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War On Homelessness Or War On The Homeless?

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Yumyumsuppertime
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War On Homelessness Or War On The Homeless?

Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Tue Apr 21, 2015 3:51 pm

In America, we have a tendency to attempt to address health, human rights, and poverty issues through the criminal justice system. A perfect example of this has been the so-called "War On Drugs", which has soaked up billions upon billions of dollars with no discernible positive effect, whereas other nations treat it as a health issue and have made significant progress in dealing with many of the worst issues associated with addiction. Fortunately, some of the rhetorical and enforcement excesses of this approach have been somewhat curbed or tempered in recent years, though they haven't been eliminated entirely, and people at the highest levels of government are re-thinking the policy. Unfortunately, our tendency to attempt to address issues through criminalization of those dealing with said issues has found a different outlet, with the most powerless people in the United States now bearing the brunt of our punitive approach.

Anti-homeless laws aren't new. with people during the Depression often being arrested for having "No visible means of support". However, the Supreme Court didn't look favorably upon such legislation due to it being overly broad, and struck down said laws on a regular basis through the 1960s, forcing communities to find other, possibly more humane ways of dealing with homeless people. I haven't found any great increase in measures specifically targeting homeless people through the rest of the 20th century. However, following close on the heels of the recent recession, we seem to have developed a new distaste for the increased numbers of homeless people, and rather than addressing the issue through attempting to find homes for people in need (which has worked out quite well in Utah), we're seeing an increase in "quality of life" laws that seem to seek to essentially make the very act of being homeless a crime.

While I haven't been able to find an exact number of municipalities that have chosen to deal with homelessness as a criminal issue, by one count, at least 58 cities in California alone have enacted laws that make it more difficult to homeless people to simply go about their days, or sleep without fear of police harassment at night, and more and more cities across the nation are following suit.

I already created a thread on this particular subject, but it still bears mentioning that the Los Angeles City Council is attempting to make it illegal to sleep in your car in Venice Beach CA. As my wife and I actually lived in her car when we first arrived in Venice (until it was towed), this one obviously hits close to home for me. They're attempting to do this in the face of their previous ban having been struck down by a federal appeals court.

In Manteca CA, they have severely limited the hours that a public park is open, shut off power to a gazebo in the park so that homeless people cannot charge their cell phones there, and have turned on the sprinklers at night to make it impossible to sleep on the property.

In Sarasota FL, they have removed the benches from public parks so that homeless people cannot use them to sleep on, and instituted a smoking ban at the parks that was openly targeted towards the homeless,

In Miami FL and Dallas TX, the city councils created "No panhandling" zones, and in St. Petersburg FL, that ban covered the entire city. Minneapolis prohibits panhandling in certain areas, which you could make an argument for. In Oakland Park, FL, however, the mere act of giving "anything of value" to a panhandler is punishable by a fine or jail time, even if the person being given the money is selling the giver flowers or a newspaper.

In Anchorage AK and numerous other municipalities, anti-camping laws have been enacted that prohibit people from setting up any sort of shelter in a public area. In Boulder CO, they've gone so far as to cite people for sleeping outside in a sleeping bag. Even that's a damned sight more compassionate than San Francisco (which prohibits people from sleeping on sidewalks at all, regardless of shelter), Austin (Where you can only sit or lie on the sidewalk for a maximum of 30 minutes, and then only if you have a disability of some sort), Seattle (No sitting or lying on the sidewalk at all), or Reno (Same). This list is nowhere close to exhaustive, and sit/lie bans are part of a growing trend to keep homeless people from even being able to rest over the course of a day.

Of course, food sharing ordinances have hit the news lately, with seemingly countless cities making it illegal for individuals to even help provide for one of the most necessary elements of survival to homeless people.

So, if you're homeless in a major urban area in America, here's what you have to look forward to:

1. Not being able to sleep anywhere.
2. Not being able to sit.
3. Not being allowed to ask for money.
4. Not being given food due to laws against it.

I'm not aware of any "Don't breathe the same air as housed people" legislation currently being proposed, but I assume that that's the next logical step.

This isn't addressing the problem. This is criminalizing behavior that people often have to resort to in order to simply survive. They criminalize sleeping in public, but don't provide more shelter beds or housing. They criminalize sitting on the sidewalk, but provide no alternatives, and even remove benches. They criminalize panhandling, but don't provide work. They criminalize feeding the homeless, then place soup kitchens that serve meager meals in the most dangerous neighborhoods, often miles from where homeless people tend to congregate.

This is, essentially, an undeclared war on homeless people rather than on homelessness. As I've stated several times on this forum, despite the fact that simply providing homeless people with housing is often significantly cheaper and more effective at addressing the issue than the punitive measures currently being taken, we're so obsessed with people not getting shit for free that we're actually willing to pay more in taxes and social costs than we would spend by simply providing every single homeless person with a small studio apartment, some food, and some basic services to help them get their lives in order. It's insane, it's bizarre, and it's frankly one of the most shameful aspects of our national makeup.

TL;DR: We're treating homelessness as a criminal issue rather than as the health and social issue that it is, and it's costing us too much both financially and morally.

I know that I recently posted a thread on one topic listed here, so I've asked the admins/mods to fold that thread into this one if they get the time, or to lock it altogether. I realized that the topic addressed only a small part of what I see as a dangerous trend, and felt that this broader topic would enable us to discuss the issues in a more comprehensive manner.

Thoughts?
Last edited by Yumyumsuppertime on Tue Apr 21, 2015 3:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Genivaria
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Postby Genivaria » Tue Apr 21, 2015 3:57 pm

It's the NIMBY philosophy taken to its logical conclusion.
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Keyboard Warriors
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Postby Keyboard Warriors » Tue Apr 21, 2015 3:59 pm

You have to understand that these laws are coming from people who do not understand why people are homeless. The US is quite unlike most of the rest of the world in that it's seen as more ethical to work and have nothing than it is to have something and not work; I'm not at all surprised that they can't find it in themselves to empathize with people who've fallen on hard times. Saddened, but ultimately not surprised,
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Russels Orbiting Teapot
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Postby Russels Orbiting Teapot » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:03 pm

This... This makes me angry.

This kinda shit is what most inspires fantasies of violent revolution in my head. This has to fucking stop.

How do we make this shit stop?

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Keyboard Warriors
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Postby Keyboard Warriors » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:04 pm

Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:This... This makes me angry.

This kinda shit is what most inspires fantasies of violent revolution in my head. This has to fucking stop.

How do we make this shit stop?

Elect people who see ending homelessness as an issue of human rights and not as an issue of civic beautification.
Yes.

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Yumyumsuppertime
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Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:05 pm

Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:This... This makes me angry.

This kinda shit is what most inspires fantasies of violent revolution in my head. This has to fucking stop.

How do we make this shit stop?


Frankly, I don't know. I was hoping that somebody here would have an idea that didn't involve making your fantasies a reality.

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Yumyumsuppertime
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Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:06 pm

Keyboard Warriors wrote:
Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:This... This makes me angry.

This kinda shit is what most inspires fantasies of violent revolution in my head. This has to fucking stop.

How do we make this shit stop?

Elect people who see ending homelessness as an issue of human rights and not as an issue of civic beautification.


Great, except the beautification people are the ones with the money. The guy who is annoyed that his lawn is getting peed on has more political sway than the man who can't find a public restroom and has to resort to desperate measures.

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Bachmann America
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Postby Bachmann America » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:07 pm

Feed a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. we need to help teach people the skills needed to overcome homelessness, letting them sit on welfare and public housing just makes the problem worse.

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Russels Orbiting Teapot
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Postby Russels Orbiting Teapot » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:09 pm

Bachmann America wrote:Feed a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. we need to help teach people the skills needed to overcome homelessness, letting them sit on welfare and public housing just makes the problem worse.


How do you propose to do that?

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Bachmann America
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Postby Bachmann America » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:11 pm

Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:
Bachmann America wrote:Feed a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. we need to help teach people the skills needed to overcome homelessness, letting them sit on welfare and public housing just makes the problem worse.


How do you propose to do that?

Workfare.

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Keyboard Warriors
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Postby Keyboard Warriors » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:12 pm

Yumyumsuppertime wrote:
Keyboard Warriors wrote:Elect people who see ending homelessness as an issue of human rights and not as an issue of civic beautification.


Great, except the beautification people are the ones with the money. The guy who is annoyed that his lawn is getting peed on has more political sway than the man who can't find a public restroom and has to resort to desperate measures.

Again, that's because the general public does not understand why people are homeless. You get more votes in the US, particularly from the right, if you take a hard line stance against "freeloaders" and champion the moral fiber of working 9-5. I haven't checked so this maybe wrong, but I'm predicting an impromptu poll of 100 American voters would see over a third give the reason for homelessness as people not working hard enough. There's a massive societal problem at hand when the public refuses to acknowledge mental illness and lack of opportunity as explanations as to why people are unsuccessful, let alone struggling to survive.
Yes.

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Keyboard Warriors
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Postby Keyboard Warriors » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:12 pm

Bachmann America wrote:Feed a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. we need to help teach people the skills needed to overcome homelessness, letting them sit on welfare and public housing just makes the problem worse.

I knew people like you would pop up and prove my point for me! :)
Yes.

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Yumyumsuppertime
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Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:13 pm

Bachmann America wrote:Feed a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. we need to help teach people the skills needed to overcome homelessness, letting them sit on welfare and public housing just makes the problem worse.


Teach a man to fish without feeding him first, and you'll have a man who is too weak to hold the fishing pole.

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Wallenburg
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:13 pm

And then conservatives say socialism is immoral. :headdesk:
I want to improve.
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Russels Orbiting Teapot
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Postby Russels Orbiting Teapot » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:13 pm

Bachmann America wrote:
Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:
How do you propose to do that?

Workfare.


What about those who are crippled by mental illness, disability, or addiction, and unable to work in any meaningful way?

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Yumyumsuppertime
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Postby Yumyumsuppertime » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:15 pm

Wallenburg wrote:And then conservatives say socialism is immoral. :headdesk:


Whatever uncertainties I have about the socialist system (and they're growing fewer with every passing year), socialists at least attempt to address the issues caused by poverty, homelessness, and malnutrition.

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Fartsniffage
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Fartsniffage » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:21 pm

Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:
Bachmann America wrote:Workfare.


What about those who are crippled by mental illness, disability, or addiction, and unable to work in any meaningful way?


More importantly, if there's work that needs doing then why isn't someone being employed to do it?

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Benuty
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Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Benuty » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:23 pm

Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:
Bachmann America wrote:Workfare.


What about those who are crippled by mental illness, disability, or addiction, and unable to work in any meaningful way?

Eugenics or slavery *nods*.
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Russels Orbiting Teapot
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Postby Russels Orbiting Teapot » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:25 pm

I went looking for whether The Daily Show has addressed this, as they've had success pointing out these kinds of problems before, and it looks like they have.

Here's a helpful link that it might be good to share: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/0 ... 37644.html

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Wallenburg
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Wallenburg » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:26 pm

Benuty wrote:
Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:
What about those who are crippled by mental illness, disability, or addiction, and unable to work in any meaningful way?

Eugenics or slavery *nods*.

Just eugenics. Slavery would make them no more productive.

Ugh. I hate living in reactionary SoCal.
I want to improve.
grestin went through the MKULTRA program and he has more of a free will than wallenburg does - Imperial Idaho
King of Snark, General Assembly Secretary, Arbiter for The East Pacific


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The Carlisle
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Postby The Carlisle » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:30 pm

As I said previously, there is a huge problem when people fall into the delusion that homeless people are dirty and diseased rats better left to starve or freeze in the cold instead of people like their grandma or brother.
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Scomagia
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Postby Scomagia » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:31 pm

Wallenburg wrote:
Benuty wrote:Eugenics or slavery *nods*.

Just eugenics. Slavery would make them no more productive.

Ugh. I hate living in reactionary SoCal.

Eugenics wouldn't make them more productive, either.
Insert trite farewell here

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Glorious KASSRD
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Postby Glorious KASSRD » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:31 pm

Bachmann America wrote:Feed a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. we need to help teach people the skills needed to overcome homelessness, letting them sit on welfare and public housing just makes the problem worse.

You do know, that most homeless people are only homeless for a short time, no? Most already have these skills, its just hard to use them when you are literall banned from doing things that homeless people have to do.

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Maurepas
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Postby Maurepas » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:38 pm

Keyboard Warriors wrote:
Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:This... This makes me angry.

This kinda shit is what most inspires fantasies of violent revolution in my head. This has to fucking stop.

How do we make this shit stop?

Elect people who see ending homelessness as an issue of human rights and not as an issue of civic beautification.

I think he meant something America is actually capable of.

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Prussia-Steinbach
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Postby Prussia-Steinbach » Tue Apr 21, 2015 4:38 pm

Keyboard Warriors wrote:
Russels Orbiting Teapot wrote:This... This makes me angry.

This kinda shit is what most inspires fantasies of violent revolution in my head. This has to fucking stop.

How do we make this shit stop?

Elect people who see ending homelessness as an issue of human rights and not as an issue of civic beautification.

Or quit electing people altogether.

#anarchylulz

But seriously, I can't think of an American politician that thinks like that. And even if one did, they'd throw that view right out the window once elected, along with any other stray principles they might have had laying around.
I don't care if people hate my guts; I assume most of them do.
The question is whether they are in a position to do anything about it. ― William S. Burroughs


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