Abortion: Humane or not?

[Godular]

Why should I have a say on a woman's decisions? As in, you're saying it, but you're not giving any reasons for it. Why should I know better than she does about her health when it comes to a pregnancy?

Yes, congratulations in demonstrating people are self-interested by catching that up. Why should it be a responsibility they have to take upon simply because you say so?

No, it definitely is. Here's a hypothetical: you are pregnant but the only way a child can come out is through your urethra (assuming we retain our current anatomy for some reason) would you do it and "take responsibility"?

And thank you for proving not all lives are equal.

After a long absence, I have returned!

Well, think about it this way: it takes two to tango. If you don't want the child in the first place, don't have sex. This country has a MAJOR problem with dads walking out on their kids, and it has effected the culture at large dramatically. The idea that a dude can leave a girl with the baby and just...walk out...is very selfish.

Why should you have a say on a woman's decision? Because it wasn't just the woman's decision to have sex in the first place. Not to mention you have just created a life, when you have created a baby. Creating a human being is a pretty big thing, and abandoning it is, again, a tragedy.

And I saw "quality of life", and here's my thought: my little sister is disabled. She has cerebral palsy. Many people would say her "quality of life" is very small, and that she will never be capable of anything. Maybe she won't graduate from Harvard or send a rocket to the moon, but I can say that she is at the center of our family, and without her our family would have broken apart a long time ago. She is awesome, I don't care what anyone says.

1. Because Abstinence Only totally works for everyone ever... hold on have to replace my 'sploded sarcasmometer again.

2. Just because a guy boinked you does not give him permission to yammer in your face about what you do with your own body. If the woman wishes for the father's input, she can ask for it, otherwise... stfu. The man isn't the one carrying the pregnancy

3. Nice story. Irrelevant.

[Mavorpen]

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

Well that's too bad, really. It's a medical procedure. Get over it.

[Godular]

You don't want me to get on how to put a stent in the great cardiac vein.

Yeah, I probably don't.
Still, it's not just icky to think about. Most medical procedures ARE icky, come to think about. (Even a flu shot is uncomfortable, to say the least.) But the difference is that a flu shot can save a life. An abortion kills a life. A late-term abortion is, again, basically taking the child, smashing its skull, and then sucking the brain out. And a late-term abortion is on a viable child (third trimester). That doesn't sound like a very heroic act to me, no matter how anyone says abortion is a good thing.

And there are very few instances when a woman has an abortion because the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. I mean, as far as all the reasons go for a woman having an abortion. If you know what I mean.

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

Hmm. Lets see here, a woman deciding that she doesn't want to carry a pregnancy to term... compared to millions of actual PERSONS being systematically tortured and murdered in cold blood. I find myself entertained by the sheer depths of human depravity that people will engage in when they think that they are in the right.

Almost like those folks who try and hide behind their bible and 'religious freedom' as an excuse to discriminate against LGBT couples and people. Yeah. I just compared pro-life to anachronistic hatred. Best part? Mine's closer than yours.

[Luminesa]

After a long absence, I have returned!

Well, think about it this way: it takes two to tango. If you don't want the child in the first place, don't have sex. This country has a MAJOR problem with dads walking out on their kids, and it has effected the culture at large dramatically. The idea that a dude can leave a girl with the baby and just...walk out...is very selfish.

Why should you have a say on a woman's decision? Because it wasn't just the woman's decision to have sex in the first place. Not to mention you have just created a life, when you have created a baby. Creating a human being is a pretty big thing, and abandoning it is, again, a tragedy.

And I saw "quality of life", and here's my thought: my little sister is disabled. She has cerebral palsy. Many people would say her "quality of life" is very small, and that she will never be capable of anything. Maybe she won't graduate from Harvard or send a rocket to the moon, but I can say that she is at the center of our family, and without her our family would have broken apart a long time ago. She is awesome, I don't care what anyone says.

1. Because Abstinence Only totally works for everyone ever... hold on have to replace my 'sploded sarcasmometer again.

2. Just because a guy boinked you does not give him permission to yammer in your face about what you do with your own body. If the woman wishes for the father's input, she can ask for it, otherwise... stfu. The man isn't the one carrying the pregnancy

3. Nice story. Irrelevant.

1.) It's all good. I wonder if they're on sale, somewhere. Hmmm...all goofing around aside, abstinence is the only way to not get pregnant 100% of the time. And again, a condom can break. And birth control does not always work.

2.) Well, here's the double-standard I've found. If a guy tells a girl not to get the abortion, people scream, "It's her body, you didn't carry the pregnancy, men don't have vaginas, etc." But if the man drags her to the car and tells her to get the abortion, nobody says a word. At least that I know of.

3.) I brought it up because I saw "quality of life", and that term always makes me cringe a bit...people like to say "quality of life" when they talk about disabled people and whatnot.

[Godular]

1. Because Abstinence Only totally works for everyone ever... hold on have to replace my 'sploded sarcasmometer again.

2. Just because a guy boinked you does not give him permission to yammer in your face about what you do with your own body. If the woman wishes for the father's input, she can ask for it, otherwise... stfu. The man isn't the one carrying the pregnancy

3. Nice story. Irrelevant.

1.) It's all good. I wonder if they're on sale, somewhere. Hmmm...all goofing around aside, abstinence is the only way to not get pregnant 100% of the time. And again, a condom can break. And birth control does not always work.

2.) Well, here's the double-standard I've found. If a guy tells a girl not to get the abortion, people scream, "It's her body, you didn't carry the pregnancy, men don't have vaginas, etc." But if the man drags her to the car and tells her to get the abortion, nobody says a word. At least that I know of.

3.) I brought it up because I saw "quality of life", and that term always makes me cringe a bit...people like to say "quality of life" when they talk about disabled people and whatnot.

1. Sex ain't just about getting pregnant. Now that I think about it, we haven't gotten into THAT subject in this thread yet, so lets go ahead and open THAT can of worms while we're here! (AKA Sex Feels Good. News at 11)

2. Source.

3. Irrelevant.

[Stormwind-City]

You don't want me to get on how to put a stent in the great cardiac vein.

Yeah, I probably don't.
Still, it's not just icky to think about. Most medical procedures ARE icky, come to think about. (Even a flu shot is uncomfortable, to say the least.) But the difference is that a flu shot can save a life. An abortion kills a life. A late-term abortion is, again, basically taking the child, smashing its skull, and then sucking the brain out. And a late-term abortion is on a viable child (third trimester). That doesn't sound like a very heroic act to me, no matter how anyone says abortion is a good thing.

And there are very few instances when a woman has an abortion because the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. I mean, as far as all the reasons go for a woman having an abortion. If you know what I mean.

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_procedure#Definition

[Stormwind-City]

1. Because Abstinence Only totally works for everyone ever... hold on have to replace my 'sploded sarcasmometer again.

2. Just because a guy boinked you does not give him permission to yammer in your face about what you do with your own body. If the woman wishes for the father's input, she can ask for it, otherwise... stfu. The man isn't the one carrying the pregnancy

3. Nice story. Irrelevant.

1.) It's all good. I wonder if they're on sale, somewhere. Hmmm...all goofing around aside, abstinence is the only way to not get pregnant 100% of the time. And again, a condom can break. And birth control does not always work.

2.) Well, here's the double-standard I've found. If a guy tells a girl not to get the abortion, people scream, "It's her body, you didn't carry the pregnancy, men don't have vaginas, etc." But if the man drags her to the car and tells her to get the abortion, nobody says a word. At least that I know of.

3.) I brought it up because I saw "quality of life", and that term always makes me cringe a bit...people like to say "quality of life" when they talk about disabled people and whatnot.

Forcing women to abort is just as despicable. Plenty of people decry it. Have you never heard of the protests against China's one child policy?

[Luminesa]

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

Well that's too bad, really. It's a medical procedure. Get over it.

I mean, sure, you can say that, but do you see why I compared it to the Holocaust?
1.) Millions of people are dying.
2.) Much of this activity is legal.
3.) Nurses and doctors are being made to perform abortions or possibly lose their jobs (in the UK. I'll have to go find the story.)
4.) It is aimed toward specific minorities, for the most part (Holocaust = Anybody who was not 'Aryan' (whatever the heck that means). Abortion = Majorly Hispanics and African-Americans.)
5.) Some of the experiments of the Holocaust were performed in offices, by psychos like Josef Mengele (not all abortionists are personally quite on his level of psychotic behavior, but their work is still vile.)
6.) Speaking out against said practices is sure to land you in the middle of a firestorm.

[Mavorpen]

I mean, sure, you can say that, but do you see why I compared it to the Holocaust?
1.) Millions of people are dying.
2.) Much of this activity is legal.
3.) Nurses and doctors are being made to perform abortions or possibly lose their jobs (in the UK. I'll have to go find the story.)
4.) It is aimed toward specific minorities, for the most part (Holocaust = Anybody who was not 'Aryan' (whatever the heck that means). Abortion = Majorly Hispanics and African-Americans.)
5.) Some of the experiments of the Holocaust were performed in offices, by psychos like Josef Mengele (not all abortionists are personally quite on his level of psychotic behavior, but their work is still vile.)
6.) Speaking out against said practices is sure to land you in the middle of a firestorm.

That's nice. Abortion is a medical procedure.

[Stormwind-City]

1.) It's all good. I wonder if they're on sale, somewhere. Hmmm...all goofing around aside, abstinence is the only way to not get pregnant 100% of the time. And again, a condom can break. And birth control does not always work.

2.) Well, here's the double-standard I've found. If a guy tells a girl not to get the abortion, people scream, "It's her body, you didn't carry the pregnancy, men don't have vaginas, etc." But if the man drags her to the car and tells her to get the abortion, nobody says a word. At least that I know of.

3.) I brought it up because I saw "quality of life", and that term always makes me cringe a bit...people like to say "quality of life" when they talk about disabled people and whatnot.

1. Sex ain't just about getting pregnant. Now that I think about it, we haven't gotten into THAT subject in this thread yet, so lets go ahead and open THAT can of worms while we're here! (AKA Sex Feels Good. News at 11)

2. Source.

3. Irrelevant.

Expanding on your point in #1.

The purpose of sex does is not reproduction. If reproduction was the end goal, evolution would have giving far more efficient ways to do so. In fact, the purpose of sex is to ensure greater genetic diversity in offspring, in order to better increase the chances of a beneficial mutation. Further more, sex, for social animals like us, helps social bonding and helps foster feelings of attachment.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Why should I have a say on a woman's decisions? As in, you're saying it, but you're not giving any reasons for it. Why should I know better than she does about her health when it comes to a pregnancy?

Yes, congratulations in demonstrating people are self-interested by catching that up. Why should it be a responsibility they have to take upon simply because you say so?

No, it definitely is. Here's a hypothetical: you are pregnant but the only way a child can come out is through your urethra (assuming we retain our current anatomy for some reason) would you do it and "take responsibility"?

And thank you for proving not all lives are equal.

After a long absence, I have returned!

Well, think about it this way: it takes two to tango. If you don't want the child in the first place, don't have sex. This country has a MAJOR problem with dads walking out on their kids, and it has effected the culture at large dramatically. The idea that a dude can leave a girl with the baby and just...walk out...is very selfish.

Why should you have a say on a woman's decision? Because it wasn't just the woman's decision to have sex in the first place. Not to mention you have just created a life, when you have created a baby. Creating a human being is a pretty big thing, and abandoning it is, again, a tragedy.

And I saw "quality of life", and here's my thought: my little sister is disabled. She has cerebral palsy. Many people would say her "quality of life" is very small, and that she will never be capable of anything. Maybe she won't graduate from Harvard or send a rocket to the moon, but I can say that she is at the center of our family, and without her our family would have broken apart a long time ago. She is awesome, I don't care what anyone says.

Yes, I understand that. That isn't my question though. My question is, why should I as a father (or as the male in the relationship, your pick) should have ANY say in what my partner does? Why should I stop her from actually seeking an abortion if she wants to get one?! And why should I try to stop her? Let's leave aside the fact that Christianity compels us to do so, let's assume for a second she is atheist or she is from another religion. Why should I interfere in her choices instead of supporting them if that's what she wants to do? I understand that parents walking out on kids is a problem, but that wasn't what my question was addressing.

Yes, I decided to have sex with the woman, but that doesn't mean that her pregnancy automatically makes her a subordinate to my decisions or my opinions. She can do whatever she wants, and I can either support her or leave and viceversa. She doesn't have to count with me for her decisions (even though I appreciate it if she does) and that includes abortion.

If your family is being held by one person then that family is more broken than you imagine. Also, different issues. Your sister already has as high as a quality of life as she's going to have, she can go higher, but she can't go lower. Someone sacrificing their quality of life for an inferior one? That's not so easy.

[Stormwind-City]

Well that's too bad, really. It's a medical procedure. Get over it.

I mean, sure, you can say that, but do you see why I compared it to the Holocaust?
1.) Millions of people are dying.
2.) Much of this activity is legal.
3.) Nurses and doctors are being made to perform abortions or possibly lose their jobs (in the UK. I'll have to go find the story.)
4.) It is aimed toward specific minorities, for the most part (Holocaust = Anybody who was not 'Aryan' (whatever the heck that means). Abortion = Majorly Hispanics and African-Americans.)
5.) Some of the experiments of the Holocaust were performed in offices, by psychos like Josef Mengele (not all abortionists are personally quite on his level of psychotic behavior, but their work is still vile.)
6.) Speaking out against said practices is sure to land you in the middle of a firestorm.

1) Prerequisites for being a person include having to have been born.
2) It is a medical procedure, so good.
3) You do your job, if you don't, you get fired.
4) It is aimed at those in poverty, to better able them to get out of it and then have a child when they can support it.
5) Legal abortions are performed in clean clinics overseen by medical professionals.
6) Yes, saying that 50% of the global population should be denied certain rights won't go down well.

[Luminesa]

Yeah, I probably don't.
Still, it's not just icky to think about. Most medical procedures ARE icky, come to think about. (Even a flu shot is uncomfortable, to say the least.) But the difference is that a flu shot can save a life. An abortion kills a life. A late-term abortion is, again, basically taking the child, smashing its skull, and then sucking the brain out. And a late-term abortion is on a viable child (third trimester). That doesn't sound like a very heroic act to me, no matter how anyone says abortion is a good thing.

And there are very few instances when a woman has an abortion because the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. I mean, as far as all the reasons go for a woman having an abortion. If you know what I mean.

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

Hmm. Lets see here, a woman deciding that she doesn't want to carry a pregnancy to term... compared to millions of actual PERSONS being systematically tortured and murdered in cold blood. I find myself entertained by the sheer depths of human depravity that people will engage in when they think that they are in the right.

Almost like those folks who try and hide behind their bible and 'religious freedom' as an excuse to discriminate against LGBT couples and people. Yeah. I just compared pro-life to anachronistic hatred. Best part? Mine's closer than yours.

I have no idea what you mean to accomplish by that first part. Abortion is indeed the systematic torture and murder of individuals in cold blood. And nobody has yet to give me a legal definition of 'personhood'. I'm talking legal documents, stating, "Okay, this here is a person, this here is not."

I am not depraved, and if I was I would be in the loony house. Now, I might have a ragingly-insane imagination, but that is only due to me watching too many cartoons and reading lots of books.

Um, here's my problem with the second part:
1.) There's a thread for homosexuality, if you want to talk about that. I don't mind.
2.) I don't discriminate against LGBT couples and people. I have relatives and friends who are gay, and I love them regardless. My problem is when a person says, "Well, I don't agree with gay marriage", and they get called "hateful, intolerant, bigot, etc." by society at large. Meanwhile, you have people in Oklahoma doing Satanic rituals, desecrating the Catholic Church's most precious teaching (Holy Eucharist), and nobody calls that "hateful, intolerant, bigoted, etc." I find this double-standard appalling.

I wouldn't say you're close. Problem is, calling the Church "hateful" is one of the most used arguments I have seen, when browsing the Internet. If you want to talk about the Church, send me a telegram and we can get down to it. Bottom line: the abortion industry is involved in a new sort of holocaust on unborn children. I'm pretty darn close. :/

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Well that's too bad, really. It's a medical procedure. Get over it.

I mean, sure, you can say that, but do you see why I compared it to the Holocaust?
1.) Millions of people are dying.
2.) Much of this activity is legal.
3.) Nurses and doctors are being made to perform abortions or possibly lose their jobs (in the UK. I'll have to go find the story.)
4.) It is aimed toward specific minorities, for the most part (Holocaust = Anybody who was not 'Aryan' (whatever the heck that means). Abortion = Majorly Hispanics and African-Americans.)
5.) Some of the experiments of the Holocaust were performed in offices, by psychos like Josef Mengele (not all abortionists are personally quite on his level of psychotic behavior, but their work is still vile.)
6.) Speaking out against said practices is sure to land you in the middle of a firestorm.

1. What the fuck?!
2. No it's not
3. In the UK and Ireland maybe, maybe; but not in the United States.
4. No it isn't. White women also use the service. Also, again, WTF?
5. What the fuck?!
6. No it doesn't.

[Stormwind-City]

Hmm. Lets see here, a woman deciding that she doesn't want to carry a pregnancy to term... compared to millions of actual PERSONS being systematically tortured and murdered in cold blood. I find myself entertained by the sheer depths of human depravity that people will engage in when they think that they are in the right.

Almost like those folks who try and hide behind their bible and 'religious freedom' as an excuse to discriminate against LGBT couples and people. Yeah. I just compared pro-life to anachronistic hatred. Best part? Mine's closer than yours.

I have no idea what you mean to accomplish by that first part. Abortion is indeed the systematic torture and murder of individuals in cold blood. And nobody has yet to give me a legal definition of 'personhood'. I'm talking legal documents, stating, "Okay, this here is a person, this here is not."

I am not depraved, and if I was I would be in the loony house. Now, I might have a ragingly-insane imagination, but that is only due to me watching too many cartoons and reading lots of books.

Um, here's my problem with the second part:
1.) There's a thread for homosexuality, if you want to talk about that. I don't mind.
2.) I don't discriminate against LGBT couples and people. I have relatives and friends who are gay, and I love them regardless. My problem is when a person says, "Well, I don't agree with gay marriage", and they get called "hateful, intolerant, bigot, etc." by society at large. Meanwhile, you have people in Oklahoma doing Satanic rituals, desecrating the Catholic Church's most precious teaching (Holy Eucharist), and nobody calls that "hateful, intolerant, bigoted, etc." I find this double-standard appalling.

I wouldn't say you're close. Problem is, calling the Church "hateful" is one of the most used arguments I have seen, when browsing the Internet. If you want to talk about the Church, send me a telegram and we can get down to it. Bottom line: the abortion industry is involved in a new sort of holocaust on unborn children. I'm pretty darn close. :/

The legal definition of a person is as follows:
Person Legal Definition:
An entity recognized by the law as separate and independent, with legal rights and existence including the ability to sue and be sued, to sign contracts, to receive gifts, to appear in court either by themselves or by lawyer and, generally, other powers incidental to the full expression of the entity in law.

(You might want to use the medical definition instead, I'd trust doctors and biologists on this subject more than politicians and lawyers)

[Soldati Senza Confini]

You don't want me to get on how to put a stent in the great cardiac vein.

Yeah, I probably don't.
Still, it's not just icky to think about. Most medical procedures ARE icky, come to think about. (Even a flu shot is uncomfortable, to say the least.) But the difference is that a flu shot can save a life. An abortion kills a life. A late-term abortion is, again, basically taking the child, smashing its skull, and then sucking the brain out. And a late-term abortion is on a viable child (third trimester). That doesn't sound like a very heroic act to me, no matter how anyone says abortion is a good thing.

And there are very few instances when a woman has an abortion because the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. I mean, as far as all the reasons go for a woman having an abortion. If you know what I mean.

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

Getting a stent for one of your arteries/veins because they have figured that your heart's bloodflow percentage is lower due to cholesterol in your arteries/veins is just about the same. Or are you saying that any sort of medical procedure which is icky should be banned because "God knows what he's doing"?

Also, no, it's not that. Where the fuck are you getting this information? Maybe on late-term abortions but how the fuck can you smash a skull and suck the brain out of a first to second-trimester fetus?

[Soldati Senza Confini]

I have no idea what you mean to accomplish by that first part. Abortion is indeed the systematic torture and murder of individuals in cold blood. And nobody has yet to give me a legal definition of 'personhood'. I'm talking legal documents, stating, "Okay, this here is a person, this here is not."

I am not depraved, and if I was I would be in the loony house. Now, I might have a ragingly-insane imagination, but that is only due to me watching too many cartoons and reading lots of books.

Um, here's my problem with the second part:
1.) There's a thread for homosexuality, if you want to talk about that. I don't mind.
2.) I don't discriminate against LGBT couples and people. I have relatives and friends who are gay, and I love them regardless. My problem is when a person says, "Well, I don't agree with gay marriage", and they get called "hateful, intolerant, bigot, etc." by society at large. Meanwhile, you have people in Oklahoma doing Satanic rituals, desecrating the Catholic Church's most precious teaching (Holy Eucharist), and nobody calls that "hateful, intolerant, bigoted, etc." I find this double-standard appalling.

I wouldn't say you're close. Problem is, calling the Church "hateful" is one of the most used arguments I have seen, when browsing the Internet. If you want to talk about the Church, send me a telegram and we can get down to it. Bottom line: the abortion industry is involved in a new sort of holocaust on unborn children. I'm pretty darn close. :/

The legal definition of a person is as follows:
Person Legal Definition:
An entity recognized by the law as separate and independent, with legal rights and existence including the ability to sue and be sued, to sign contracts, to receive gifts, to appear in court either by themselves or by lawyer and, generally, other powers incidental to the full expression of the entity in law.

(You might want to use the medical definition instead, I'd trust doctors and biologists on this subject more than politicians and lawyers)

Doctors don't have a medical definition for personhood. But, if you need a good source for how some doctors view personhood in biomedical ethics, here you go:

http://ethics.missouri.edu/personhood.aspx

[Luminesa]

1.) It's all good. I wonder if they're on sale, somewhere. Hmmm...all goofing around aside, abstinence is the only way to not get pregnant 100% of the time. And again, a condom can break. And birth control does not always work.

2.) Well, here's the double-standard I've found. If a guy tells a girl not to get the abortion, people scream, "It's her body, you didn't carry the pregnancy, men don't have vaginas, etc." But if the man drags her to the car and tells her to get the abortion, nobody says a word. At least that I know of.

3.) I brought it up because I saw "quality of life", and that term always makes me cringe a bit...people like to say "quality of life" when they talk about disabled people and whatnot.

1. Sex ain't just about getting pregnant. Now that I think about it, we haven't gotten into THAT subject in this thread yet, so lets go ahead and open THAT can of worms while we're here! (AKA Sex Feels Good. News at 11)

2. Source.

3. Irrelevant.

1.) Pretty sure we got into that. Yep, sex is also about feeling good and making bonds with your husband/wife. It's not a bad thing.

2.) Gimme a second:

http://rhrealitycheck.org/article/2014/ ... on-rights/
(This is what abortion activists say to a guy who wants to keep the baby.)

http://saynsumthn.wordpress.com/2010/10 ... -abortion/
(Here's just one story where a guy beats his girlfriend for not having an abortion. As you can plainly see, when this woman and her baby are traumatized, Planned Parenthood and pro-choice activists are clearly missing from the picture. If they really cared about women, they would have heard about this case and spoken up.)

3.) Okay, your point?

[Stormwind-City]

Yeah, I probably don't.
Still, it's not just icky to think about. Most medical procedures ARE icky, come to think about. (Even a flu shot is uncomfortable, to say the least.) But the difference is that a flu shot can save a life. An abortion kills a life. A late-term abortion is, again, basically taking the child, smashing its skull, and then sucking the brain out. And a late-term abortion is on a viable child (third trimester). That doesn't sound like a very heroic act to me, no matter how anyone says abortion is a good thing.

And there are very few instances when a woman has an abortion because the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. I mean, as far as all the reasons go for a woman having an abortion. If you know what I mean.

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

Getting a stent for one of your arteries/veins because they have figured that your heart's bloodflow percentage is lower due to cholesterol in your arteries/veins is just about the same. Or are you saying that any sort of medical procedure which is icky should be banned because "God knows what he's doing"?

Also, no, it's not that. Where the fuck are you getting this information? Maybe on late-term abortions but how the fuck can you smash a skull and suck the brain out of a first to second-trimester fetus?

A 3rd trimester abortion would use chemically induced premature birth or c-section, with the now new child being placed into an incubator(?) Until its able to be given to the care of the parents or the state.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

1. Sex ain't just about getting pregnant. Now that I think about it, we haven't gotten into THAT subject in this thread yet, so lets go ahead and open THAT can of worms while we're here! (AKA Sex Feels Good. News at 11)

2. Source.

3. Irrelevant.

1.) Pretty sure we got into that. Yep, sex is also about feeling good and making bonds with your husband/wife. It's not a bad thing.

2.) Gimme a second:

http://rhrealitycheck.org/article/2014/ ... on-rights/
(This is what abortion activists say to a guy who wants to keep the baby.)

http://saynsumthn.wordpress.com/2010/10 ... -abortion/
(Here's just one story where a guy beats his girlfriend for not having an abortion. As you can plainly see, when this woman and her baby are traumatized, Planned Parenthood and pro-choice activists are clearly missing from the picture. If they really cared about women, they would have heard about this case and spoken up.)

3.) Okay, your point?

On point two:

Yes, the guy has no right to choose for the woman, at all. It's the woman's choice. His putting his foot down is kind of irrelevant. Also, a man beating a woman because she doesn't have an abortion is equally wrong. A woman should be free to choose without coercion, and whatever decision she takes we as men have to respect it and either support it or not, but beating a woman isn't right (unless in self-defense).

[Luminesa]

Yeah, I probably don't.
Still, it's not just icky to think about. Most medical procedures ARE icky, come to think about. (Even a flu shot is uncomfortable, to say the least.) But the difference is that a flu shot can save a life. An abortion kills a life. A late-term abortion is, again, basically taking the child, smashing its skull, and then sucking the brain out. And a late-term abortion is on a viable child (third trimester). That doesn't sound like a very heroic act to me, no matter how anyone says abortion is a good thing.

And there are very few instances when a woman has an abortion because the pregnancy threatens the life of the mother. I mean, as far as all the reasons go for a woman having an abortion. If you know what I mean.

(Though I would not call an abortion a medical procedure myself...that would be like saying killing people in gas chambers is a 'medical procedure'. Yes, I just compared abortion to the Holocaust.)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_procedure#Definition

I know what a medical procedure is. My parents are both nurses.

I don't like to call it medicine because medicine is meant to preserve life, not take it away.

[Mavorpen]

2.) Gimme a second:

http://rhrealitycheck.org/article/2014/ ... on-rights/
(This is what abortion activists say to a guy who wants to keep the baby.)

It's true. Men don't own women, so they have no say in what a woman does with their body. So what's the problem?

http://saynsumthn.wordpress.com/2010/10 ... -abortion/
(Here's just one story where a guy beats his girlfriend for not having an abortion. As you can plainly see, when this woman and her baby are traumatized, Planned Parenthood and pro-choice activists are clearly missing from the picture. If they really cared about women, they would have heard about this case and spoken up.)

So you're chastising people for not being omniscient?

[Soldati Senza Confini]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_procedure#Definition

I know what a medical procedure is. My parents are both nurses.

I don't like to call it medicine because medicine is meant to preserve life, not take it away.

And I've studied my brother's books on the subject of medicine and I read medicine for fun.

Medicine is not meant to preserve life, that's not the job of doctors.

[Mavorpen]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_procedure#Definition

I know what a medical procedure is. My parents are both nurses.

I don't like to call it medicine because medicine is meant to preserve life, not take it away.

Bullshit. It's meant to heal. Medicine doesn't have the goal to preserve life. If it did, it would be a failure because we all die.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

I know what a medical procedure is. My parents are both nurses.

I don't like to call it medicine because medicine is meant to preserve life, not take it away.

Bullshit. It's meant to heal. Medicine doesn't have the goal to preserve life. If it did, it would be a failure because we all die.

Medicine doesn't even have healing as a goal.

There's certain diseases which doctors are not able to heal yet.