The NS Mens Rights Thread

[Ostroeuropa]

I do not accept the implied moral grounds for why men should be such a way. I am in no way specially obligated to do or be what you want. I do not agree with, or use, the definition of "man" you wish to impose.

If you want to wallow in masochism, that is your option. If you want to chain yourself to cis heterosexual women's desires for what you should be socially and sexually, you are permitted to do so.

But as free men, we are not obligated to do so, and we are exercising that choice.

I'm glad you're also free. You're also free to have homosexual intercourse, but you'd still be a freak if you chose to.

...
I miss sebient dogs.

[Haktiva]

I'm glad you're also free. You're also free to have homosexual intercourse, but you'd still be a freak if you chose to.

...
I miss sebient dogs.

just ignore him. he's either a troll or he really bend at the knee for his goddesses

[Ostroeuropa]

...
I miss sebient dogs.

just ignore him. he's either a troll or he really bend at the knee for his goddesses

I was just saying I miss a better class of troll. Sebient dogs was great. I loved that guy. This stuff is just so, meh.

[Azorean Lands]

...
I miss sebient dogs.

just ignore him. he's either a troll or he really bend at the knee for his goddesses

Please, let's not get personal.

[Haktiva]

just ignore him. he's either a troll or he really bend at the knee for his goddesses

Please, let's not get personal.

you fired the first shots with the bit about homosexual sex, not to mention demising the whole movement you likely know little about. don't be surprised if others echo what I say

[The Huskar Social Union]

Please, let's not get personal.

you fired the first shots with the bit about homosexual sex, not to mention demising the whole movement you likely know little about. don't be surprised if others echo what I say

He also called people degenerate whores.

[Azorean Lands]

you fired the first shots with the bit about homosexual sex, not to mention demising the whole movement you likely know little about. don't be surprised if others echo what I say

He also called people degenerate whores.

Oh sorry, is that "slutshaming"?

[Haktiva]

He also called people degenerate whores.

Oh sorry, is that "slutshaming"?

to be honest that would be a compliment for feminists as far as my opinion of them goes. but no, it just doesn't contribute anything worthwhile

[Ashkera]

I do not accept the implied moral grounds for why men should be such a way. I am in no way specially obligated to do or be what you want. I do not agree with, or use, the definition of "man" you wish to impose.

If you want to wallow in masochism, that is your option. If you want to chain yourself to cis heterosexual women's desires for what you should be socially and sexually, you are permitted to do so.

But as free men, we are not obligated to do so, and we are exercising that choice.

I'm glad you're also free. You're also free to have homosexual intercourse, but you'd still be a freak if you chose to.

It's funny, because one of the most gay men I know could probably take someone like you in a fight quite easily.

As for myself, I am not now nor have I ever been gay, and the idea of having to actively avoid it rings hollow to me - for me, there is no such temptation.

And yet, it is a natural thing, to which "freak" attaches an arbitrary and philosophically-unfounded moral judgment.

As for your shaming tactic, it is nothing more than a hollow attempt to control us and make us into what you want for YOUR benefit, not ours. We know what it is now. We are awake.

You are afraid you will lose your status once men can be what men want to be. We don't care.

[Farnhamia]

I do not accept the implied moral grounds for why men should be such a way. I am in no way specially obligated to do or be what you want. I do not agree with, or use, the definition of "man" you wish to impose.

If you want to wallow in masochism, that is your option. If you want to chain yourself to cis heterosexual women's desires for what you should be socially and sexually, you are permitted to do so.

But as free men, we are not obligated to do so, and we are exercising that choice.

I'm glad you're also free. You're also free to have homosexual intercourse, but you'd still be a freak if you chose to.

*** 1 day ban for trolling ***

[Liberonscien]

Is feminism sexist?

[Galloism]

Is feminism sexist?

I wouldn't say so, although radfems seem to be, as a group, very sexist.

The only problem I see with feminism, as a whole, is that every problem is looked at with a question of "how can this be made better for women?"

This is true even if women are the beneficiaries of the sexism in question.

This means that, in certain circumstances, feminist thought actually reinforces sexism, while in certain circumstances, it undoes sexism. The ultimate result will be, of course, a matriarchy, unless reform towards actual equality in all circumstances is actually done. Picture it on a number line, where various rights are represented by different numbers.

We'll do the number line for men as follows:

7-8-3-9-8 = 35

For women, we'll say it's:

6-8-8-7-5 = 34

Women are disadvantaged, their numbers are lower. The feminist solution is correct the areas where women are unequal by changing her number line to:

7-8-8-9-8 = 40

and declare that equal. In fact, we've just created a NEW inequality in the opposite direction. All the changes that they've made are supportable, but the changes they've missed cause an unequal situation. Even worse, if someone comes along and tried to correct the middle number by taking men to 8 or women to 3 (or some both directions), feminism fights these changes because they are anti-woman.

Ultimately, without reform, we're headed down a bad path. This is one we've been down, but in the opposite direction.

[Camicon]

Is feminism sexist?

Most feminists claim it is not; however, ignoring and suppressing the mere idea that men as a class are not wholly responsible for sexism in society, and that they are actually victims in many cases, suggests otherwise.

[Idzequitch]

Is feminism sexist?

In and of itself, no. Feminism, as I understand it, is the attempt to get women equal treatment, as compared to men. However, there are some who take it to the other extreme, as Gallo has pointed out. I'm not sure that feminist is really the right word to describe that though. Or perhaps it would be better to choose a different word to describe the struggle for the equal treatment of women, since the word feminism actually does suggest female superiority to the uninformed passerby. Of course, that will never happen either. It's like a spectrum, I suppose. Much of the feminist spectrum is not sexist, but some of the extremities of the spectrum are.

[Neutraligon]

He also called people degenerate whores.

Oh sorry, is that "slutshaming"?

Sure is, but then that is not the problem, you flamed people on these forums.

[Neutraligon]

Is feminism sexist?

Most feminists claim it is not; however, ignoring and suppressing the mere idea that men as a class are not wholly responsible for sexism in society, and that they are actually victims in many cases, suggests otherwise.

Since many women and at least a few feminists feel that women are partially responsible for sexism (there are women that support sexist attitudes both towards women and towards men) that is not the whole of feminism. The problem at this point is that feminism is too broad a term. It covers way too many ideologies.

[Camicon]

Most feminists claim it is not; however, ignoring and suppressing the mere idea that men as a class are not wholly responsible for sexism in society, and that they are actually victims in many cases, suggests otherwise.

Since many women and at least a few feminists feel that women are partially responsible for sexism (there are women that support sexist attitudes both towards women and towards men) that is not the whole of feminism. The problem at this point is that feminism is too broad a term. It covers way too many ideologies.

And until someone takes a scalpel to it and carves out what exactly does and does not belong to the various flavours of "feminism", I will continue to hold them all under the banner of the majority opinion.

[Neutraligon]

Since many women and at least a few feminists feel that women are partially responsible for sexism (there are women that support sexist attitudes both towards women and towards men) that is not the whole of feminism. The problem at this point is that feminism is too broad a term. It covers way too many ideologies.

And until someone takes a scalpel to it and carves out what exactly does and does not belong to the various flavours of "feminism", I will continue to hold them all under the banner of the majority opinion.

Can you prove that the majority of feminists feel the way you claim they do? There is a reason we use adjectives to describe things, in particular there are adjectives that can be used to describe which brand of feminism you are talking about.

[Camicon]

And until someone takes a scalpel to it and carves out what exactly does and does not belong to the various flavours of "feminism", I will continue to hold them all under the banner of the majority opinion.

Can you prove that the majority of feminists feel the way you claim they do? There is a reason we use adjectives to describe things, in particular there are adjectives that can be used to describe which brand of feminism you are talking about.

I'm not sure anyone has ever polled self-described feminists with the question "do you think feminism is sexist", so no, I don't think I can empirically prove that.

However, it is human nature to disassociate oneself from things that society deems bad, even if you embody those things; hence why there are people like Cliven Bundy who try to claim they aren't racist. It takes a certain kind of responsibility and maturity to admit that you belong to a group which has socially unacceptable traits, which I don't observe all that frequently. In any case, you can be damn sure there'd be some headlines if prominent feminists started saying "yeah, feminism is kind've sexist against men, actually". Given that I haven't seen any such news stories, I believe it is a safe assumption to say that most feminists don't believe their movement is sexist.

[Neutraligon]

Can you prove that the majority of feminists feel the way you claim they do? There is a reason we use adjectives to describe things, in particular there are adjectives that can be used to describe which brand of feminism you are talking about.

I'm not sure anyone has ever polled self-described feminists with the question "do you think feminism is sexist", so no, I don't think I can empirically prove that.

However, it is human nature to disassociate oneself from things that society deems bad, even if you embody those things; hence why there are people like Cliven Bundy who try to claim they aren't racist. It takes a certain kind of responsibility and maturity to admit that you belong to a group which has socially unacceptable traits, which I don't observe all that frequently. In any case, you can be damn sure there'd be some headlines if prominent feminists started saying "yeah, feminism is kind've sexist against men, actually". Given that I haven't seen any such news stories, I believe it is a safe assumption to say that most feminists don't believe their movement is sexist.

Just like you have headlines where Muslims disassociate themselves with the more radical Muslim groups lie ISIS right? People who are radical tend to get the headlines, regardless of group.

[Galloism]

I'm not sure anyone has ever polled self-described feminists with the question "do you think feminism is sexist", so no, I don't think I can empirically prove that.

However, it is human nature to disassociate oneself from things that society deems bad, even if you embody those things; hence why there are people like Cliven Bundy who try to claim they aren't racist. It takes a certain kind of responsibility and maturity to admit that you belong to a group which has socially unacceptable traits, which I don't observe all that frequently. In any case, you can be damn sure there'd be some headlines if prominent feminists started saying "yeah, feminism is kind've sexist against men, actually". Given that I haven't seen any such news stories, I believe it is a safe assumption to say that most feminists don't believe their movement is sexist.

Just like you have headlines where Muslims disassociate themselves with the more radical Muslim groups lie ISIS right? People who are radical tend to get the headlines, regardless of group.

And bringing the thread full circle, I present Paul Elam as a case study in radical people trying to get headlines.

[Camicon]

I'm not sure anyone has ever polled self-described feminists with the question "do you think feminism is sexist", so no, I don't think I can empirically prove that.

However, it is human nature to disassociate oneself from things that society deems bad, even if you embody those things; hence why there are people like Cliven Bundy who try to claim they aren't racist. It takes a certain kind of responsibility and maturity to admit that you belong to a group which has socially unacceptable traits, which I don't observe all that frequently. In any case, you can be damn sure there'd be some headlines if prominent feminists started saying "yeah, feminism is kind've sexist against men, actually". Given that I haven't seen any such news stories, I believe it is a safe assumption to say that most feminists don't believe their movement is sexist.

Just like you have headlines where Muslims disassociate themselves with the more radical Muslim groups lie ISIS right? People who are radical tend to get the headlines, regardless of group.

That's a false comparison. "Not All Muslims Are Radicals" is not a particularly newsworthy headline (unless your media outlets constantly insinuate the exact opposite, as FOX does), whereas "Prominent Feminists Say That Feminism Is Sexist Against Men" would be trumpeted from the hilltops for weeks on end (months on end, in CNN's case). A more apt comparison would be the Pope saying "Yeah, the Church has been protecting pedophile priests for a while now, it's actually really bad", and we all know what happened with that story.

[Ostroeuropa]

Just like you have headlines where Muslims disassociate themselves with the more radical Muslim groups lie ISIS right? People who are radical tend to get the headlines, regardless of group.

And bringing the thread full circle, I present Paul Elam as a case study in radical people trying to get headlines.

*shrug*
It worked.

[Val Halla]

Some people just want attention for their extreme views and will try and use stable ideologies to do this.

[Haktiva]

Some people just want attention for their extreme views and will try and use stable ideologies to do this.

like Andrea Dworkin?