Do Disney Movies Really Empower Young Girls?

[Lleu llaw Gyffes]

Magic is awesome. It is an excellent plot device, which allows writers to explore real and important issues in an accessible way.

It would be cool if it were actually real, but unfortunately it's not.

Then who delivers the presents from Santa? Checkmate atheists!

Richard Dawkins delivers Christmas presents. That is why he is not on television at Xmas.

[Asterdan]

"Beauty and the Beast": Belle, a bookworm seeking adventures, struggles in a provincial town until she meets the Beast. It is only when she meets him that her adventures begin, and really she is powerless throughout the movie, since she is his prisoner. Of course, all ends happily when he turns into a gorgeous Prince — Would she have stayed with him if he had remained the Beast? And could she have had adventures that did not include men?

She fell in love with him as a Beast. I don't see why she wouldn't.

"The Little Mermaid": Ariel is a beautiful mermaid who seeks adventures and explores the ocean against her protective father’s will. She is a collector of human objects because she wants to be human, but her true adventure doesn’t begin until she sees Eric. It is only when she sees him that she wants to truly be human. In the end, he saves her from the sea witch and despite her free spirit and adventurous soul, she settles down with a Prince just to live a domestic life as a Princess.

Did you even listen to the words of "Part of Your World"? She's a hormonal, impulsive teenager who was pissed because "Daddy" didn't want her to date this guy. I know a lot of girls who do similar things.

"The Princess and the Frog": Here we have our very first black Princess, who is not really a Princess; she is the complete opposite: poor and disadvantaged. Tiana works hard to save enough money so that she can buy and run her own restaurant — which was also her father’s dream. She is not looking for love, or a Prince to save her, but her adventure only begins when the frog — a lazy and good-for-nothing Prince comes along for a kiss that will make them both rich and royal. She works too hard and doesn’t have any fun — he is too lazy and has too much fun — and together they fall in love and balance one another out — but why is working too hard and being single-sighted and ambitious such a bad thing for Tiana? Is it because she’s a girl? If she were the Prince, there would be no story to tell — ambition and single-minded hunger for success are innate, supposedly.

All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy.

"Tangled": Disney’s new and contemporary version of Rapunzel, she is feisty and beautiful, but she has lived in her tower all her life until fun-loving bandit Flyn Rider comes along. Again, her adventures don’t begin until a man finds refuge in her prison tower, and it is not until she falls in love with him that she endeavors to escape her prison walls, discover adventure and herself, and fulfill her dreams.

[/quote]
She didn't know what was out there, had no means of navigating and her "mother" was a selfish, evil witch. It could've been a girl that found her and she would've went on an adventure. They didn't "fall in love" until closer to the end of the movie.

[Greater Soviet Ukraine]

Don;t forget Frozen, Elsa's waist width is smaller than an anorexic's.

[Lantrus]

If they do, then more power to them.

[Camicon]

Don;t forget Frozen, Elsa's waist width is smaller than an anorexic's.

And her eyes are the size of oranges. And she is a magical ice witch. And all the men have chests three feet wide, except for that store and sauna owner who's eight feet tall and built like a gorilla.

You know, it just occurred to me that Frozen might not be a non-fiction documentary about the struggles of the ancient Arendelle monarchy. It's almost like Disney made it like that on purpose. What could possibly be their reason for that?

[Forsher]

Because a) her powers are cool and b) because she is redeemed in the final act and becomes a hero.

To the extent that there is a message: Anna is the hero. When you have an opportunity to save the people by going on a dangerous mission, do it. That message is applicable.

Elsa's "message", if you have a superpower that harms innocents, go away and do less harm: that is logical, but rarely applicable. Elsa's message in the finale, if you have a superpower that is harmful when you fear and beneficial when you love, then love more and fear less: also logical and inapplicable.

I blame the Troll "love experts" for being Dumbledore. If they had said "love makes the ice-power a blessing," the problem would be solved.

Hans' evil plan would be to make Elsa more fearful and less loving, so we could still have had a movie.

In terms of applicability, you're not generalising enough. Elsa's problem was that she was afraid of what her powers could do and tried to shut them away. When she was unafraid of what was happening (e.g. when she built the ice palace), you get, visually, much more attractive looking ice than what happens when she was afraid (i.e. typical fairy tale, ugly = bad). But when Anna goes back the underlying fears are still there, mostly because their dad took a completely terrible interpretation of what the troll said, so you get the same sort of "hide it away" response. At no point, except when she initially went up into the mountain, removing herself from worldly concerns (and so the source of her fear), did Elsa ever actually try and learn to control what she could do.

In that sense, a better generalised message would be something along the lines of not letting fear cloud one's judgement. Which is to say, Elsa's character arc is lifted from Lord of the Flies, specifically in how they respond to the airman. That's extremely applicable and, indeed, is the moral of basically every cartoon with an episode about night lights ever.

[United Russian Soviet States]

Don;t forget Frozen, Elsa's waist width is smaller than an anorexic's.

And her eyes are the size of oranges. And she is a magical ice witch. And all the men have chests three feet wide, except for that store and sauna owner who's eight feet tall and built like a gorilla.

You know, it just occurred to me that Frozen might not be a non-fiction documentary about the struggles of the ancient Arendelle monarchy. It's almost like Disney made it like that on purpose. What could possibly be their reason for that?

Oaken is not eight feet tall and Frozen takes place in the 1800s.

[Camicon]

And her eyes are the size of oranges. And she is a magical ice witch. And all the men have chests three feet wide, except for that store and sauna owner who's eight feet tall and built like a gorilla.

You know, it just occurred to me that Frozen might not be a non-fiction documentary about the struggles of the ancient Arendelle monarchy. It's almost like Disney made it like that on purpose. What could possibly be their reason for that?

Oaken is not eight feet tall and Frozen takes place in the 1800s.

I shall indulge you. How do you know that Oaken is not eight feet tall, and that Frozen is set in the 1800's?

[United Russian Soviet States]

Oaken is not eight feet tall and Frozen takes place in the 1800s.

I shall indulge you. How do you know that Oaken is not eight feet tall, and that Frozen is set in the 1800's?

I assume he is not that all. The setting looks like the 1800s.

[Camicon]

I shall indulge you. How do you know that Oaken is not eight feet tall, and that Frozen is set in the 1800's?

I assume he is not that all. The setting looks like the 1800s.

So... you don't know, is what you're saying; but you respond seriously to a clearly facetious post, like you do know, anyways.

[Russels Orbiting Teapot]

I assume he is not that all. The setting looks like the 1800s.

So you just apply your usual level of intellectual rigor, then?

[United Russian Soviet States]

I assume he is not that all. The setting looks like the 1800s.

So you just apply your usual level of intellectual rigor, then?

I do.

[Caribica]

And her eyes are the size of oranges. And she is a magical ice witch. And all the men have chests three feet wide, except for that store and sauna owner who's eight feet tall and built like a gorilla.

You know, it just occurred to me that Frozen might not be a non-fiction documentary about the struggles of the ancient Arendelle monarchy. It's almost like Disney made it like that on purpose. What could possibly be their reason for that?

Oaken is not eight feet tall and Frozen takes place in the 1800s.

I can actually back his second statement up with evidence.
http://channelawesome.com/forums/xfa-bl ... eory.2949/
just skip to the part about the dresses in Frozen.

[Memell]

Jesus, the y are just cartoons....They are not supposed to teach you life-saving skills or stuff like that...

[Forsher]

I assume he is not that all. The setting looks like the 1800s.

So... you don't know, is what you're saying; but you respond seriously to a clearly facetious post, like you do know, anyways.

Apparently they seemed to intend it to be 1800s. However, it looks more 1700s to me and, indeed, that feels like a more appropriate era as well.

[Caribica]

So... you don't know, is what you're saying; but you respond seriously to a clearly facetious post, like you do know, anyways.

Apparently they seemed to intend it to be 1800s. However, it looks more 1700s to me and, indeed, that feels like a more appropriate era as well.

At first I thought it was 1600s

[Charmera]

What do you think NS? Am I off the wall cynical, or is Disney as evilly nuanced as I allege?

Well...
Honestly what it comes down to when it comes to anwering whether disney being empowering or not is "interpretation".
You see, what each person gets out of a film is different. What they take away from the experience varies from person to person.
Take Mulan for instance.
One little girl could feel the movie empowers her, as it is a woman defying both tradition and culture to save the land she hails from. It could encourage that girl to feel empowered and that they don't have to be bound by age old sterotypes.
However, another could feel a little disempowered by it, as she feels she could never measure up to Mulan and her heroes and feel less worthy for it.
Others could take little from the movie apart from the fact that it was a enjoyable and fun movie, (At least in my opinion it was... I don't know, maybe another little girl thought it sucked )

It all depends on the person. What they've been exposed to before hand and how much of an impact this is allowed to make. Whether or not it empowers you really depends on whether or not you let it empower you. Whether or not you take a different message from the text. So honestly, is it empowering? It depends. And it's usually hard or impossible to tell. You can make generalizations, but their not going to be 100% accurate with something as complex and layered as a movie.

As for whether disney means for them to be empowering... Maybe.
Keep in mind all these movies were made by different people. Disney mostly wants them to A. Sell and B. Not ruin the image of disney.

Edit: Now I'm going to find out someone already said the exact same thing five pages ago or something)

[United Russian Soviet States]

Oaken is not eight feet tall and Frozen takes place in the 1800s.

I can actually back his second statement up with evidence.
http://channelawesome.com/forums/xfa-bl ... eory.2949/
just skip to the part about the dresses in Frozen.

That post is quite informative. I will also add that Hans appears to be inspired by Napoleon Bonaparte.

[Camicon]

I can actually back his second statement up with evidence.
http://channelawesome.com/forums/xfa-bl ... eory.2949/
just skip to the part about the dresses in Frozen.

That post is quite informative. I will also add that Hans appears to be inspired by Napoleon Bonaparte.

In what way is Hans inspired by Napoleon? To my knowledge, Napoleon took land with wars, not marriage.

[United Russian Soviet States]

That post is quite informative. I will also add that Hans appears to be inspired by Napoleon Bonaparte.

In what way is Hans inspired by Napoleon? To my knowledge, Napoleon took land with wars, not marriage.

Hans wants to seize power like Napoleon did in France.

[Greater Soviet Ukraine]

In what way is Hans inspired by Napoleon? To my knowledge, Napoleon took land with wars, not marriage.

Hans wants to seize power like Napoleon did in France.

Hans wasn't short and unstable, he's a sociopath.

[United Russian Soviet States]

Hans wants to seize power like Napoleon did in France.

Hans wasn't short and unstable, he's a sociopath.

He is not a sociopath. He is just misunderstood like Napoleon was.

[Greater Soviet Ukraine]

Hans wasn't short and unstable, he's a sociopath.

He is not a sociopath. He is just misunderstood like Napoleon was.

How is Napoleon misunderstood? He was loved, yes, feared, yes, but Napoleon was not a misunderstood little boy. He was ambitious, charming, and brilliant in his tactics. Generals feared his very presence.

[United Russian Soviet States]

He is not a sociopath. He is just misunderstood like Napoleon was.

How is Napoleon misunderstood? He was loved, yes, feared, yes, but Napoleon was not a misunderstood little boy. He was ambitious, charming, and brilliant in his tactics. Generals feared his very presence.

People think he was a sociopath. People think Hans is a sociopath.

[Charellia]

So... you don't know, is what you're saying; but you respond seriously to a clearly facetious post, like you do know, anyways.

Apparently they seemed to intend it to be 1800s. However, it looks more 1700s to me and, indeed, that feels like a more appropriate era as well.

It can't actually be matched to any time period. No matter when you try to claim it's set, there will be glaring anachronisms. For example there are 18th and 19th century technologies which are notably absent from the movie. Similarly if you say it is set earlier, you have to explain all the stuff mentioned above. It is a fantasy movie set in a fantasy world.

In what way is Hans inspired by Napoleon? To my knowledge, Napoleon took land with wars, not marriage.

Hans wants to seize power like Napoleon did in France.

Hans wants to seize power through treachery and deceit, usurping the throne of a peaceful foreign nation. Napoleon (whatever else he may have done later) brought stability to his own nation after it was devastated by a bloody revolution.