[Poll] Gun control - How much?

[Gun Manufacturers]

Alright, lets go with a hypothetical. How on earth are you going to stop my cousin who isn't a criminal from giving me a gun?

Make supplying weapons to someone disallowed from owning them a strict liability offence. Cut all of the difficulty in prosecuting: if you were the last person to legally purchase a gun, and you haven't reported it stolen, and it ends up in the hands of a criminal, that's all that's needed to prosecute. No worrying about intent or knowledge: if you're stupid enough to not check, that's your own damn fault.

What happens if a person's firearms are stolen while they are on vacation/sequestered on jury duty/etc, and the firearms are recovered by police before the owner has an opportunity to find out that he/she has been robbed?

[Washington Resistance Army]

Alright, lets go with a hypothetical. How on earth are you going to stop my cousin who isn't a criminal from giving me a gun?

Make supplying weapons to someone disallowed from owning them a strict liability offence. Cut all of the difficulty in prosecuting: if you were the last person to legally purchase a gun, and you haven't reported it stolen, and it ends up in the hands of a criminal, that's all that's needed to prosecute. No worrying about intent or knowledge: if you're stupid enough to not check, that's your own damn fault.

I already worked around all of that, keep up

[Salandriagado]

Their is tons of Gun control in The UK,so much that less than ten percent of the population owns some sort of Firearm(including antiques like Muskets).Edit:I forgot to mention they have extremely low crime rate

I don't know how much weight your statement carries, for when the UK went from strict gun-control to an outright ban, the amount of crime rates rose significantly. Their crime rates were actually higher than the United States. According to the article I cited.

The UK does not, and has never, had a ban on owning or using firearms. I can tell you this on fairly good authority: I'm a UK-based rifle instructor.

Make supplying weapons to someone disallowed from owning them a strict liability offence. Cut all of the difficulty in prosecuting: if you were the last person to legally purchase a gun, and you haven't reported it stolen, and it ends up in the hands of a criminal, that's all that's needed to prosecute. No worrying about intent or knowledge: if you're stupid enough to not check, that's your own damn fault.

What happens if a person's firearms are stolen while they are on vacation/sequestered on jury duty/etc, and the firearms are recovered by police before the owner has an opportunity to find out that he/she has been robbed?

Store your weapons securely, especially if you're leaving them for a significant period of time. Mine are currently being stored in a specialist secure storage facility, though if this were implemented, I'd prefer if the police also offered free secure storage for firearms. If you do store them in such a manner (and can prove it), then that should be sufficient to avoid prosecution (and there should be some form of prosecution against the company that failed to keep them secure).

[Jamzmania]

I don't know how much weight your statement carries, for when the UK went from strict gun-control to an outright ban, the amount of crime rates rose significantly. Their crime rates were actually higher than the United States. According to the article I cited.

The UK does not, and has never, had a ban on owning or using firearms. I can tell you this on fairly good authority: I'm a UK-based rifle instructor.

What happens if a person's firearms are stolen while they are on vacation/sequestered on jury duty/etc, and the firearms are recovered by police before the owner has an opportunity to find out that he/she has been robbed?

Store your weapons securely, especially if you're leaving them for a significant period of time. Mine are currently being stored in a specialist secure storage facility, though if this were implemented, I'd prefer if the police also offered free secure storage for firearms. If you do store them in such a manner (and can prove it), then that should be sufficient to avoid prosecution (and there should be some form of prosecution against the company that failed to keep them secure).

Prosecuting people for having their property stolen. Sounds legit.

[Salandriagado]

The UK does not, and has never, had a ban on owning or using firearms. I can tell you this on fairly good authority: I'm a UK-based rifle instructor.



Store your weapons securely, especially if you're leaving them for a significant period of time. Mine are currently being stored in a specialist secure storage facility, though if this were implemented, I'd prefer if the police also offered free secure storage for firearms. If you do store them in such a manner (and can prove it), then that should be sufficient to avoid prosecution (and there should be some form of prosecution against the company that failed to keep them secure).

Prosecuting people for having their property stolen. Sounds legit.

No, closing loopholes that allow criminals to get hold of weapons, and prosecuting people for recklessly endangering their neighbours by not storing their property safely.

[Joshnstein]

Prosecuting people for having their property stolen. Sounds legit.

No, closing loopholes that allow criminals to get hold of weapons, and prosecuting people for recklessly endangering their neighbours by not storing their property safely.

So a person not being sent to prison because their firearm was stolen and used in a crime is a loophole, that makes sense... not

[Jamzmania]

Prosecuting people for having their property stolen. Sounds legit.

No, closing loopholes that allow criminals to get hold of weapons, and prosecuting people for recklessly endangering their neighbours by not storing their property safely.

It's punishing victims of burglary with, "Well, you should have sent your property to Fort Knox for safe keeping."

[Salandriagado]

No, closing loopholes that allow criminals to get hold of weapons, and prosecuting people for recklessly endangering their neighbours by not storing their property safely.

So a person not being sent to prison because their firearm was stolen and used in a crime is a loophole, that makes sense... not

No, people not being prosecuted because they sell weapons to criminals by the simple mechanism of leaving them around somewhere and collecting the cash separately is a loophole.

No, closing loopholes that allow criminals to get hold of weapons, and prosecuting people for recklessly endangering their neighbours by not storing their property safely.

It's punishing victims of burglary with, "Well, you should have sent your property to Fort Knox for safe keeping."

If you're storing dangerous objects, you have a responsibility to store them safely. If you've got a big pile of gas cannisters and you don't store them properly and they explode and kill your neighbour, that's your fucking fault. Why should it be any different in this case? I can manage it, why the fuck can't you?

[Grinning Dragon]

So a person not being sent to prison because their firearm was stolen and used in a crime is a loophole, that makes sense... not (Image)

No, people not being prosecuted because they sell weapons to criminals by the simple mechanism of leaving them around somewhere and collecting the cash separately is a loophole.

It's punishing victims of burglary with, "Well, you should have sent your property to Fort Knox for safe keeping."

If you're storing dangerous objects, you have a responsibility to store them safely. If you've got a big pile of gas canisters and you don't store them properly and they explode and kill your neighbor, that's your fucking fault. Why should it be any different in this case? I can manage it, why the fuck can't you?

You are comparing steak(delicious yummy steak) to spam(Special Pig Asshole Meat) in regards to gasoline. One the gas isn't being stolen and used as a bomb or used by an arsonist, it just somehow spontaneously exploded and killed the neighbor, while the other is someone's perceived secured weapon was stolen and used to kill/rob/maim/injure etc.

I keep all of my weapons in condition 2, in a weapon cabinet, everyone in this house knows where the keys are to unlock said cabinet.
Saying someone should be criminally charged because his/her weapon was stolen and used in a crime is just wrong. Whats next, someone being held responsible if one of their vehicles were stolen and used in a crime and killed someone? Good lord where does the insanity end?

[Salandriagado]

No, people not being prosecuted because they sell weapons to criminals by the simple mechanism of leaving them around somewhere and collecting the cash separately is a loophole.



If you're storing dangerous objects, you have a responsibility to store them safely. If you've got a big pile of gas canisters and you don't store them properly and they explode and kill your neighbor, that's your fucking fault. Why should it be any different in this case? I can manage it, why the fuck can't you?

You are comparing steak(delicious yummy steak) to spam(Special Pig Asshole Meat) in regards to gasoline. One the gas isn't being stolen and used as a bomb or used by an arsonist, it just somehow spontaneously exploded and killed the neighbor, while the other is someone's perceived secured weapon was stolen and used to kill/rob/maim/injure etc.

I keep all of my weapons in condition 2, in a weapon cabinet, everyone in this house knows where the keys are to unlock said cabinet.
Saying someone should be criminally charged because his/her weapon was stolen and used in a crime is just wrong. Whats next, someone being held responsible if one of their vehicles were stolen and used in a crime and killed someone? Good lord where does the insanity end?

Cool, so you're storing it safely. Excellent. That covers you (assuming that you don't tell random other people where the keys are, of course). Those that fail to do so are being criminally negligent.

[Paddy O Fernature]

You are comparing steak(delicious yummy steak) to spam(Special Pig Asshole Meat) in regards to gasoline. One the gas isn't being stolen and used as a bomb or used by an arsonist, it just somehow spontaneously exploded and killed the neighbor, while the other is someone's perceived secured weapon was stolen and used to kill/rob/maim/injure etc.

I keep all of my weapons in condition 2, in a weapon cabinet, everyone in this house knows where the keys are to unlock said cabinet.
Saying someone should be criminally charged because his/her weapon was stolen and used in a crime is just wrong. Whats next, someone being held responsible if one of their vehicles were stolen and used in a crime and killed someone? Good lord where does the insanity end?

Cool, so you're storing it safely. Excellent. That covers you (assuming that you don't tell random other people where the keys are, of course). Those that fail to do so are being criminally negligent.

Tell me again how someone leaving say a 38 special in a nightstand overnight is somehow being "Criminally Negligent?"

[Salandriagado]

Cool, so you're storing it safely. Excellent. That covers you (assuming that you don't tell random other people where the keys are, of course). Those that fail to do so are being criminally negligent.

Tell me again how someone leaving say a 38 special in a nightstand overnight is somehow being "Criminally Negligent?"

Not what I claimed at all. Leaving said gun unsecured whilst going on holiday for a week, which is what we were actually discussing, as you'd known if you'd even had the basic courtesy to read up through the discussion you were jumping into the middle of, is another matter entirely. Exactly the same reason that leaving a pile of chemicals and instructions on how to make a bomb out of them in plain view would be criminally negligent.

[Jamzmania]

Tell me again how someone leaving say a 38 special in a nightstand overnight is somehow being "Criminally Negligent?"

Not what I claimed at all. Leaving said gun unsecured whilst going on holiday for a week, which is what we were actually discussing, as you'd known if you'd even had the basic courtesy to read up through the discussion you were jumping into the middle of, is another matter entirely. Exactly the same reason that leaving a pile of chemicals and instructions on how to make a bomb out of them in plain view would be criminally negligent.

In a drawer in your bedroom in a locked house is hardly out in plain view.

[Salandriagado]

Not what I claimed at all. Leaving said gun unsecured whilst going on holiday for a week, which is what we were actually discussing, as you'd known if you'd even had the basic courtesy to read up through the discussion you were jumping into the middle of, is another matter entirely. Exactly the same reason that leaving a pile of chemicals and instructions on how to make a bomb out of them in plain view would be criminally negligent.

In a drawer in your bedroom in a locked house is hardly out in plain view.

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

[North Calaveras]

In a drawer in your bedroom in a locked house is hardly out in plain view.

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

that's a bullshit response

it's secure if it's in a locked house, just not impenetrable.

[Washington Resistance Army]

In a drawer in your bedroom in a locked house is hardly out in plain view.

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

That's secure enough. If I broke into someones house, went into their room, trashed it, found a gun and went and shot someone they should not in any way be liable for that. That's just retarded.

[Sociobiology]

In a drawer in your bedroom in a locked house is hardly out in plain view.

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

I'm curious, what do you consider "secure" ?

[Salandriagado]

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

I'm curious, what do you consider "secure" ?

Inside a gun safe would be fine. That's how mine are usually stored.

[Sociobiology]

I'm curious, what do you consider "secure" ?

Inside a gun safe would be fine. That's how mine are usually stored.

you realize that often makes them easier to steal not less.
unless it's anchored it just makes it easier for them to steal all of your firearms.

[Sevvania]

Inside a gun safe would be fine. That's how mine are usually stored.

you realize that often makes them easier to steal not less.
unless it's anchored it just makes it easier for them to steal all of your firearms.

Wait, how do you steal a man-sized safe? A gun cabinet I could understand, but safes seem heavy and cumbersome and have more than a plate of glass seperating you from the contents.

[Washington Resistance Army]

you realize that often makes them easier to steal not less.
unless it's anchored it just makes it easier for them to steal all of your firearms.

Wait, how do you steal a man-sized safe? A gun cabinet I could understand, but safes seem heavy and cumbersome and have more than a plate of glass seperating you from the contents.

Never underestimate people

[Sevvania]

Wait, how do you steal a man-sized safe? A gun cabinet I could understand, but safes seem heavy and cumbersome and have more than a plate of glass seperating you from the contents.

Never underestimate people

I have no doubt that it could be done, but I'm picturing something more akin to a Hollywod heist movie than a simple burglary.

[Jamzmania]

Never underestimate people

I have no doubt that it could be done, but I'm picturing something more akin to a Hollywod heist movie than a simple burglary.

People carried it into your house, people can carry it out.

[Omega America II]

In a drawer in your bedroom in a locked house is hardly out in plain view.

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

That is secure. It takes longer to get to your safe, open it, and get the gun out, by then you would be dead. He is securing it properly.

[Sevvania]

Still not secure. Store your shit securely. It's not that hard.

That is secure. It takes longer to get to your safe, open it, and get the gun out, by then you would be dead. He is securing it properly.

Leaving said gun unsecured whilst going on holiday for a week, which is what we were actually discussing