The NationStates Feminist Thread

[Russels Orbiting Teapot]

Then it cites Germany women-only parking lots.
As said, I confused some details.
But the thing that women-only public transportation is important and already widespread worldwide is confirmed.

You should really stop crowing about a handful of countries adopting your ideas as if them being put into practice recently somewhere in the world proved that they were good ideas.

[Chessmistress]

Also a great point from your own article:

It is frustrating to know that these women-only spaces are a big move away from a gender equal society and from achieving real safety. Through sex-segregation, men do not need to adjust to a society in which women are equal and have the right to be in public spaces. The onus is on women to change.

Indeed, it's true.
As usual, since males deosn't change, the onus is on women to change.
Indeed it says

These interventions and businesses run by women create a safe option for women who otherwise might not go out or who will feel uncomfortable when they are out. As long as politics and culture fail women, this might be the only way to go.

[Chessmistress]

Then it cites Germany women-only parking lots.
As said, I confused some details.
But the thing that women-only public transportation is important and already widespread worldwide is confirmed.

You should really stop crowing about a handful of countries adopting your ideas as if them being put into practice recently somewhere in the world proved that they were good ideas.

I'm a Radical Feminist: I'm used to automatically assume that most people would think my ideas are not feasible. That's why I tend to cite the effective realizations of these ideas.

[Aelex]

]

Don't put words in my mouth.
Patriarchy hurts males too it's a fact: call it "traditional society" or "tradcons", if you wish, the idea is still the same - that "traditional society" enforce males to be competitive, dominant, fearless, apparently without emotions, and so on. And then it judge them in consequence of their assumed role.
'Feminists are working on issues that affect men' is not exact: feminism are working to destroy patriarchy, and when patriarchy will go away even issues enforced on males by the patriarchy will go away (that's logic). But that doesn't mean the most oppressed gender should have to work on males' issues during the process of destroying patriarch - that would be ludicrous.

I don't like to make comparaison with communism since the 'ricains have already did too much of bad taste but it really look way too much like the bolchevik's program back in 1917 especially the part where you just cross your fingers and hope that everything will work fine once you basically blowed up the society.

[Chessmistress]

]

I don't like to make comparaison with communism since the 'ricains have already did too much of bad taste but it really look way too much like the bolchevik's program back in 1917 especially the part where you just cross your fingers and hope that everything will work fine once you basically blowed up the society.

I don't understand how a French socialist can be anti-feminist: that's quite a mystery for me.

[Russels Orbiting Teapot]

I'm a Radical Feminist: I'm used to automatically assume that most people would think my ideas are not feasible. That's why I tend to cite the effective realizations of these ideas.

They are realizations. Whether they will prove effective or not is data that we're still waiting for.

[Aelex]

I don't understand how a French socialist can be anti-feminist: that's quite a mystery for me.

I'm for equality between the gender, not preponderance of one over another. Plus, your whole speech seem a lot to much fascist for me.

[Tahar Joblis]

Chessmistress is not a reliable source. I don't see any mention of German women-only passenger cars. Looking around, I note a German YouTube commenter seeming to find the idea very novel 5 years ago. Germany does have the curious practice of providing women's parking spaces, but all my attempts to verify Chessmistress's claim have come up short. Considering Chessmistress's track record, I suggest that you not rely on Chessmistress as a source for anything about the world.

Really?
I can have a bad memory, sometimes, and confusing some details, but I'm not a liar

You said that Elizabeth Cady Stanton's famous line about women being superior was given at a temperance meeting and was about alcoholism.

We are, as a sex, infinitely superior to men, and if we were free and developed, healthy in body and mind, as we should be under natural conditions, our motherhood would be our glory. That function gives women such wisdom and power as no male can possess.

I pointed out that you had gotten this wrong; she was musing about anthropology, and writing in her diary, which was published much later. This had everything to do with the now-thoroughly-debunked "early matriarchy" hypothesis, and nothing at all to do with the temperance movement.

Even after this was pointed out, you continued to claim that the quote was about alcoholism.

Whether you are commonly given to delusion that persists after correction or whether you persist deliberately in inaccuracy, it is quite clear that what you say is not reliably factual.

Presumably you will disagree. If anyone else doubts this, I can provide more examples for them.

[Chessmistress]

I don't understand how a French socialist can be anti-feminist: that's quite a mystery for me.

I'm for equality between the gender, not preponderance of one over another. Plus, your whole speech seem a lot to much fascist for me.

I'm all for equality, too. And there's nothing "fascist" in my speech: every feminist agree that patriarchy is a thing, and it must be erased, otherwise true equality between genders will not be reached.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarch ... ist_theory

Feminist theory defines patriarchy as an unjust social system that enforces gender roles and is oppressive to both men and women.[32] It often includes any social mechanism that evokes male dominance over women. Feminist theory typically characterizes patriarchy as a social construction, which can be overcome by revealing and critically analyzing its manifestations

[New Edom]

"Patriarchy hurts men too" is a notion I don't trust and have rarely seen explained consistently by feminists or in a way that makes practical sense.

It's similar to 'feminists are working on issues that affect men'. Yet any time men discuss any of these issues, except for really one set, the 'men cannot act feminine without being shamed' set, most feminists don't want to hear about it. There is a belief that men talking about their issues are derailing the only important ones which are all about how to give women more agency in the eyes of feminists. The paradox of this is silly.

This is why some people point out that feminists are actually insisting that men remain in current gender roles, of having no complaints, bringing up no concerns, keeping their feelings to themselves, and being prepared to always be chivalrous--but in ways that encourage women to be independent of course. This is also why feminism must remain in crisis mode about everything, always, right down to whether or not women should actually have to tell someone to move out of their way or give them space on public transport, or whether or not a shirt is so offensive it triggered people, or whether clapping might trigger people.

When these ridiculous issues come up, the supposedly reasonable feminists are too busy or have nothing to say about it or don't even know the issues exist. These are other reasons why some people are hostile to this movement--because it's like talking to crazy people.

Don't put words in my mouth.
Patriarchy hurts males too it's a fact: call it "traditional society" or "tradcons", if you wish, the idea is still the same - that "traditional society" enforce males to be competitive, dominant, fearless, apparently without emotions, and so on. And then it judge them in consequence of their assumed role.
'Feminists are working on issues that affect men' is not exact: feminism is working just only to destroy patriarchy, but, of course, when patriarchy will go away even issues enforced on males by the patriarchy will go away (that's logic). But that doesn't mean the most oppressed gender should have to work on males' issues during the process of destroying patriarch - that would be ludicrous.

I wasn't addressing you directly. Furthermore, your answers are entirely out of Patriarchy Theory with which I disagree entirely.

I notice you leave out men being most military and war casualties; men being the main suicide victims, homeless victims. But that's at the hands of other men, right? So not feminism's issue at all?

You know, feminists using arguments like you have used above justify every attempt at stealing the limelight from every social cause, as though racism and poverty were not causes in and of themselves, as though everything has to have women at the center of it. Histrionic selfishness, used to divide people from other people to make things that should unite us in compassion drive us apart. Shame.

[Aelex]

I'm all for equality, too. And there's nothing "fascist" in my speech: every feminist agree that patriarchy is a thing, and it must be erased, otherwise true equality between genders will not be reached.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarch ... ist_theory

Feminist theory defines patriarchy as an unjust social system that enforces gender roles and is oppressive to both men and women.[32] It often includes any social mechanism that evokes male dominance over women. Feminist theory typically characterizes patriarchy as a social construction, which can be overcome by revealing and critically analyzing its manifestations

And how exactly did you managed to go from " let's fight together for equality between gender" to "let's deprive men of some of their rights and give other to women"?

[Des-Bal]

And how exactly did you managed to go from " let's fight together for equality between gender" to "let's deprive men of some of their rights and give other to women"?

Don't forget that addressing sexism in the justice system, the total cultural ignorance of male rape and domestic abuse, or suicide is "ludicrous"

[Gauthier]

First it was Feminazis, now it's Femiqaeda. How long before it gets to Femisis?

It needs to get to Femihiram first. *nods*

And there's also Femshabab, Fembollah, Femas, FemRA...

[Chessmistress]

I wasn't addressing you directly. Furthermore, your answers are entirely out of Patriarchy Theory with which I disagree entirely.

I notice you leave out men being most military and war casualties; men being the main suicide victims, homeless victims. But that's at the hands of other men, right? So not feminism's issue at all?

You know, feminists using arguments like you have used above justify every attempt at stealing the limelight from every social cause, as though racism and poverty were not causes in and of themselves, as though everything has to have women at the center of it. Histrionic selfishness, used to divide people from other people to make things that should unite us in compassion drive us apart. Shame.

Funny thing is that already debated with another feminist, saying males have it worse when it comes to suicides and even to deaths on workplace, and saying we must admit it. She doesn't agree and she even accused me to "throwing women under the bus" due I was admitting males have it worse when it comes to suicide.
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=344031&p=24918487&hilit=admitting#p24918487
Friendly suggestion: be careful about "feminists" saying they care about males' issues. Feminism is the struggle for women's rights and women's empowerment, not for males' issues. That's exactly one of the reasons why I don't want males calling themselves "feminists" but just only "allies".

Males being most military casualities? I guess they are almost all military casualities, since they are almost all soldiers on the frontlines. Patriarchy negated that role to women. Feminists asked for it.

[Prussia-Steinbach]

It needs to get to Femihiram first. *nods*

And there's also Femshabab, Fembollah, Femas, FemRA...

Fu Fux Fan

[Chessmistress]

And how exactly did you managed to go from " let's fight together for equality between gender" to "let's deprive men of some of their rights and give other to women"?

Don't forget that addressing sexism in the justice system, the total cultural ignorance of male rape and domestic abuse, or suicide is "ludicrous"

Feminism is not about depriving males of their rights, is about depriving males of unjust privileges. Otherwise, if males wouldn't have privileges over women, feminism wouldn't have a reason to exist.
It's not ludicrous addressing sexism in the justice system, or suicides, affecting the privileged gender: being privileged on the whole doesn't prevent from having some issues, too. I admitted it, multiple times.
It's just ludicrous that someone thinks that's the duty of the gender that already have it worse.

[Diopolis]

And there's also Femshabab, Fembollah, Femas, FemRA...

Fu Fux Fan

The Feminist Path. FemARC.

[Des-Bal]

Feminism is not about depriving males of their rights, is about depriving males of unjust privileges. Otherwise, if males wouldn't have privileges over women, feminism wouldn't have a reason to exist.
It's not ludicrous addressing sexism in the justice system, or suicides, affecting the privileged gender: being privileged on the whole doesn't prevent from having some issues, too. I admitted it, multiple times.
It's just ludicrous that someone thinks that's the duty of the gender that already have it worse.

I'd highlight how arrogant and ridiculous the whole we have it worse shtick is but it doesn't seem like anyone's taking you seriously.

[Chessmistress]

I'd highlight how arrogant and ridiculous the whole we have it worse shtick is but it doesn't seem like anyone's taking you seriously.

Males still have privileges over women = women have it worse (on the whole, not always) = Feminism is seriously needed.
Every feminist take these words seriously, male privilege is a thing, so it's not a matter of taking me seriously.

[Des-Bal]

Males still have privileges over women = women have it worse (on the whole, not always) = Feminism is seriously needed.
Every feminist take these words seriously, male privilege is a thing, so it's not a matter of taking me seriously.

That's a stupidly simple way of looking at things and people are quickly coming to realize that.

[Chessmistress]

Males still have privileges over women = women have it worse (on the whole, not always) = Feminism is seriously needed.
Every feminist take these words seriously, male privilege is a thing, so it's not a matter of taking me seriously.

That's a stupidly simple way of looking at things and people are quickly coming to realize that.

I do not remember exactly the numbers but it's something like 20% Americans take these words seriously, something like 25% women and more than 50% over 25 yo (so, regarding the future....).
I apologise if these are not the exact numbers: however that's the order - 18% or 23% cannot really change the idea I'm expressing....
The so-called "manosphere": last time I checked it was something like 0.5% of the males, not of the whole population...

[Russels Orbiting Teapot]

I'd highlight how arrogant and ridiculous the whole we have it worse shtick is but it doesn't seem like anyone's taking you seriously.

Males still have privileges over women = women have it worse (on the whole, not always) = Feminism is seriously needed.
Every feminist take these words seriously, male privilege is a thing, so it's not a matter of taking me seriously.

That male privilege exists is not the issue.

The refusal to admit that female privilege exists is the issue.

[Des-Bal]

I do not remember exactly the numbers but it's something like 20% Americans take these words seriously, something like 25% women and more than 50% over 25 yo (so, regarding the future....).
I apologise if these are not the exact numbers: however that's the order - 18% or 23% cannot really change the idea I'm expressing....
The so-called "manosphere": last time I checked it was something like 0.5% of the males, not of the whole population...

Self identification as a feminist is falling off because of all the crazy bullshit. The manosphere is a direct response to feminism and shares the flaws of feminism, it is not a good thing. Feminism has less and less to do with equality and by your own admission it's an inherently sexist movement.

[Diopolis]

I do not remember exactly the numbers but it's something like 20% Americans take these words seriously, something like 25% women and more than 50% over 25 yo (so, regarding the future....).
I apologise if these are not the exact numbers: however that's the order - 18% or 23% cannot really change the idea I'm expressing....
The so-called "manosphere": last time I checked it was something like 0.5% of the males, not of the whole population...

Self identification as a feminist is falling off because of all the crazy bullshit. The manosphere is a direct response to feminism and shares the flaws of feminism, it is not a good thing. Feminism has less and less to do with equality and by your own admission it's an inherently sexist movement.

The manosphere came about due to the replacement of traditional virtues of masculinity with neo-masculinity. Although feminism had a part in that, it was not the only part.

[Chessmistress]

I do not remember exactly the numbers but it's something like 20% Americans take these words seriously, something like 25% women and more than 50% over 25 yo (so, regarding the future....).
I apologise if these are not the exact numbers: however that's the order - 18% or 23% cannot really change the idea I'm expressing....
The so-called "manosphere": last time I checked it was something like 0.5% of the males, not of the whole population...

Self identification as a feminist is falling off because of all the crazy bullshit. The manosphere is a direct response to feminism and shares the flaws of feminism, it is not a good thing. Feminism has less and less to do with equality and by your own admission it's an inherently sexist movement.

Being for women's rights is not being sexist!
From our OP

Mission
This thread is dedicated to supporting feminism and the promotion of women's rights; it is a place to educate, uplift and nurture the younger generations.


Some topics you may encounter here are...
- equality and civil rights for women
- pro-choice; the right to reproductive health care
- lesbian, bisexual and transwoman rights
- non-violence and the eradication of violence against women

Do you see something about males' issues?

But that's not sexism, women still have it worse, on the whole, due male privilege within patriarchy.