EU. and fleeing Immigrants

[Great Nilfgaard]

It's also a nation that is mostly desert with few resources for the existing population yet has the highest birth rate of anywhere in the world (7 people/woman). It might be fun to blame the French for everything that is wrong with this place, but I'm extremely skeptical that is the case.

Even if it was true, fleeing to the nation that is accused of oppressing you seems like a rather strange way to combat the supposed injustice.

The fertility rate tends to decrease with education and economic development.

Never said they didn't, but again their education isn't an inherently French responsibility- not anymore. Colonialism is over and Niger is independent. Its' people need to learn to develop on their own. If some want to migrate thats fine, but do it legally and submit to being registered and identified.

Many other African countries are doing very well following decolonization. Places like Ghana and Kenya are impressive areas of innovation and economic growth. Niger needs less aid and pity and needs to take responsibility for its' own future.

[Vassenor]

I'm not sure what else we can do though in the short term.

Obviously getting rid of the incentive is the long term solution.

[Lordieth]

I'm not sure what else we can do though in the short term.

Obviously getting rid of the incentive is the long term solution.

No, it's not. The incentive is not living in the conditions they're fleeing from, so there's always going to be incentives. Migrants die trying to cross the border into the UK. They live in squalor on a tiny patch of land in tents. What incentives other than a dignified existence do you think we can threaten to withhold from them to stop them wanting a better life?

The only way to reduce migration, long-term, is to help lessen the suffering in the countries they're fleeing from. That's the only long-term solution.

[Ashworth-Attwater]

It's also a nation that is mostly desert with few resources for the existing population yet has the highest birth rate of anywhere in the world (7 people/woman).

Uranium, coal, iron ore, tin, phosphates, gold. If it weren't for its natural resources, the French wouldn't care about Niger.

It might be fun to blame the French for everything that is wrong with this place, but I'm extremely skeptical that is the case.

I can believe that. It's easy to believe that a nice and peaceful country like France isn't to blame for the poverty in its former colonies. It's easier to say "lol niggers can't do anything right!" instead.

Even if it was true, fleeing to the nation that is accused of oppressing you seems like a rather strange way to combat the supposed injustice.

The fact that France economically exploits Niger doesn't mean every Nigerien is, or should be, a Francophobe. France exerts a big cultural influence on its former African colonies; coupled with the fact that many Nigeriens already speak French, immigration to France is very attractive to their eyes.

[MERIZoC]

Calais migrant crisis: David Cameron accused of 'playing politics'

David Cameron just wants to appear tough on immigration, while at the same time, avoiding the problem itself. Oh, we'll just put up better fencing. Good one, Dave..

It's really just turned into dehumanization at this point. "Migrant swarm." What the fuck are they, locusts? Of course, do anything to get back some of the racist kippers, the rest of the country doesn't give a fuck, save a few token comments of resistance, so it can't hurt. It's just disgusting. And then you have the hypocrites in France saying that Britain needs to accept the Calais migrants while at the same time trying to stop people crossing in from Italy and such.

[Vassenor]

The only way to reduce migration, long-term, is to help lessen the suffering in the countries they're fleeing from. That's the only long-term solution.

And that's what I mean by reducing the incentive. If there's less problems at home, then there's less driving them here.

[History Tells A Different Tale]

I have a solution for the 'refugees': stick to neighbouring countries where the population are racially and culturally more similar to yours.

It is how Europeans did in the past, and are still doing today. The French Huguenots fled religious persecution by moving to Germany and Britain, not to Nigeria or Japan. Ethnic Germans fleeing the advancing Red Army in the ending months of WWII (and also in the aftermath) fled to Germany and Austria, not to Peru or Laos. The Ukrainians today are fleeing either to other regions of Ukraine or to recession-striken Russia, not to Mexico or Jordan.

The deedless pseudo-humanists act like they own the white race, whose posterity must be sacrificied in the name of some barren ideology conjured by artificially thinking radicals. These people have a bottomless ego, but as a rule they deem it below their worth to actually get dirty, so they neither donate to any aid organization, nor volunteer to help those in need that they supposedly care about.

So typical of this crowd!

They are the interventionists' counterparts. The interventionist also uses moral excuses as to why we must intervene, without ever revealing their true intent. Needless to say, they are responsible for more human misery and suffering than would otherwise be the case if the 'dictators' they deplore (when it's convenient) continued to rule their nations. Gaddafi anyone? The deedless pseudo-humanist is the other side of the coin: being of an internationalist bent, after their counterparts bring nations to their knees using some moral justification, the deedless pseudo-humanist will inevitably offer us the antithesis: namely, we must take in — specifically to Europe — those whom the other internationalists helped to uproot.

Thesis, antithesis — invade the world, invite the world.

So I have to agree with those users who say that the so-called refugees from Africa and the Middle East don't belong in Europe. National European governments can help with some aid, they can set up aid organizations where real, deed-focused humanists can lend their help. Meanwhile, robbing Europeans of their posterity in order to 'help' the masses of Africa and the Middle East in some sort of racial cuckoldry must be ruled out.

[Geilinor]

I don't get it. They're in France, but it's being treated as an only British problem.

[Great Nilfgaard]

Uranium, coal, iron ore, tin, phosphates, gold. If it weren't for its natural resources, the French wouldn't care about Niger.

Can you eat any of those natural resources? The minerals are not capable of supporting a large population so in that sense yes it is still resource poor. They could import food but that requires money they don't have. Niger is projected to grow to 300 million, the population of the United States, all in a nation that is 80 % desert. Tell me thats not a disaster waiting to happen.

I can believe that. It's easy to believe that a nice and peaceful country like France isn't to blame for the poverty in its former colonies. It's easy to say "lol niggers can't do anything right!" instead.

It's equally easy to blame every and any problem under the (hot, Sahara) sun on the "evil white man". I'm not saying France is blameless but to think that Nigeriens have no agency, responsibility or power in determining their future is ridiculous. They could do a lot of good I'm sure, but people need to stop seeing them as perpetual victims first.

The fact that France economically exploits Niger doesn't mean every Nigerian is, or should be, a Francophobe. France exerts a big cultural influence on its former African colonies; coupled with the fact that many Nigeriens already speak French, immigration to France is very attractive to their eyes.

Fair enough. I can see why they would want to go to France, but again they need to do it legally and through the proper channels.

[Vassenor]

Some migrants have also reportedly attempted to swim the Channel - one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world.

...There are professional athletes who have tried and failed to swim the Channel. What makes these people think that they'll do better?

[Geilinor]

I have a solution for the 'refugees': stick to neighbouring countries where the population are racially and culturally more similar to yours.

It is how Europeans did in the past, and are still doing today. The French Huguenots fled religious persecution by moving to Germany and Britain, not to Nigeria or Japan. Ethnic Germans fleeing the advancing Red Army in the ending months of WWII (and also in the aftermath) fled to Germany and Austria, not to Peru or Laos. The Ukrainians today are fleeing either to other regions of Ukraine or to recession-striken Russia, not to Mexico or Jordan.

In all of those cases, people fled to the nearest welcoming country. Turkey is closer, but they're already housing over a million Syrian refugees. Turkey has done more than its share of it.

[Geilinor]

Uranium, coal, iron ore, tin, phosphates, gold. If it weren't for its natural resources, the French wouldn't care about Niger.

Can you eat any of those natural resources? The minerals are not capable of supporting a large population so in that sense yes it is still resource poor. They could import food but that requires money they don't have. Niger is projected to grow to 300 million, the population of the United States, all in a nation that is 80 % desert. Tell me thats not a disaster waiting to happen.

No, but they can sell those natural resources. That's how Botswana developed.

[MERIZoC]

Can you eat any of those natural resources? The minerals are not capable of supporting a large population so in that sense yes it is still resource poor. They could import food but that requires money they don't have. Niger is projected to grow to 300 million, the population of the United States, all in a nation that is 80 % desert. Tell me thats not a disaster waiting to happen.

No, but they can sell those natural resources. That's how Botswana developed.

Can't sell them so long as the international community is pushing privatization.

[History Tells A Different Tale]

I have a solution for the 'refugees': stick to neighbouring countries where the population are racially and culturally more similar to yours.

It is how Europeans did in the past, and are still doing today. The French Huguenots fled religious persecution by moving to Germany and Britain, not to Nigeria or Japan. Ethnic Germans fleeing the advancing Red Army in the ending months of WWII (and also in the aftermath) fled to Germany and Austria, not to Peru or Laos. The Ukrainians today are fleeing either to other regions of Ukraine or to recession-striken Russia, not to Mexico or Jordan.

In all of those cases, people fled to the nearest welcoming country. Turkey is closer, but they're already housing over a million Syrian refugees. Turkey has done more than its share of it.

Turkey is not the only country in the region. The Middle East is larger than the European peninsula and also has some rich and spacious countries. Yet the deedless pseudo-humanists never insist that the Saudis or Qataris take in refugees — the real ones, anyway, which are a minority amongst a sea of opportunists. The burden is placed entirely on the white race and its environs. What about the African 'migrants' fleecing soft-touch Britain, Germany or Scandinavia? They really are invaders, regardless of whether they possess weapons.

Why did tribes or countries invade each other in the past? It was either to extract resources/tributes (managerial colonialism), or to dispossess the natives and move in (demographic colonialism). Indeed, the present invasion resembles cuckoldry which exists in the animal kingdom because not only are we being dispossessed by a never-ending stream of aliens, we are also subsidizing them.

There is no need for the aliens to take up arms if the present development will wield the same end result, i.e. the targeted European peoples will just accept fate and fade away. At least in the current deceptive scheme, they have the advantage of being fed and housed instead of having to rebuild the conquered devasted countries, and they don't take any casualties. Alas, we are welcoming our demise without firing a shot, so there is no need for historically proven methods of warfare to be employed this time around.

These Middle Easterners and Africans are opportunists. Post-WWII Germany, in ruins as it was, housed over 10 million refugees because they were ethnically similar to Germans themselves.

The aliens display zero pride when they insert themselves into societies so dissimilar to their own.

[Prussia-Steinbach]

Some migrants have also reportedly attempted to swim the Channel - one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world.

...There are professional athletes who have tried and failed to swim the Channel. What makes these people think that they'll do better?

Utter desperation and having nothing left to lose.

[Palakistan]

It seems no one has mentioned it but they have been having it on the news. Syrians in France trying to storm across that tunnel into the UK. The Syrians are living in shanty type of towns near the tunnel while the French authorities watch on. They say they are overwhelmed which kind of sounds like a cop out. I think it is an outrage that something like this is going on in a part of the world that likes to say they are the best thing on this planet. If France or any EU. nation let them into there nation then its there responsibility to take care of them by finding them housing and employment. There is something wrong with letting in people to just have them live in shanty towns . That is not doing them any good and is tarnishing Frances and the other EU. nations with the same problem so called humanitarian image.

Has for the UK. response, at least they are being honest. They do not want to be caught up in this and they have said so. Seems the UK. will be putting up more fencing on the French side. It seems the EU. really dropped the ball on this one. They really need to find a solution which works.

So what do you think.

I bolded what gave me a conniption. I don't see any law out there that states it is the countries responsibility to give people jobs etc. Unless their is a law, thus I retract. What should happen is the government gives them workers visas and have them go find a job. Give em' addresses and all that stuff. Heck, what about all those relief organizations? France can do one thing. They can bring peace to Syria through NATO glory!

[Shilya]

...There are professional athletes who have tried and failed to swim the Channel. What makes these people think that they'll do better?

Utter desperation and having nothing left to lose.

The desperation of being... in France?

I mean, I get it's France, but come on.

[Ashworth-Attwater]

Can you eat any of those natural resources? The minerals are not capable of supporting a large population so in that sense yes it is still resource poor. They could import food but that requires money they don't have. Niger is projected to grow to 300 million, the population of the United States, all in a nation that is 80 % desert. Tell me thats not a disaster waiting to happen.

Maybe if AREVA paid a decent royalty rate to Niger, like they do in Kazakhstan and Canada, they could import food, but then again, the little arable land Niger has was negatively impacted by mining, so maybe if it weren't for AREVA, they wouldn't have to import food in the first place.

And you're thinking of Nigeria, not Niger. Not all African countries are the same.

It's equally easy to blame every and any problem under the (hot, Sahara) sun on the "evil white man". I'm not saying France is blameless but to think that Nigeriens have no agency, responsibility or power in determining their future is ridiculous. They could do a lot of good I'm sure, but people need to stop seeing them as perpetual victims first.

Good thing I never said that.

Fair enough. I can see why they would want to go to France, but again they need to do it legally and through the proper channels.

Immigration to the developed world, unless you're a highly qualified individual (which most Nigeriens aren't) in a wanted field, is extremely hard and expensive, and even then, it takes years. Now, picture yourself as an average Nigerien and tell me you wouldn't be tempted to try your luck and reach Europe.

[The UK in Exile]

Some migrants have also reportedly attempted to swim the Channel - one of the busiest shipping lanes in the world.

...There are professional athletes who have tried and failed to swim the Channel. What makes these people think that they'll do better?

They drown, pretty much, and so are unable to advise others that its not as easy as it looks.

They are illegal because they enter without permission against the law. Guess what? Something that is against the law is illegal. Calling them what they factually are legality wise is accepting reality. Calling them something else or denying they are illegal is ignoring the law.

Calling them what they are should have no bearing on whether you think none, some or all of them should stay.

Except 1) they are Asylum seekers, not immigrants and 2) its a disingenuous attempt to suggest that they are in the wrong for not following the appropriate process when none of people in Calais have a legal route of entry into the country short of smuggling themselves into the country and applying for aslyum. They aren't going to get a visa or permission to enter the country because they are poor and in the main don't have sufficient paperwork and legal expertise to back any application.

[Geilinor]

No, but they can sell those natural resources. That's how Botswana developed.

Can't sell them so long as the international community is pushing privatization.

Publically-owned corporations can and do exploit. You know where most of Niger's oil money goes? A Chinese state-owned corporation. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7434092.stm The government of Niger, as we know, is also corrupt. Any company it owns cannot help the people, if it will honestly manage it in the first place.

[Prussia-Steinbach]

Utter desperation and having nothing left to lose.

The desperation of being... in France?

I mean, I get it's France, but come on.

Did you miss the part about them living in shantytowns?

[Geilinor]

In all of those cases, people fled to the nearest welcoming country. Turkey is closer, but they're already housing over a million Syrian refugees. Turkey has done more than its share of it.

Turkey is not the only country in the region. The Middle East is larger than the European peninsula and also has some rich and spacious countries. Yet the deedless pseudo-humanists never insist that the Saudis or Qataris take in refugees — the real ones, anyway, which are a minority amongst a sea of opportunists.

Saudi Arabia and Qatar are absolute monarchies without any civil liberties for their own citizens.

[Great Nilfgaard]

Maybe if AREVA paid a decent royalty rate to Niger, like they do in Kazakhstan and Canada, they could import food, but then again, the little arable land Niger has was negatively impacted by mining, so maybe if it weren't for AREVA, they wouldn't have to import food in the first place.

Well then the Nigerien government should demand a better contract. AREVA is a greedy MNC. They will be exploitative if you give them the chance just like mosquitos will drink your blood if you don't swat them.

And you're thinking of Nigeria, not Niger. Not all African countries are the same.

No I'm not. Nigeria is projected to grow to almost a billion people by 2100.
I admit 300 million is the upper projection for Niger, but by the end of the century they will have at least over 200 million.

Here. http://www.geohive.com/earth/population3.aspx

Immigration to the developed world, unless you're a highly qualified individual (which most Nigeriens aren't) in a wanted field, is extremely hard and expensive, and even then, it takes years. Now, picture yourself as an average Nigerien and tell me you wouldn't be tempted to try your luck and reach Europe.

All the more reason to crackdown on illegal immigration. Wouldn't want to establish a precedent that attracted more unskilled and unregulated migrants that eventually overwhelms the welfare system.

[Great Nilfgaard]

No, but they can sell those natural resources. That's how Botswana developed.

Can't sell them so long as the international community is pushing privatization.

Thats actually a pretty good point. Neoliberalism is another big reason for these global migration crises.

Western governments should absolutely stop pushing privatization, which makes these developing nations vulnerable to exploitation by MNCs.

[Geilinor]

Uranium, coal, iron ore, tin, phosphates, gold. If it weren't for its natural resources, the French wouldn't care about Niger.

Can you eat any of those natural resources? The minerals are not capable of supporting a large population so in that sense yes it is still resource poor. They could import food but that requires money they don't have. Niger is projected to grow to 300 million, the population of the United States, all in a nation that is 80 % desert. Tell me thats not a disaster waiting to happen.

You were off by 100 million in your first post on the projection.