Race and IQ

[Mavorpen]

Not sure if these got ignored deliberately for not agreeing with the OP's hypothesis or because they got passed over, but here's two journals I found in less than half an hour that disagree with the OP's argument.

Sorry, wrong numbers: An analysis of a study of a correlation between skin color and IQ
Race, IQ, and the search for statistical signals associated with so-called ‘‘X’’-factors: environments, racism, and the ‘‘hereditarian hypothesis’’

Neither are very conclusive at all, and rely on the false premise that a racial/evolutionarypseudoscientific understanding of biology must be wrong.

Because it is. Also, fixed.

[Norepinephrinistania]

That's essentially a viewpoint descended from Marxism.

"The [IQ] scale, properly speaking, does not permit the measure of the intelligence [of a subject], because intellectual qualities are not superposable, and therefore cannot be measured as linear surfaces are measured."

~ Dr. Alfred Binet, inventor of the IQ test

What is your better measurement for general intelligence then?

[Flyover]

Ahh, no. No it's not.

And your argument of "Oh, it's associated with Marx - it must be bad!" is.... weird actually. A hell of a lot of social and political thought is descended from, or associated with Marxism - what with Marx (disagree or agree all you like) being one of the most influential social, economic and political thinkers of the modern era.

Try again.

Some of his ideas yes, but his theoretical stuff was very silly.

And therefore anything I don't like = Marxist.

Even if we were saying Marxist stuff, you'd still have to say why it's bad. Something -as you just admitted- can be both Marxist and good.

[Norepinephrinistania]

Neither are very conclusive at all, and rely on the false premise that a racial/evolutionarypseudoscientific understanding of biology must be wrong.

Because it is. Also, fixed.

If you do science with preconceived notions, it will probably come out wrong regardless of the validity of your own ideas.

[Flyover]

Because it is. Also, fixed.

If you do science with preconceived notions, it will probably come out wrong regardless of the validity of your own ideas.

Unless you want to prove that black people are dumber, of course. Then the bias doesn't exist.

[Laerod]

"The [IQ] scale, properly speaking, does not permit the measure of the intelligence [of a subject], because intellectual qualities are not superposable, and therefore cannot be measured as linear surfaces are measured."

~ Dr. Alfred Binet, inventor of the IQ test

What is your better measurement for general intelligence then?

It is irrelevant, that's what.

[Norepinephrinistania]

What is your better measurement for general intelligence then?

It is irrelevant, that's what.

[Mavorpen]

Because it is. Also, fixed.

If you do science with preconceived notions, it will probably come out wrong regardless of the validity of your own ideas.

Uh, no, science relies on preconceived notions. Otherwise, it wouldn't be science.

[Laerod]

Because it is. Also, fixed.

If you do science with preconceived notions, it will probably come out wrong regardless of the validity of your own ideas.

An unsurprisingly hypocritical observation you have there.

[Norepinephrinistania]

If you do science with preconceived notions, it will probably come out wrong regardless of the validity of your own ideas.

Unless you want to prove that black people are dumber, of course. Then the bias doesn't exist.

The Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study set out to try and disprove the black-white IQ gap, but ended up reinforcing it.

[Grave_n_idle]

Because it is. Also, fixed.

If you do science with preconceived notions, it will probably come out wrong regardless of the validity of your own ideas.

If you don't do science, you...

...end up creating this thread.

[Caracasus]

"The [IQ] scale, properly speaking, does not permit the measure of the intelligence [of a subject], because intellectual qualities are not superposable, and therefore cannot be measured as linear surfaces are measured."

~ Dr. Alfred Binet, inventor of the IQ test

Ebil SJW Marxist.

For the purposes of this thread I think we can consider anyone to the left of Hitler a SJW Marxist....

[Mavorpen]

Unless you want to prove that black people are dumber, of course. Then the bias doesn't exist.

The Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study set out to try and disprove the black-white IQ gap, but ended up reinforcing it.

That master race reading comprehension at work, clearly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota ... tion_Study
89 average IQ for blacks adopted by whites, 106 for whites adopted by whites. Over a standard deviation so much more likely to be biologically influenced.

Further down the Wikipedia page:

Waldman, Weinberg, and Scarr (1994) responded to Levin (1994) and Lynn (1994).[7] They noted that the data taken of adoption placement effects can explain the observed differences; but that they cannot make that claim firmly because the pre-adoption factors confounded racial ancestry, preventing an unambiguous interpretation of the results. They also note that Asian data fit that hypothesis while being omitted by both Levin and Lynn. They argued that, "contrary to Levin's and Lynn's assertions, results from the Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study provide little or no conclusive evidence for genetic influences underlying racial differences in intelligence and achievement, " and note that "We think that it is exceedingly implausible that these differences are either entirely genetically based or entirely environmentally based. The true causes of racial-group differences in IQ, or in any other characteristic, are likely to be too complex to be captured by locating them on a single hereditarianism-environmentalism dimension."[7] On the question of Arthur Jensen (1998) examined these studies and reviewed the evidence that adoption does not affect children's IQ scores after age 7.

Also this:

You mean the study that its own authors said was not conclusive?

[Laerod]

It is irrelevant, that's what.

:rofl:

Truth hurts tickles?

[Vassenor]

Unless you want to prove that black people are dumber, of course. Then the bias doesn't exist.

The Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study set out to try and disprove the black-white IQ gap, but ended up reinforcing it.

An inconclusive study reinforces a hypothesis?

[Caracasus]

The Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study set out to try and disprove the black-white IQ gap, but ended up reinforcing it.

An inconclusive study reinforces a hypothesis?

It sure does if you've already decided your viewpoint before looking at the evidence.

[Vassenor]

An inconclusive study reinforces a hypothesis?

It sure does if you've already decided your viewpoint before looking at the evidence.

True.

[Bogdanov Vishniac]

"The [IQ] scale, properly speaking, does not permit the measure of the intelligence [of a subject], because intellectual qualities are not superposable, and therefore cannot be measured as linear surfaces are measured."

~ Dr. Alfred Binet, inventor of the IQ test

What is your better measurement for general intelligence then?

I haven't the faintest idea. No-one does. We know so little about the human mind and how it works that trying to build comprehensive measures of any insubstantial quality like 'intelligence' is inherently flawed. Maybe 20 years from now when we know more about the neural connectome of the brain and how the brain develops over time and how training affects it we might be able to put something together, but now? That's putting the cart before the horse. It was foolish now and it was twice as foolish back in the 20th century when g was invented.

[Norepinephrinistania]

Truth hurts tickles?

How is intelligence irrelevant to a debate about how evolution influences different groups of human's intelligence?
Apparently there's no way of measuring intelligence so that blacks come out on top, or that properly fits the SJW orthodoxy.

[Imperializt Russia]

It is irrelevant, that's what.

Now, what makes you think that?

[Laerod]

Truth hurts tickles?

How is intelligence irrelevant to a debate about how evolution influences different groups of human's intelligence?

I dunno, why does the orange have handlebars?

Apparently there's no way of measuring intelligence so that blacks come out on top, or that properly fits the SJW orthodoxy.

Well, yeah, since there's no reliable way of measuring intelligence at all. Pointing that out doesn't require knowing of an alternative, much like someone pointing out that a car has broken down isn't refuted because they have no solution for how the car's occupants will get from point A to point B.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Agreed, IQ is dumb. True intelegence cannot be measured.

That's essentially a viewpoint descended from Marxism.

No, it's a viewpoint descended from the realization that while not all cultures may be "equal", the IQ test as presented today represents knowledge of a particular sort gained in a specific sort of environment, and that intelligence will express itself in different ways depending upon one's particular cultural standards and one's environment. That's not Marxism. That's Cultural Anthropology 101.

[Imperializt Russia]

Truth hurts tickles?

How is intelligence irrelevant to a debate about how evolution influences different groups of human's intelligence?
Apparently there's no way of measuring intelligence so that blacks come out on top, or that properly fits the SJW orthodoxy.

Why do you think it does matter?

Few of us are black. There's no vested interest here in seeing "blacks dominate", and that would probably be as bad a thing as the current white-dominant hegemony anyway.

There are no real ways of examining and comparing intelligence. Any effort to do so really is just anything you can boil down to a number which can only work in such tightly-confined boundaries to be meaningless.

I have a Bachelor's degree, four A-levels and thirteen GCSEs. I come from a different country than you, but I probably come out substantially better educated than you do. Does that make me more intelligent? Not by itself, but I'd love to see the outcome of you taking a biology degree.

[Vassenor]

Also, I'm still waiting for an answer to this one.

OK, let me ask you a specific question, OP.

What qualifications do you hold that make you an authority on this subject?

[Mavorpen]

Truth hurts tickles?

How is intelligence irrelevant to a debate about how evolution influences different groups of human's intelligence?
Apparently there's no way of measuring intelligence so that blacks come out on top, or that properly fits the SJW orthodoxy.

"We can't measure X and I don't have any evidence to reach a conclusion, so therefore X must be true" sounds awfully creationist.