Farage : Charge drunks who keep using A&E

[Frazers]

He does. He credits it with his surviving the tumour that the NHS allegedly deliberately failed to tell him about.

See, say what you like about Cameron but when his son was very ill, he went NHS all the way. I respect him for that.

Why is that more respectable than using private?

[Greater-London]

He does. He credits it with his surviving the tumour that the NHS allegedly deliberately failed to tell him about.

Well that's not what he said is it? He said the NHS failed to spot his cancer and kept on giving him antibiotics thinking it was an infection. The nature of the NHS - underfunded and overused means this sort of thing happens more often than youd like.

[Old Tyrannia]

I guess Nigel has private healthcare.

He does. He credits it with his surviving the tumour that the NHS allegedly deliberately failed to tell him about.

Do you have a source for this? Not that I doubt that Farage could be a Class A conspiracy nut, but I'd like to see the evidence with mine own eyes.

[The Enrichment Center]

Shame we can't charge him.

Perhaps make it a criminal offence to be admitted to a hospital for smoking/alcohol related illnesses more than once, that way he couldn't serve as an MP.

[The Enrichment Center]

Oh I see, sorry. I didn't realise the frequency of the injury was the problem.

So if I often get a bad back because I work as a labourer all week I knew the risks of doing it so ultimately it's my fault and I should pay for my treatment?

And, if I have an eating disorder and don't eat properly, I knew the risks of not eating it so ultimately it's my fault and I should pay for my treatment?

And of course, if I go camping/hiking every week and often end up injuring myself, I knew the risks of doing it so ultimately it's my fault and I should pay for my treatment?

Also, what about those who drink responsibly but develop health problems relating to alcohol consumption anyway? Should they have known better than to have sipped the Devils brew that is alcohol?

Those are all really bad examples. The first one is work related injury - nobody would think about charging for that. The second is a mental disorder - ditto. The third is you fault but I would say that if you go hiking and keep on injuring yourself your doing something stupid. The final one is a completely different issue, someone who drinks responsibly but then develops a liver or kidney problem wouldn't be affected by this charge. Its for drunk people who routinely mess up A & E. Slipper slope arguments suck.

Okay, so work related injuries should be exempt, fine.

Yes eating disorder is the mental disorder, not eating is something that someone chooses to do because of their mental disorder. So you could say the same for depressed people who turn to alcohol. So this one works.

So you agree frequent hikers who often come back with injuries should be charged? Nice.

The last one was in response to the other guys comment about long-term illnesses brought on by smoking/drinking and not to do with this change.

This isn't a slippery slope argument, this is simply pointing out the hypocrisy which arises from stigmatising alcohol drinkers.

[The Enrichment Center]

See, say what you like about Cameron but when his son was very ill, he went NHS all the way. I respect him for that.

Why is that more respectable than using private?

For a politician, it is respectable to put your money where you mouth is, especially when you champion the NHS. How stupid would it be to constantly spout how 'proud' you are of 'our' NHS, and then go private.

[AiliailiA]

Shame we can't charge him.

I have a better idea. Forbid any MP (or Lord) from having private insurance. Make them dependent on either their own pocket (which obviously can't be banned) or on the public system.

[The Enrichment Center]

I doubt that many of them have the money to pay up. They're self destructive arseholes that need more than a fine to get them back on track. They need compulsory rehab so they can see past the haze and give themselves a chance to sort their shit out.

Uh huh and who is paying for them to go to rehab? Where, if they're not willing, they will presumably have to be kept under supervision. That would cost £1,000's per person. Put them on a rehabilitation course perhaps, like compulsory AA, but shipping them off against their will to a rehab center is a ridiculous plan.

[Frazers]

Why is that more respectable than using private?

For a politician, it is respectable to put your money where you mouth is, especially when you champion the NHS. How stupid would it be to constantly spout how 'proud' you are of 'our' NHS, and then go private.

Farage states that the NHS isn't all that and acts upon that belief. You must respect him equally

Personally I respect the man who gives his son the best chance no matter what he tells the press. It would be a low man that would give his son a poorer shot just to maintain his political appearance as a champion of the NHS.

[The Enrichment Center]

Shame we can't charge him.

I have a better idea. Forbid any MP (or Lord) from having private insurance. Make them dependent on either their own pocket (which obviously can't be banned) or on the public system.

Why not, instead of taking away their rights, just let them explain why they spout all the "I care about the NHS" BS, but go private?

[Frazers]

I doubt that many of them have the money to pay up. They're self destructive arseholes that need more than a fine to get them back on track. They need compulsory rehab so they can see past the haze and give themselves a chance to sort their shit out.

Uh huh and who is paying for them to go to rehab?

The taxpayer as an investment

Where, if they're not willing, they will presumably have to be kept under supervision. That would cost £1,000's per person.

Naturally. As with a number of mental disorders or with certain infectious diseases

Put them on a rehabilitation course perhaps, like compulsory AA, but shipping them off against their will to a rehab center is a ridiculous plan.

I disagree

[Frazers]

Shame we can't charge him.

I have a better idea. Forbid any MP (or Lord) from having private insurance. Make them dependent on either their own pocket (which obviously can't be banned) or on the public system.

Fewer rights for the politicians? How nice.

[The Enrichment Center]

For a politician, it is respectable to put your money where you mouth is, especially when you champion the NHS. How stupid would it be to constantly spout how 'proud' you are of 'our' NHS, and then go private.

Farage states that the NHS isn't all that and acts upon that belief. You must respect him equally

Personally I respect the man who gives his son the best chance no matter what he tells the press. It would be a low man that would give his son a poorer shot just to maintain his political appearance as a champion of the NHS.

I don't respect Farage one bit, mainly because of his xenophobia and fearmongering, but I don't have a problem with someone who believes the NHS isn't great and uses private no. I disagree with them, but I don't lose respect for them because they hold that view and act upon it.

Also, you're suggesting Cameron allowed his sick and dying son to receive substandard treatment to 'look good'. Do you have kids? Do you know anyone with kids? Have you ever been outside?

[Greater-London]

Okay, so work related injuries should be exempt, fine.

Yes eating disorder is the mental disorder, not eating is something that someone chooses to do because of their mental disorder. So you could say the same for depressed people who turn to alcohol. So this one works.

So you agree frequent hikers who often come back with injuries should be charged? Nice.

The last one was in response to the other guys comment about long-term illnesses brought on by smoking/drinking and not to do with this change.

This isn't a slippery slope argument, this is simply pointing out the hypocrisy which arises from stigmatising alcohol drinkers.

Yea that would be exempt.

No you really couldn't. If someones drinking is a by product of their depression then its not their "fault". No more their "fault" than someone with anorexia not eating.

No I don't. I don't think the charge should be implemented at all. Simply if you go walking and keep on getting injured then your an idiot.

This is the biggest slipper slope argument I ever did see!

"Charge drunks in A & E"
"Whats next? Charging people who break their legs by using them whilst walking! Charging the mentally ill for damaging themselves?"

Slippery slope argument through and through.

There is no hypocrisy here. There isn't a stigmatizing of alcohol drinkers. The idea (which I grant you is stupid) Is to charge drunk people in A & E who probably don't need to be there, will be hard to deal with and waste everyone's time. There is already a stigma around being a violent drunk and rightfully so.

[Frazers]

Also, you're suggesting Cameron allowed his sick and dying son to receive substandard treatment to 'look good'.

No. I'm suggesting it's as possible as the alternative.

Do you have kids?

Yes. Do you?

Do you know anyone with kids?

Yes. Do you?

Have you ever been outside?

Yes. Have you?

[Zorbae]

Farage yet suggesting more unworkable policies in a half-hearted attempt to gain support, knowing full well he will never get to the point of enacting them.

[Imperializt Russia]

Why would Farage want this? He's got to be the heaviest drinker and smoker in England.

It creates a two tier system. Turning up drunk at A&E is ok if you can afford it but not if you are poor. He can afford it.

You can afford the alcohol, apparently.

If you repeatedly drink to the literally dangerous point where you require medical attention, you are a repeated drain on medical resources needed by other people. You also have a problem.
Need I remind you people that "drunk and incapable" is a criminal offence.

[AiliailiA]

Need I remind you people that "drunk and incapable" is a criminal offence.

Is it? I'd have thought people passed out drunk on the sidewalk were more to be pitied than prosecuted.

[Frazers]

Need I remind you people that "drunk and incapable" is a criminal offence.

Is it? I'd have thought people passed out drunk on the sidewalk were more to be pitied than prosecuted.

They can be cared for while they recover whilst also being given some impetus not to get into the same state again. Pitied and prosecuted

[Imperializt Russia]

Need I remind you people that "drunk and incapable" is a criminal offence.

Is it? I'd have thought people passed out drunk on the sidewalk were more to be pitied than prosecuted.

If the police come across you and you're passed out, as you'd expect, they have to make sure you're alright.
Much like turning up paralytic at A&E, you are an unnecessary drain on resources.

And so, it's a criminal offence.

[Colbert Super PAC]

Britain should just privatize the NHS, that way healthcare providers can choose not to treat drunks.

[The Enrichment Center]

The taxpayer as an investment

Pretty hefty investment for something as touch and go as rehab.

Naturally. As with a number of mental disorders or with certain infectious diseases

Except being mentally ill enough or infectious enough to be forcibly admitted to a facility and supervised is a lot less common than excessive drinkers, isn't it?

I disagree

Okay then.

[AiliailiA]

I have a better idea. Forbid any MP (or Lord) from having private insurance. Make them dependent on either their own pocket (which obviously can't be banned) or on the public system.

Fewer rights for the politicians? How nice.

Actually, I have a whole slate of "fewer rights for the politicians" which I would like to present some day. Fewer rights to private education for their children, fewer personal rights of privacy for them, fewer rights to private sector employment after being in office, fewer rights (or at least equal rights) of immunity from prosecution as other government employees have ... I could go on.

Most relevantly to the subject, how about removing their right to enter parliament or the lords without passing a drug test? Including alcohol obviously.

[The Enrichment Center]

Also, you're suggesting Cameron allowed his sick and dying son to receive substandard treatment to 'look good'.

No. I'm suggesting it's as possible as the alternative.

The notion that Cameron cares more about a bit of PR than his dying sons life is plausible?

[Imperializt Russia]

Britain should just privatize the NHS, that way healthcare providers can choose not to treat drunks.

Healthcare providers in America don't have that choice.
They're duty-bound to care for people who need it.

Regardless, drunks who need medical attention, well, do need medical attention.