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Can humans "choose" religion?

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Conkerials
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Postby Conkerials » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:47 pm

Archeuland and Baughistan wrote:I think that Christianity is the truth, but people hop from religion to religion all the time. In most cases, it's from Christianity to secular atheism. I know the Christian church will always live on, though, even with a small remnant.

It'll be really funny if it becomes like the Hellenistic religions in that the only people who practice it are trying to be cool and edgy.
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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:50 pm

The OP should have made it clearer.
Do you choose what you believe?
No, you either believe or you don't
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Postby Salandriagado » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:51 pm

Religion, absolutely. Belief, no.
Cosara wrote:
Anachronous Rex wrote:Good thing most a majority of people aren't so small-minded, and frightened of other's sexuality.

Over 40% (including me), are, so I fixed the post for accuracy.

Vilatania wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:
Notice that the link is to the notes from a university course on probability. You clearly have nothing beyond the most absurdly simplistic understanding of the subject.
By choosing 1, you no longer have 0 probability of choosing 1. End of subject.

(read up the quote stack)

Deal. £3000 do?[/quote]

Of course.[/quote]


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Bunkeranlage
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Postby Bunkeranlage » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:52 pm

I used to be an atheist, but I'm a Christian now.
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Opplandia
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Postby Opplandia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:53 pm

after reading through this, I would say it sums up to this: you cant choose that you believe, but you can choose what you believe.
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Conscentia
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Postby Conscentia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:54 pm

Bunkeranlage wrote:I used to be an atheist, but I'm a Christian now.

Wait... What? Why? Of all the religions why Christianity? Jesus isn't even the messiah - the entire religion is based on a lie.
Last edited by Conscentia on Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Parhe
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Can humans "choose" religion?

Postby Parhe » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:55 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:Religion, absolutely. Belief, no.

Given that religion is dependent on belief, and belief is not a choice, religion cannot be a choice.

Maybe he means how some people decide not to identify with a religious group (even though in my opinion if they belief the same core then they are, more or less).
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Infected Mushroom
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Postby Infected Mushroom » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:55 pm

Australian Republic wrote:The OP should have made it clearer.
Do you choose what you believe?
No, you either believe or you don't


Exactly.

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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:55 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Salandriagado wrote:Religion, absolutely. Belief, no.

Given that religion is dependent on belief, and belief is not a choice, religion cannot be a choice.

Beliefe is yes you believe. Religion, to a certain extent is how you choose believe. Not to the degree that someone who believes that Christ is God can be a Christian, but can certainly choose between Catholicism and Anglicanism. Also, you may believe in God but choose not to practice the religion. You don't follow any laws, rituals, ceramonies etc. but just acknowledge God's existance
Last edited by Australian rePublic on Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Conscentia
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Postby Conscentia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:58 pm

Australian Republic wrote:
Conscentia wrote:Given that religion is dependent on belief, and belief is not a choice, religion cannot be a choice.

Beliefe is yes you believe. Religion, to a certain extent is how you choose believe. Not to the degree that someone who believes that Christ is God can be a Christian, but can certainly choose between Catholicism and Anglicanism

They're part of the same religion.

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Bunkeranlage
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Postby Bunkeranlage » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:58 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Bunkeranlage wrote:I used to be an atheist, but I'm a Christian now.

Wait... What? Why? Of all the religions why Christianity? Jesus isn't even the messiah - the entire religion is based on a lie.


You have your reasons, I have my own.

It's a pretty long story.
Last edited by Bunkeranlage on Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Sun Wukong
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Postby Sun Wukong » Thu Nov 27, 2014 3:59 pm

Apparently some people can just "decide" to believe this or that. It never made any sense to me. I never could.

But, choice or no, comparing belief to race, as the OP does, is misguided. Even if they aren't chosen, beliefs are malleable. Attempting to alter the beliefs of others, to form consensus on important subjects, is the primary mechanism by which society operates. Religious beliefs deserve no privileged status.
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Anollasia
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Postby Anollasia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:01 pm

Of course you can choose religion. Maybe not the one you were raised with but you can definitely convert to a different religion later on (if your country allows you to).

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Conscentia
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Postby Conscentia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:02 pm

Bunkeranlage wrote:
Conscentia wrote:Wait... What? Why? Of all the religions why Christianity? Jesus isn't even the messiah - the entire religion is based on a lie.

You have your reasons, I have my own.
It's a pretty long story.

The length of your story is irrelevant. Jesus is objectively not the messiah. There's a link in my signature focused on it.

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Senyosu
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Postby Senyosu » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:03 pm

Define 'choose' and 'choice' and 'free will' first.

So for now, fence sitting, it seems to a certain extent we choose what we wish to believe.
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Australian rePublic
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Postby Australian rePublic » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:03 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Australian Republic wrote:Beliefe is yes you believe. Religion, to a certain extent is how you choose believe. Not to the degree that someone who believes that Christ is God can be a Christian, but can certainly choose between Catholicism and Anglicanism

They're part of the same religion.

Yes, Iam aware of that. However, the practices, rituals, ceramonies etc. Are completely different.
To some extent the beliefes are different. For example, us Orthodox Christians believe in Saints etc. Whilst Anglicans don't, but I won't even get in to that.

For example, if you were to walk into an Orthodox Church in Australia and an Anglican Church in Australia, you would see significant differences in dress code, decor, etc. You would even think that they're different religions
Hard-Core Centrist. Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right.
All in-character posts are fictional and have no actual connection to any real governments
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Sun Wukong
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Postby Sun Wukong » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:03 pm

Anollasia wrote:Of course you can choose religion. Maybe not the one you were raised with but you can definitely convert to a different religion later on (if your country allows you to).

Explain to me how I would do that?

I do not currently believe in the supremacy of Marduk. How do I go about choosing to believe that such a being exists, and rules the universe?
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MERIZoC
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Postby MERIZoC » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:04 pm

Yes, people do it all the time.

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Bunkeranlage
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Postby Bunkeranlage » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:05 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Bunkeranlage wrote:You have your reasons, I have my own.
It's a pretty long story.

The length of your story is irrelevant. Jesus is objectively not the messiah. There's a link in my signature focused on it.


Yes, I've read it, but I don't find it convincing in the least. Many of the verses are taken out of context and/or wilfully misinterpreted to some extent.

(Don't think this is an appropriate place to discuss this, tho... You could take it to TGs if you like)
~+~+~ RIP, Mr. Lee | (1923 - 2015) ~+~+~
Economic Left: 4.00 Social Libertarian: 1.59 | Ich bin INFP
My Manga Gallery | Bertrand Russell: The Case for Socialism | On Holocaust Denial | My Views
"What a talentless bastard! It irritates me that this self-fellated mediocrity is acclaimed as genius."

- P. I. Tchaikovsky, on Brahms

~+~+~+~

"I liked everything about the opera. Everything, except for the music."

- B. Britten, on Stravinsky's The Rake's Progress

~+~+~+~

"Hell is full of musical amateurs."

- George Bernard Shaw

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Sun Wukong
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Postby Sun Wukong » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:06 pm

Australian Republic wrote:
Conscentia wrote:They're part of the same religion.

Yes, Iam aware of that. However, the practices, rituals, ceramonies etc. Are completely different.
To some extent the beliefes are different. For example, us Orthodox Christians believe in Saints etc. Whilst Anglicans don't, but I won't even get in to that.

For example, if you were to walk into an Orthodox Church in Australia and an Anglican Church in Australia, you would see significant differences in dress code, decor, etc. You would even think that they're different religions

Oh pish. They're essentially exactly the same. Completely different would be one group jumping up and down repeatedly with spears in their hands to bongo music, while the other congregation runs a huge paper dragon down the aisle.
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Conscentia
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Postby Conscentia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:07 pm

Australian Republic wrote:
Conscentia wrote:They're part of the same religion.

Yes, Iam aware of that. However, the practices, rituals, ceramonies etc. Are completely different.
To some extent the beliefes are different. For example, us Orthodox Christians believe in Saints etc. Whilst Anglicans don't, but I won't even get in to that.

For example, if you were to walk into an Orthodox Church in Australia and an Anglican Church in Australia, you would see significant differences in dress code, decor, etc. You would even think that they're different religions

:eyebrow: Anglicanism does have saints.

The Anglican church split with the Catholic for largely political reasons. Differences between it and the Orthodox result from the Great Schism between Catholicism and Orthodoxy, and aesthetic differences are probably cultural in origin.

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Senyosu
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Postby Senyosu » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:07 pm

Bunkeranlage wrote:
Conscentia wrote:The length of your story is irrelevant. Jesus is objectively not the messiah. There's a link in my signature focused on it.


Yes, I've read it, but I don't find it convincing in the least. Many of the verses are taken out of context and/or wilfully misinterpreted to some extent.

(Don't think this is an appropriate place to discuss this, tho... You could take it to TGs if you like)

Sola scriptura is not reliable.
Senyosu is under reconstruction, however, former tropes still apply

The State of Senyosu ― Senñosy-ül Jür

Your resident Frugal, Nationalistic, Quasi-Jingoist, Buddhist-Tengrist, North-East Asian, Technocratic, Democratic Khanate
anything u want me to be babe ;)

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Anollasia
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Postby Anollasia » Thu Nov 27, 2014 4:07 pm

Sun Wukong wrote:
Anollasia wrote:Of course you can choose religion. Maybe not the one you were raised with but you can definitely convert to a different religion later on (if your country allows you to).

Explain to me how I would do that?

I do not currently believe in the supremacy of Marduk. How do I go about choosing to believe that such a being exists, and rules the universe?


What's Marduk?

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