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Mt. Rainier vs Mt. Tahoma Discussion Thread

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Mahdistan
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Mt. Rainier vs Mt. Tahoma Discussion Thread

Postby Mahdistan » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:00 pm

A little known debate to outsiders is whether or not Washington's famous tallest mountain should be called Mt. Rainier or Mt. Tahoma. Here's why:

One of the first expeditions to the west coast of the Americas by Englishmen was done by George Vancouver, who claimed responsibility for the mountain's discovery. He saw it while sailing through Puget Sound, and made the first accurate measurements of its height from his boat. Assuming that he was the first to have seen it, as the countryside was very wild (and still is, in some parts), he decided to name it after a personal friend of his, Admiral Peter Rainier. He then left, never setting foot on the mountain in his lifetime.

However, unbeknownst to him, there had been Native Americans living around the mountain for as many as 10,000 years, by some predictions. The local tribes had many names for the mountain, but the most common was Mt. Tahoma. Most tribes held either great reverence or fear of the mountain, as many saw it as both a life-giving mother for the streams which came off it, but also a dangerous, evil place, which is logical due to the great disasters which had occurred in their history surrounding the mountain. Eventually, white settlers began to move into the surrounding lands, and they made contact with the natives. Hazard Stevens, one of the local governors, performed the first recorded ascent of the mountain in the late 1800's with the help of a native guide. These men called the mountain Tahoma, as the name Rainier had little relevance to them. Eventually, however, conflict between the settlers and the natives lead to white men wanting to de-associate themselves with the natives, picking up the old name of Rainier.

Over a hundred years later, the mountain is still called Mt. Rainier, and it is universally known as such. However, there is a growing movement, primarily by the natives who still live there, for the old name of Tahoma to be restored. One of the minor peaks of the mountain has been named Little Tahoma, however, many feel that isn't enough.

So what do you think NS? Is the tradition of calling it Rainier too time-honored, or should the original name be restored for the sake of the natives? I'm personally in favor of the old name being brought back, but I can understand why a sudden name change could be complicating for such a famous and well-known mountain.
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Postby Deuxtete » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:56 pm

Hyphen that shit like proper American heritage.
Rainier-Tahoma...Big RT.
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Postby Rusozak » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:59 pm

The eurocentrism handbook says to disregard any previous names given to something by a non-European.

On a serious note, though, Mt. Tahoma. First discovery rights I guess.
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Postby Geilinor » Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:02 pm

I live here and I have no opinion.
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Postby Angleter » Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:41 pm

If they decide to rename the mountain Mt. Tahoma, then they should rename the font Rainier. That would be fair.
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Postby Washington Resistance Army » Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:43 pm

Geilinor wrote:I live here and I have no opinion.


Seconding this^
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The imperial canadian dutchy
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Postby The imperial canadian dutchy » Mon Aug 31, 2015 6:12 pm

Why rename something just because the indians had another name for it, Shall we rename Kaliningrad just because the Germans were ethnically cleansed from it? No It's dumb, just keep it as Rainier
e

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Postby Costa Fierro » Mon Aug 31, 2015 6:15 pm

Why not both? New Zealand's highest mountain is known officially as Aoraki/Mount Cook. Having both names there would be able to both honour the Native Americans and still keep the name that is most recognizable to many Americans.
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Postby Ifreann » Mon Aug 31, 2015 6:18 pm

Does anyone especially give a rat's ass about Peter Rainier Jr.?

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Postby Infected Mushroom » Mon Aug 31, 2015 6:58 pm

Mr. Rainier sounds better.

I support it on that basis.

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Postby Greed and Death » Mon Aug 31, 2015 7:14 pm

Ifreann wrote:Does anyone especially give a rat's ass about Peter Rainier Jr.?

The money he left behind funded part of my scholarship so yes I do. Keep the Mountain named after the blue admiral.
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Postby Mahdistan » Mon Aug 31, 2015 7:25 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:Why not both? New Zealand's highest mountain is known officially as Aoraki/Mount Cook. Having both names there would be able to both honour the Native Americans and still keep the name that is most recognizable to many Americans.

As I said earlier, one of the minor peaks is known as Little Tahoma. However, some natives have actually taken offence to this, claiming that only referring to the lower peak as Tahoma is diminishing towards the natives.
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Postby Shofercia » Mon Aug 31, 2015 7:52 pm

Is this thread sponsored by Toyota?

http://newportrichey.suntoyota.com/wp-c ... rofile.jpg


Costa Fierro wrote:Why not both? New Zealand's highest mountain is known officially as Aoraki/Mount Cook. Having both names there would be able to both honour the Native Americans and still keep the name that is most recognizable to many Americans.


Because that would make too much sense for the Obama Administration to do. Duh!
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Postby Costa Fierro » Mon Aug 31, 2015 7:57 pm

Shofercia wrote:Is this thread sponsored by Toyota?

http://newportrichey.suntoyota.com/wp-c ... rofile.jpg


That's called the Tacoma. The mountain name is Tahoma.

Because that would make too much sense for the Obama Administration to do. Duh!


Americans don't like being told what to do by a country that may or may not exist. Makes sense.

Mahdistan wrote:As I said earlier, one of the minor peaks is known as Little Tahoma. However, some natives have actually taken offence to this, claiming that only referring to the lower peak as Tahoma is diminishing towards the natives.


So just rename the whole mountain Tahoma/Mount Rainier.
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Postby Gauthier » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Is Ohio bitching about this too?
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Postby Greed and Death » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Gauthier wrote:Is Ohio bitching about this too?

No the UK is they have threatened a blockade of Tacoma.
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Postby Farnhamia » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:05 pm

Ifreann wrote:Does anyone especially give a rat's ass about Peter Rainier Jr.?

His mother did, I'm sure. Admiral Rainier was a fairly important person in the Royal Navy during his career, advancing in rank to Admiral of the Blue. He was pointed out to me once in London after he became the MP for Sandwich. Does he deserve a large mountain named after him? I suppose not.

The authority on geographic names in the US appears to be the United States Board on Geographic Names, created by a dreaded Executive Order in 1890 by President Benjamin Harrison. So, you know, I don't know. Maybe ... a petition?
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Postby Farnhamia » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:07 pm

Costa Fierro wrote:
Shofercia wrote:Is this thread sponsored by Toyota?

http://newportrichey.suntoyota.com/wp-c ... rofile.jpg


That's called the Tacoma. The mountain name is Tahoma.

Because that would make too much sense for the Obama Administration to do. Duh!


Americans don't like being told what to do by a country that may or may not exist. Makes sense.

Mahdistan wrote:As I said earlier, one of the minor peaks is known as Little Tahoma. However, some natives have actually taken offence to this, claiming that only referring to the lower peak as Tahoma is diminishing towards the natives.


So just rename the whole mountain Tahoma/Mount Rainier.

Wiki sayeth:
Mount Rainier was first known by the Native Americans as Talol, or Tacoma or Tahoma. One hypothesis of the word origin is [təqʷúʔbəʔ] ("mother of waters"), in the Lushootseed language spoken by the Puyallup people.[9] Another hypothesis is that "Tacoma" means "larger than Mount Baker" in Lushootseed: "Ta", larger, plus "Koma (Kulshan)", Mount Baker.[10] Other names originally used include Tahoma, Tacobeh, and Pooskaus.[11]
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Postby Greed and Death » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:08 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Does anyone especially give a rat's ass about Peter Rainier Jr.?

His mother did, I'm sure. Admiral Rainier was a fairly important person in the Royal Navy during his career, advancing in rank to Admiral of the Blue. He was pointed out to me once in London after he became the MP for Sandwich. Does he deserve a large mountain named after him? I suppose not.

The authority on geographic names in the US appears to be the United States Board on Geographic Names, created by a dreaded Executive Order in 1890 by President Benjamin Harrison. So, you know, I don't know. Maybe ... a petition?

But the UK has threatened to break of the special relationship and enter the eurozone over the matter.
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Postby Farnhamia » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:10 pm

greed and death wrote:
Farnhamia wrote:His mother did, I'm sure. Admiral Rainier was a fairly important person in the Royal Navy during his career, advancing in rank to Admiral of the Blue. He was pointed out to me once in London after he became the MP for Sandwich. Does he deserve a large mountain named after him? I suppose not.

The authority on geographic names in the US appears to be the United States Board on Geographic Names, created by a dreaded Executive Order in 1890 by President Benjamin Harrison. So, you know, I don't know. Maybe ... a petition?

But the UK has threatened to break of the special relationship and enter the eurozone over the matter.

Why, so they can get Mont Blanc renamed to Mount John Bull?
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Postby Olthar » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:12 pm

I wanted to make a Kyle joke, but unfortunately it's a different spelling.

Anyways, I'd go with Tahoma.
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Postby Farnhamia » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:14 pm

Olthar wrote:I wanted to make a Kyle joke, but unfortunately it's a different spelling.

Anyways, I'd go with Tahoma.

And I prefer Tacoma. *throws down a glove*
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Postby New Grestin » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:18 pm

Or, radical notion here, just name it both and stop bickering over the titles of landmarks.

In case nobody noticed, the world has bigger issues than the names of mountains.
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Postby Farnhamia » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:19 pm

New Grestin wrote:Or, radical notion here, just name it both and stop bickering over the titles of landmarks.

In case nobody noticed, the world has bigger issues than the names of mountains.

We've noticed. Bickering over the names of mountains provides a certain amount of relief from trying to deal with the bigger issues. Plus multitasking.
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Postby Olthar » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:20 pm

Farnhamia wrote:
Olthar wrote:I wanted to make a Kyle joke, but unfortunately it's a different spelling.

Anyways, I'd go with Tahoma.

And I prefer Tacoma. *throws down a glove*

*picks up glove and hands it over*

You dropped this.
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