"Get Off Of My Side!": Embarrassing Allies

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

How would we go about pressuring them?

I'm pretty fucking sure if Brazil, Europe and Japan unite, they can bully Canada, Australia and America into the program. And then we can pester China and Russia.

The issue is neither of us three got the balls for it.

[Glorious Freedonia]

I am a conservative Republican and am very embarrassed by the vocal pro life crowd. They are liberals and do not even know it. There is nothing small government about pro lifery

They're enemies of liberty... they're not liberal by any definition.

Personally I've always been frustrated by liberal kids who worship Che Guevara with no understanding of him. If you're a liberal who embraces capitalist economics of any sort, or a socialist who rejects Leninist authoritarianism Guevara is your enemy. Just because he's the enemy of some of your enemies doesn't make him not your enemy as well.

Conservatism is pro liberty. Liberalism is pro equality. Actually both are for liberty and equality but if there is a dilemma conservatives favor liberty and liberals favor equality. Also there is the idea that liberals tend to approve of the liberal use of governmental power to try to accomplish good ie big government and conservatives tend to approve of the conservative use of governmental power to try to accomplish the good ie. small government.

Under either of these definitions prolifers are liberals but it is more fitting in the big govt vs small govt dichotomy.

[Anglo-California]

I really dislike the members of the alternative right who worship Putin, Christianity, and the Confederate States.

[Zunkwentania]

How would we go about pressuring them?

I'm pretty fucking sure if Brazil, Europe and Japan unite, they can bully Canada, Australia and America into the program. And then we can pester China and Russia.

The issue is neither of us three got the balls for it.

Yes, I do believe that could happen. However, there are too many oil, gas and coal interests in those countries. Australia, for example, repealed a carbon tax, which isn't surprising. Australia's mining business is huge. Alberta's economy is dependent on oil sands- i.e. using cheap natural gas to extract dirty, expensive to produce tar, which has to be delivered to specialized refineries. And with the recent oil and gas boom and the newly approved Keystone XL pipeline, not much looks like it will change.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

Conservatism is pro liberty. Liberalism is pro equality. Actually both are for liberty and equality but if there is a dilemma conservatives favor liberty and liberals favor equality. Also there is the idea that liberals tend to approve of the liberal use of governmental power to try to accomplish good ie big government and conservatives tend to approve of the conservative use of governmental power to try to accomplish the good ie. small government.

Under either of these definitions prolifers are liberals but it is more fitting in the big govt vs small govt dichotomy.

Anti-choicers are just authoritarians.

Your premise is flawed and relies on a number of gross oversimplifications.

Firstly, the entire "big government" vs. "small government" dichotomy is nonsense. Conservatives typically favour increased military expenditures, increasing authority to the various intelligence agencies, more power to police and so on. You seem to be conflating conservative values with libertarian values. Conservatives are typically not libertarians.

Conservatives seem to believe banning all sorts of 'vice' will cause it to disappear. They believe in using the state to achieve this end. Clearly this is counter to your examples and would make conservatives who support vice laws liberals by your definition.

Your argument makes sense so long as your re-defining of terms is accepted, but you can't just redefine existing terms to suit your needs.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

How would we go about pressuring them?

I'm pretty fucking sure if Brazil, Europe and Japan unite, they can bully Canada, Australia and America into the program. And then we can pester China and Russia.

The issue is neither of us three got the balls for it.

You know, Canada will be back on the right side once Harper is out of office.

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

Yes, I do believe that could happen. However, there are too many oil, gas and coal interests in those countries. Australia, for example, repealed a carbon tax, which isn't surprising. Australia's mining business is huge. Alberta's economy is dependent on oil sands- i.e. using cheap natural gas to extract dirty, expensive tar, which has to be delivered to specialized refineries. And with the recent oil and gas boom and the newly approved Keystone XL pipeline, not much looks like it will change.

The Japanese, Brazilian and euro economies are already bad, so is the Russian one, so there's nothing really vital to get from the US. They wouldn't have the power to hold too much, and I think Obama would be pretty favorable. We could use this as a pretext to use sanctions. Even though Russia is also heavily polluting, I think their leaders would love this opportunity of a break between the Western poles.

Sadly, this won't happen at least in this generation. *sigh*

[New Kvenland]

I'm a Christian liberal socialist, meaning I'm technically allied with Westboro Baptist Church and neo-Soviet Union supporters.

[Laerod]

Conservatism is pro liberty. Liberalism is pro equality.

You can't just redefine terms like that.

[Laerod]

I'm a Social Democrat and an environmentalist and I can't stand the anti GMO and anti nuclear nuts. They think they are making the world a better place, but all they do is campaign for lowering the world's food supply because they're scared of proven safe technology, and increase our dependence on fossil fuels.

Proven safe technology? What the flying fuck? You know, some of us remember Chernobyl. And proven safe? Maybe it's different in other countries, but the state of German nuclear waste disposal is beyond nightmarish. The current estimate is that about 2000 barrels of nuclear waste are damaged to some degree, a good deal of them rusted completely through. And that estimate is based primarily on the statements of the same people that have been lying about the suitability of areas for storing nuclear waste and storing waste in a blatantly illegal fashion. And sure, we're "safe" because the radiation won't reach the surface. Unless of course the storage site is leaking groundwater.

[Meryuma]

I suppose the stereotypical SJWs who hold broadly the right core values but have an alarming inability to prioritize, take a joke or take a look at the bigger picture.

It's a real pain when you've posted a fairly detailed rebuttal to something and then everyone pays attention instead to the person who's just gone "muh triggers" and it's like you're not even really there.

Eh, it depends.

People using autism as an insult are really inappropriate in many spaces.

Yeah, fuck that. I fear that autistic is the new gay in terms of marginalized

I'm a Social Democrat and an environmentalist and I can't stand the anti GMO and anti nuclear nuts. They think they are making the world a better place, but all they do is campaign for lowering the world's food supply because they're scared of proven safe technology, and increase our dependence on fossil fuels.

GMOs and nuclear power are both industrial patches on problems caused by industry in the first place, and that's not even getting into the ecologically nightmarish mining required for mass nuclear power or the brutal IP serfdom instated by companies such as Monsanto.

This brings me to another set of embarassing allies: anti-science people making opposition to industrial development look bad.

[Sebastianbourg]

The thing is I don't know whether I belong in the radical-centre or the centre-left.

[Ragnarokee]

Those who support Stalin.



This guy, for example...

Great Comrade Joseph Stalin was a true hero and an inspiration for all mankind.

Apart from his psycho paranoia. Yea. He actually was.

And apart from the millions of people Hitler murdered he actually benefited Germany a lot.

[The Orson Empire]

I am a progressive Christian, but I hate it when I get lumped with Christian fundamentalists, as I do not believe in fundamentalism.

[Souriya Al-Assad]

Sadly a lot of racist people support Christian fundamentalism and authoritarianism.

I noticed quite a few, moreover some of them I realise are borderline Zionist & Wahhabi in their mindsets.

[Jordsindia]

I find myself agreeing with Rush Limbaugh and Mark Levin on many issues, such as small government, lower taxes, cuts in spending, abortion, etc etc.

Sadly, they are both pricks, especially Levin. Levin is an ass and treats his listeners like shit. Limbaugh kisses big oil and tobacco companies asses for more cash. They are somewhat bigoted, but not nearly to the extent people say they are.

[New Connorstantinople]

Really, the Conservative types who bring a bad name to things like strict intepretations of the constitution, christian-esque morals, the typically conservative foreign policy and economics with things like religious fundementalism and social authoritarianism.

[Lolloh]

I'm in favor of Communism/Socialism, but there are, unfortunately, some people who are horrible for my side:

Marx: As soon as you bring this guy up, the conservatives in the room go into McCarthy mode and refuse to listen to any argument you have to say, even if you outright refute Marxist ideology.
Lenin: Again, while he had some good policies, people associate him with bad things, so mentioning him as an example of communism gone good (which was actually the case, see his New Economic Policy) people will tune you out as another crazy evil dirty commie
Stalin: He supported better agricultural and industrial problems, equality, and true communism. The downside? He's probably the largest mass-murderer in history.
Mao: Stalin, but still applies today, since Communist China lives on.
Obama: Now, I know what your thinking, but I feel like Obama is just doing a poor job of standing up for his ideals (or alleged ideals), and keeps shooting himself in the foot over just about everything. That is to say: I fully support his programs, just not the way he's pitching them to the US, and especially moderate voters.

[New Connorstantinople]

I find myself agreeing with Rush Limbaugh and Mark Levin on many issues, such as small government, lower taxes, cuts in spending, abortion, etc etc.

Sadly, they are both pricks, especially Levin. Levin is an ass and treats his listeners like shit. Limbaugh kisses big oil and tobacco companies asses for more cash. They are somewhat bigoted, but not nearly to the extent people say they are.

For the most part agreed

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

I'm in favor of Communism/Socialism, but there are, unfortunately, some people who are horrible for my side:

Marx: As soon as you bring this guy up, the conservatives in the room go into McCarthy mode and refuse to listen to any argument you have to say, even if you outright refute Marxist ideology.
Lenin: Again, while he had some good policies, people associate him with bad things, so mentioning him as an example of communism gone good (which was actually the case, see his New Economic Policy) people will tune you out as another crazy evil dirty commie
Stalin: He supported better agricultural and industrial problems, equality, and true communism. The downside? He's probably the largest mass-murderer in history.
Mao: Stalin, but still applies today, since Communist China lives on.
Obama: Now, I know what your thinking, but I feel like Obama is just doing a poor job of standing up for his ideals (or alleged ideals), and keeps shooting himself in the foot over just about everything. That is to say: I fully support his programs, just not the way he's pitching them to the US, and especially moderate voters.

Oh my god Obama in that list OBAMA IN THAT LIST I'M LAUGHING SO HARD

[New Connorstantinople]

I'm in favor of Communism/Socialism, but there are, unfortunately, some people who are horrible for my side:

Marx: As soon as you bring this guy up, the conservatives in the room go into McCarthy mode and refuse to listen to any argument you have to say, even if you outright refute Marxist ideology.
Lenin: Again, while he had some good policies, people associate him with bad things, so mentioning him as an example of communism gone good (which was actually the case, see his New Economic Policy) people will tune you out as another crazy evil dirty commie
Stalin: He supported better agricultural and industrial problems, equality, and true communism. The downside? He's probably the largest mass-murderer in history.
Mao: Stalin, but still applies today, since Communist China lives on.
Obama: Now, I know what your thinking, but I feel like Obama is just doing a poor job of standing up for his ideals (or alleged ideals), and keeps shooting himself in the foot over just about everything. That is to say: I fully support his programs, just not the way he's pitching them to the US, and especially moderate voters.

Youd likely be better off not looking for right-wing approval of communism

[Jamzmania]

I'm pretty fucking sure if Brazil, Europe and Japan unite, they can bully Canada, Australia and America into the program. And then we can pester China and Russia.

The issue is neither of us three got the balls for it.

Yes, I do believe that could happen. However, there are too many oil, gas and coal interests in those countries. Australia, for example, repealed a carbon tax, which isn't surprising. Australia's mining business is huge. Alberta's economy is dependent on oil sands- i.e. using cheap natural gas to extract dirty, expensive to produce tar, which has to be delivered to specialized refineries. And with the recent oil and gas boom and the newly approved Keystone XL pipeline, not much looks like it will change.

The Keystone XL pipeline was not approved, actually. It failed by one vote.

[Soviet Haaregrad]

I'm in favor of Communism/Socialism, but there are, unfortunately, some people who are horrible for my side:

Marx: As soon as you bring this guy up, the conservatives in the room go into McCarthy mode and refuse to listen to any argument you have to say, even if you outright refute Marxist ideology.
Lenin: Again, while he had some good policies, people associate him with bad things, so mentioning him as an example of communism gone good (which was actually the case, see his New Economic Policy) people will tune you out as another crazy evil dirty commie
Stalin: He supported better agricultural and industrial problems, equality, and true communism. The downside? He's probably the largest mass-murderer in history.
Mao: Stalin, but still applies today, since Communist China lives on.
Obama: Now, I know what your thinking, but I feel like Obama is just doing a poor job of standing up for his ideals (or alleged ideals), and keeps shooting himself in the foot over just about everything. That is to say: I fully support his programs, just not the way he's pitching them to the US, and especially moderate voters.

Youd likely be better off not looking for right-wing approval of communism

The issue isn't right-wing approval, it's that certain names are thought-terminating cliches for right-wingers (not to say that the same observation can't be applied to non-right wingers).

[Lolloh]

Oh my god Obama in that list OBAMA IN THAT LIST I'M LAUGHING SO HARD

Mebbe.

Youd likely be better off not looking for right-wing approval of communism

Probably, but I'd at least to tone it down until they at least tolerate communism as something it's okay to live under, like Emperor Obama and his death panels.

[New Connorstantinople]

Youd likely be better off not looking for right-wing approval of communism

Probably, but I'd at least to tone it down until they at least tolerate communism as something it's okay to live under, like Emperor Obama and his death panels.[/quote]
Well then youre right, Communism has far to bad of a record for their to be any notion of acceptance under right wingers.