Leftist Michael Moore calls snipers "cowards"

[Kravanica]

What is it with Americans and their need to glorify professional killers?

1. Killing people is killing people. Chris Kyle was not "saving lives". He was killing people. That was his job. He was a trained killer. Stop whitewashing what soldiers do.

Me personally, I think Moore is a leftist piece of shit who has continually shown disrespect in the past for the military. Chris Kyle was a hero who dedicated his life to saving others even when he retired from the military.

Whoa, you call that disrespect?

2. No no, see, "disrespect" would be saying that Chris Kyle was a dumb, murderous puppet on a string serving the will of corrupt politicians and corporate CEOs who laugh at gullible patriotic idiots behind their backs. "Disrespect" would be saying that Chris Kyle is little better than the human equivalent of a drone. That would be disrespect.

1. Yes, he killed people. He was a soldier who wanted to defend his country. His actions prevented terrorists from killing American soldiers. So yes, he is a hero.

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

Nonsense, they say my career options and promotion potential are restricted based on race!

That's because orcs are subhuman scum.

DATS RACIST!

[Napkiraly]

That's because orcs are subhuman scum.

DATS RACIST!

No no. It's, DAZ RACIS-WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

[Kravanica]

That's because orcs are subhuman scum.

DATS RACIST!

I AM OFFENDED. REPEAT, I AM OFFENDED. ALL HANDS ABANDON SHIP AND SWIM TOWARDS OUR NEW SJW HOLY LAND.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

DATS RACIST!

No no. It's, DAZ RACIS-WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

Touché.

[Master Shake]

What is it with Americans and their need to glorify professional killers?

1. Killing people is killing people. Chris Kyle was not "saving lives". He was killing people. That was his job. He was a trained killer. Stop whitewashing what soldiers do.


Whoa, you call that disrespect?

2. No no, see, "disrespect" would be saying that Chris Kyle was a dumb, murderous puppet on a string serving the will of corrupt politicians and corporate CEOs who laugh at gullible patriotic idiots behind their backs. "Disrespect" would be saying that Chris Kyle is little better than the human equivalent of a drone. That would be disrespect.

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

He is a hero, but is used by the Corporation of America nonetheless.I may not be a fan of our corporate overlords, but I am going to see this movie so I can understand what this hero had to go through.

[Wolfenium]

Considering Moore is safe and sound in his house while shitting at a sniper who served in Iraq on Twitter for being a 'coward', I'd say he should stare himself down in the mirror before making a comparison. I don't agree in the idea of heroism for soldiers in general. It's a subjective term that could be selectively placed on the perspective of the opposing factions. But the fact that he was on the battlefield is proof enough he was already risking his neck. Having to contend with the likelihood of surprise ambushes, mortar fire and IEDs every day makes the whole 'distance' thing redundant.

[Constantinopolis]

1. Yes, he killed people. He was a soldier who wanted to defend his country. His actions prevented terrorists from killing American soldiers. So yes, he is a hero.

So... is every soldier a hero or something? That doesn't make any sense. You've got to do more than kill some enemies (i.e. YOUR JOB as a soldier) to be a "hero".

For example, you can actually save someone - as many soldiers have - rather than just say "well I killed some guys who may have killed some other guys at some point down the line."

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

I'm a what now?

Conspiracy theorists are idiots.

My point was that the US military is an imperialist force which generally serves the interests of the US ruling class and not those of the American people (except in the rare cases where the two happen to coincide). There's nothing conspiratorial about that. It's not like a bunch of guys in a smoke-filled room are plotting any of it. The military of any state always serves the interests of the ruling class which controls that state. That's just the way armies (and states) work.

[Constantinopolis]

But the fact that he was on the battlefield is proof enough he was already risking his neck. Having to contend with the likelihood of surprise ambushes, mortar fire and IEDs every day makes the whole 'distance' thing redundant.

Every warrior in history was risking his neck, ranging from genuine heroes to bloody murderous villains. The people who liberated the death camps of the Holocaust were risking their necks. On the other hand, the raping and pillaging Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan were also risking their necks.

So no, you don't deserve respect just for being involved in warfare (i.e. "risking your neck"). This isn't the Middle Ages any more, we don't think warriors are inherently superior to lowly peasants.

I'm all for glorifying genuine acts of heroism, but killing lots of enemies is not, in itself, an act of heroism. Personally rescuing civilians while under fire - for example - is a genuine act of heroism, and it is something that many soldiers have done.

[Master Shake]

1. Yes, he killed people. He was a soldier who wanted to defend his country. His actions prevented terrorists from killing American soldiers. So yes, he is a hero.

So... is every soldier a hero or something? That doesn't make any sense. You've got to do more than kill some enemies (i.e. YOUR JOB as a soldier) to be a "hero".

For example, you can actually save someone - as many soldiers have - rather than just say "well I killed some guys who may have killed some other guys at some point down the line."

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

I'm a what now?

Conspiracy theorists are idiots.

My point was that the US military is an imperialist force which generally serves the interests of the US ruling class and not those of the American people (except in the rare cases where the two happen to coincide). There's nothing conspiratorial about that. It's not like a bunch of guys in a smoke-filled room are plotting any of it. The military of any state always serves the interests of the ruling class which controls that state. That's just the way armies (and states) work.

Holy shit...I agree with everything you just said...

I can't believe I have found common ground with a communist...Damn you NS!!!

[Udinia]

The fact that we live in a world with different cultures living in different areas with limited resources.

Imagine two men on a life raft with only enough food and water to sustain one of them until rescue.
It's perfectly reasonable for one to attempt to kill the other, and perfectly justifiable for the other to fight back and kill the attacker.

A lot of societies in the world are in the same position as the two men.

Cool. That doesn't support the notion that people will always fight.

Unless you magically find a way to make limitless resources and make everyone have the same opinions, disagreements will happen and eventually war as well.

[Constantinopolis]

Holy shit...I agree with everything you just said...

I can't believe I have found common ground with a communist...Damn you NS!!!

Does that mean NSG is a communist conspiracy?

[Soviet Haaregrad]

Holy shit...I agree with everything you just said...

I can't believe I have found common ground with a communist...Damn you NS!!!

The scary thing is, when you start to listen to them, they start to make sense.

[Wolfenium]

But the fact that he was on the battlefield is proof enough he was already risking his neck. Having to contend with the likelihood of surprise ambushes, mortar fire and IEDs every day makes the whole 'distance' thing redundant.

Every warrior in history was risking his neck, ranging from genuine heroes to bloody murderous villains. The people who liberated the death camps of the Holocaust were risking their necks. On the other hand, the raping and pillaging Mongol hordes of Genghis Khan were also risking their necks.

So no, you don't deserve respect just for being involved in warfare (i.e. "risking your neck"). This isn't the Middle Ages any more, we don't think warriors are inherently superior to lowly peasants.

I'm all for glorifying genuine acts of heroism, but killing lots of enemies is not, in itself, an act of heroism. Personally rescuing civilians while under fire - for example - is a genuine act of heroism, and it is something that many soldiers have done.

First off, I'm addressing the cowardice aspect. Him being a 'hero' rescuing his comrades by killing foes. That's debatable. Him 'being a coward' because he was popping off enemies at long distance despite being in an unpredictable and still dangerous combat zone, not so much.

I don't agree in the idea of heroism for soldiers in general. It's a subjective term that could be selectively placed on the perspective of the opposing factions.

Second, were you even reading? Granted, I do agree with what you said about rescuing civvies under fire and that kill counts alone don't amount to heroism. I probably should have phrased it better. :/

[Master Shake]

Holy shit...I agree with everything you just said...

I can't believe I have found common ground with a communist...Damn you NS!!!

The scary thing is, when you start to listen to them, they start to make sense.

Don't get me wrong. I have dabbled with communist ideologies as a kid, but people who defend Stalin and the USSR really piss me off...

Main turnoff with communists are people like Marxist who defends everything evil about Dictatorships disguised as communist societies...

[Revanchism]

The scary thing is, when you start to listen to them, they start to make sense.

Don't get me wrong. I have dabbled with communist ideologies as a kid, but people who defend Stalin and the USSR really piss me off...

Main turnoff with communists are people like Marxist who defends everything evil about Dictatorships disguised as communist societies...

Tankies are never pleasant.

[Geilinor]

1. Yes, he killed people. He was a soldier who wanted to defend his country. His actions prevented terrorists from killing American soldiers. So yes, he is a hero.

So... is every soldier a hero or something? That doesn't make any sense. You've got to do more than kill some enemies (i.e. YOUR JOB as a soldier) to be a "hero".

For example, you can actually save someone - as many soldiers have - rather than just say "well I killed some guys who may have killed some other guys at some point down the line."

How do soldiers save lives other than prevent more deaths than would otherwise occur?

[Greed and Death]

As usual I find Moore analysis, fact finding, and presentation to be so lacking that it borders on Fraud.

[Geilinor]

He's been trolling since before the term was coined.

Ha, does Gingrich post on Internet forums or something?

[Kravanica]

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

He is a hero, but is used by the Corporation of America nonetheless.I may not be a fan of our corporate overlords, but I am going to see this movie so I can understand what this hero had to go through.

I do hope this is satire.

[Liberty and Linguistics]

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

He is a hero, but is used by the Corporation of America nonetheless.I may not be a fan of our corporate overlords, but I am going to see this movie so I can understand what this hero had to go through.

If America is a corporation, is Obama the CEO? And, is Biden the VP of Sales?

[Liberty and Linguistics]

He is a hero, but is used by the Corporation of America nonetheless.I may not be a fan of our corporate overlords, but I am going to see this movie so I can understand what this hero had to go through.

I do hope this is satire.

Nope, it's just Master Shake's logic. Or, lack of logic.

[Solaray]

So... is every soldier a hero or something? That doesn't make any sense. You've got to do more than kill some enemies (i.e. YOUR JOB as a soldier) to be a "hero".

For example, you can actually save someone - as many soldiers have - rather than just say "well I killed some guys who may have killed some other guys at some point down the line."

How do soldiers save lives other than prevent more deaths than would otherwise occur?

Preventing deaths and saving lives is essentially the same thing.

[Kravanica]

1. Yes, he killed people. He was a soldier who wanted to defend his country. His actions prevented terrorists from killing American soldiers. So yes, he is a hero.

So... is every soldier a hero or something? That doesn't make any sense. You've got to do more than kill some enemies (i.e. YOUR JOB as a soldier) to be a "hero".

For example, you can actually save someone - as many soldiers have - rather than just say "well I killed some guys who may have killed some other guys at some point down the line."

2. Dude, I know you're a conspiracy theorist and whatnot but for Christ's sake, tone it down.

I'm a what now?

Conspiracy theorists are idiots.

My point was that the US military is an imperialist force which generally serves the interests of the US ruling class and not those of the American people (except in the rare cases where the two happen to coincide). There's nothing conspiratorial about that. It's not like a bunch of guys in a smoke-filled room are plotting any of it. The military of any state always serves the interests of the ruling class which controls that state. That's just the way armies (and states) work.

I'll have to respond to this tomorrow. My internet is real shitty.

[Meryuma]

Sniping isn't really "cowardly" (look at Simo Häyhä) but it's not intrinsically heroic either. We really gotta stop glorifying militarism.

I wouldn't say these actions were right, but they were practical, necessary to ending the war as quickly as possible, thus abating casualties.

United Marxist Nations is a Marxist and Russophile, you can expect this.

I am, although I pretty much love learning about all cultures and history, except the Inuit, because that shit is boring.

How are the Inuit boring? They have a bunch of weird mythology and one of the most hardcore traditional diets in the world. The Arctic is hella interesting.

Ever picked up a copy of Lord of the Flies?

Lord of the Flies is literally a work of fiction. Not even "based on a true story". It's no more anthropologically factual than the Hobbit.

Nonsense, they say my career options and promotion potential are restricted based on race!

That's because orcs are subhuman scum.

Now now, they're not demons, they're only often chaotic evil. We just need to take on the human man's burden and help them assimilate.