glorious KASSRD wrote:Lots of people are too blame. It would be unfair to claim one group only was responsible for World War 1.

Basically, every Great Power in Europe is responsible, Germany being the most.

by **Roski** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:46 pm

What lead to it actually being World War 1 was intense nationalism in every european country and the want to try out all the new toys.

However, Serbia is direcly responsible for allowing the war to begin.

Serbia started it, but Europe allowed it to get out of hand.

by **Gim** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:48 pm

Roski wrote:What lead to it actually being World War 1 was intense nationalism in every european country and the want to try out all the new toys.

However, Serbia is direcly responsible for allowing the war to begin.

Serbia started it, but Europe allowed it to get out of hand.

Serbia or Europe? It is just as asking chicken or the egg?

by **Roski** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:50 pm

Gim wrote:
Roski wrote:What lead to it actually being World War 1 was intense nationalism in every european country and the want to try out all the new toys.

However, Serbia is direcly responsible for allowing the war to begin.

Serbia started it, but Europe allowed it to get out of hand.

Serbia or Europe? It is just as asking chicken or the egg?

No

You don't understand.

Serbia is directly responsible for the beginning of the war. Austria-Hungary versus Serbia.

However, because of European Nationalism, the war escalated from a two party war, that Serbia started, to a war that decimated Europe.

Serbia started it, but Europe allowed it to get out of hand.

by **New Benian Republic** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:53 pm

British antagonization.

by **Gim** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 6:54 pm

Roski wrote:
Gim wrote:
Serbia or Europe? It is just as asking chicken or the egg?

No

You don't understand.

Serbia is directly responsible for the beginning of the war. Austria-Hungary versus Serbia.

However, because of European Nationalism, the war escalated from a two party war, that Serbia started, to a war that decimated Europe.

Serbia started it, but Europe allowed it to get out of hand.

The thing is, had Europe not been at a tense state with one another, Serbia would not have caused any war. The worst case scenario would have been a sour relation with its neighbouring nations, if not a skirmish.

by **Rusozak** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:31 pm

Gim wrote:
Glorious KASSRD wrote:Lots of people are too blame. It would be unfair to claim one group only was responsible for World War 1.

Basically, every Great Power in Europe is responsible, Germany being the most.

Why Germany? The alliance web forced them into it.

by **Gim** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:33 pm

Rusozak wrote:
Gim wrote:
Basically, every Great Power in Europe is responsible, Germany being the most.

Why Germany? The alliance web forced them into it.

Germany initially causes an armaments race with Britain and France, causing tension in the Balance of Power.

by **Rusozak** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:42 pm

Gim wrote:
Rusozak wrote:
Why Germany? The alliance web forced them into it.

Germany initially causes an armaments race with Britain and France, causing tension in the Balance of Power.

Well, if you go further back than 1900-ish, I guess your right, but I tend to look lowly upon a nation simply existing threatening another nation's power as a good reason.

by **Gim** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:44 pm

Rusozak wrote:
Gim wrote:
Germany initially causes an armaments race with Britain and France, causing tension in the Balance of Power.

Well, if you go further back than 1900-ish, I guess your right, but I tend to look lowly upon a nation simply existing threatening another nation's power as a good reason.

Germany caused the threat first, because when Wilhelm visited his grandmother, Queen Elizabeth, in Britain, he was awed by her imperial navy forces that he decided to create his own imperial navy in Germany.

by **Olthar** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:56 pm

Pretty sure the entire point of WWI history lessons is that there was no singular cause. It was a powder keg of all sorts of things.

by **Gim** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:58 pm

Olthar wrote:Pretty sure the entire point of WWI history lessons is that there was no singular cause. It was a powder keg of all sorts of things.

Well, some people say Austria, and I am.....uh.....dumbfounded.

by **Trotskylvania** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:50 pm

Roski wrote:
Gim wrote:
Serbia or Europe? It is just as asking chicken or the egg?

No

You don't understand.

Serbia is directly responsible for the beginning of the war. Austria-Hungary versus Serbia.

However, because of European Nationalism, the war escalated from a two party war, that Serbia started, to a war that decimated Europe.

Serbia started it, but Europe allowed it to get out of hand.

Black Hand =/= the Kingdom of Serbia. On the contrary, they were often antagonistic to the Serbian establishment, and trended towards republicanism.

by **Protector Galactics** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:32 am

My family roots from a very wealthy family in the German Empire back in the day. All generations up to me is very patriotic for the Empire and the Kaiser (Don't ask why.) So I do have a lot of sympathy for the Germans. If they haven't invaded Belgium or other neutral countries, we might have avoided war with Britain and possibly force the French to surrender. Even though the Germans made unethical mistakes, the allies didn't do any better on the Treaty of Versailles, which led to Hitler and Nazi Germany.

by **Transvaal Vrystaat** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:40 am

Austria, specifically the Hapsburgs.

by **Old Tyrannia** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:42 am

Transvaal Vrystaat wrote:Austria, specifically the Hapsburgs.

Please elaborate.

by **AlezSalmond** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:00 am

Serbian nationalists of course. Pretty simple. Then again, admitting that Serbia started a world war and committed one of the worst genocides on the planet would put them on par with Germany.

by **Bojikami** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:02 am

Austria. Though, they are technically Germans so, Germans started WW1. Just not Germany.

by **Protector Galactics** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:06 am

Bojikami wrote:Austria. Though, they are technically Germans so, Germans started WW1. Just not Germany.

No, This is not Austria, this is Austria-Hungary. You can't just blame the Germans.

by **Aelex** » Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:33 am

Protector Galactics wrote:My family roots from a very wealthy family in the German Empire back in the day. All generations up to me is very patriotic for the Empire and the Kaiser (Don't ask why.) So I do have a lot of sympathy for the Germans. If they haven't invaded Belgium or other neutral countries, we might have avoided war with Britain and possibly force the French to surrender. Even though the Germans made unethical mistakes, the allies didn't do any better on the Treaty of Versailles, which led to Hitler and Nazi Germany.

Not attacking Belgium would have meant that you could have attacked only from Alsace-Lorraine; and that would have stopped you from advancing as quickly meaning that the only advantage you had of moving first would have been wasted. That plus the fact that the U.K would have entered the war anyway.

For forcing us to surrender, you actually almost managed to do it in the first week of the war thanks to the incompetence of our military leader but Gallieni (badassest badass of the badassery) basically fucked any chance of a quick German victory when he did the job Joffre was supposed to do.
You had a second chance to win in Verdun which you failed to take.
But after that? You were screwed. Completely and utterly. When the American eventually joined, the war was already won.

Now for the unethical mistake, I think you're refering to Ypres; right? If yes, then let me tell you that using freaking Chlore even thought it was forbidden by a convention against Gaz weapon is way more than a simple "unethical mistake". Especially when you have the guts to say that you never broke the said convention because you didn't used gaz shell but "only" opened bottle of the gaz.

And it's not the Traité de Versaille which lead Germany to nazism. It was the German people (and the 1929 crisis to some extent).

Who is to blame for the start of WW1?

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