Worst Leader your (RL) Country ever had?

[New Socialist South Africa]

You realize, of course, that policy-wise, Obama is actually just a touch to the right of Eisenhower.

Clearly the qualifier then is that Obama hasn't toppled enough democratically elected governments at the behest of multinational corporations.

Being right wing does not mean you topple democracies, that would be if you were more authoritarian. Eisenhower couldn't care less if other nations were democracies or dictatorships, just as long as they were pro-US and capitalist democracies and dictatorships.

Being right wing consists of economic policies such as giving tax cuts, particularly when those are given to the super-rich and corporations. Of course the Communist-Socialist-Marxist-Maoist Obama would never do anything like ... of wait he did.

[New Socialist South Africa]

Amazuma. And I thought we couldn't possibly get any worse with Mbeki.

I can only assume you're not counting the Apartheid prime-ministers. If so I must concur.

[Walhammra]

Sverige

King Charles XII.

I'd disagree. He didn't start the Great Nordic War but he managed to reduce the - territorial - losses overall through his actions. Lost an entire generation with his disastrous invasion of Russia, though.

For worst I'd probably say Gustav IV, Kristina or Karl X.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

You realize, of course, that policy-wise, Obama is actually just a touch to the right of Eisenhower.

Clearly the qualifier then is that Obama hasn't toppled enough democratically elected governments at the behest of multinational corporations.

Hey, he's bombing as much as he can! Get off of his back!

[Imperium Nova]

Sverige

King Charles XII.

I'd disagree. He didn't start the Great Nordic War but he managed to reduce the - territorial - losses overall through his actions. Lost an entire generation with his disastrous invasion of Russia, though.

For worst I'd probably say Gustav IV, Kristina or Karl X.

I can agree with Gustav IV Adolf, who in his vehement opposition to Napoleon brought Sweden to the brink of destruction, and Kristina who choose to absicate the throne and convert to catholicism, the same faith that her father had fought against and died fighting, and also her taking several ships filled with treasures from Sweden. However I am not so sure about Karl X Gustav, he was militarily gifted and essentially defeated the entirety of Poland before the Danes declared war on him. He captured Jylland, and then rode across the fraking ice shocking the Danish King so much that he had to beg for peace. The only mistake he truly made was accept that peace, but perhaps he ha ba memories of over-extending from his time in Poland.

As for Karl XII, I would not say he was a bad king, at the age of 18 he had three major kingdoms declare war on him, and he managed to essentially beat them all in a miraculois speed, just a year or two into the war they had all demanded white peace several times. But his determination to always win the wars that he fought. He was a capable administrator as well, thinking avout new tax laws and wha not. However his diplomatic skills could have been better. Militarily speaking he was nothing short of a genius, losing only a single battle, (Poltava) at which he was not even present.

[The zombie empire]

lincoln*
Buchanan wasn't president at the time.

Buchanan did absolutely nothing to stop the civil war from occurring. He let the situation spiral out of control, and left Lincoln with a nation in near-shambles. Lincoln was essential a hero for America.

[Firsthome]

For the U.S. it's President Obama, wish i could just kick him out of the White House, ugh he irritates everyone.

He's too conservative for me....

He feels like a dictator.

But then again, the fucking governments treating to take me away if I don't clean my house

Fucking CFY services need to burn in hell. My parents are fine

Fuck you government

[Villa Mercedes]

Nestor Kirchner

Are you kidding me? It was Nestor Kirchner who gave people the desire to be involved in politics, to fight for their ideals, believing that it is possible to live in a better country. It was Nestor's government which chose to choose for the people and not for the large corporations. It was Nestor's government which gave Argentina the desire to discuss laws. It was Nestor's government which chose to return to the present, it was Nestor who decided to continue the trials against the military junta members. Nestor wasn't the best President ever. But he was what Argentina needed: he lived for Argentina and died for Argentina.

Kirchner was a corrupt douchebag who destroyed the Argentinean mentality. Nestor was an absolute idiot who caused an fiscal deficit. Nestor was the idiot who ruined relations with the west.

[Calimera II]

Are you kidding me? It was Nestor Kirchner who gave people the desire to be involved in politics, to fight for their ideals, believing that it is possible to live in a better country. It was Nestor's government which chose to choose for the people and not for the large corporations. It was Nestor's government which gave Argentina the desire to discuss laws. It was Nestor's government which chose to return to the present, it was Nestor who decided to continue the trials against the military junta members. Nestor wasn't the best President ever. But he was what Argentina needed: he lived for Argentina and died for Argentina.

Kirchner was a corrupt douchebag

Corrupt? Maybe, nothing has been proven and it wouldn't surprise me it is a story made up by the enemies of the government. But indeed, he wasn't the most honest president of the Argentinean history, but still: he wasn't the worst.

who destroyed the Argentinean mentality.

The Argentinean mentality has never changed, and that's why we still are here: El amor para la patria que nos vio nacer.

Nestor was an absolute idiot who caused an fiscal deficit.

Nestor was the one who ruined relations with the west.

Nestor's and Cristina's foreign affairs policy is actually what I like most. And no, they did not destroy relations with the west.

[Benuty]

Blame Prescott Bush, and the rest of those fascist traitors who make up the descendants of several modern era presidents.

Who must obviously be worse than previously mentioned racists, genocidal maniacs, and inept bastards?

I'd count an attempt to launch a fascist coup (in the 1930's) followed by planned racial genocide with what could have resulted in a second civil war to be pretty fucking bad.

Amazing no one ever shot that asshole.

Of-course they were too busy killing Huey Long (that is if his guards didn't kill him), and attempting assassinations of Franklin Roosevelt later on.

Also apparently "ancestors" got mixed up in their with descendants.

[The Confederacy of Nationalism]

the USA is a hellhole because it's marching down the path of collectivism. Welfare and people advocating for free healthcare, what happened to paying for one's own needs by oneself.

Uh... no. The USA is not even glancing in the direction of true collectivism. This is one of the most hard-right countries on Earth--best described as a corporatocracy, since mega-corps pretty much own every politician now, with only a small few exceptions (like the great Bernie Sanders).

The fact of the matter is, there will ALWAYS be the less fortunate in society. Moral, collectivist societies care for the less fortunate. Immoral and sociopathic ones leave them to rot. Simple as that.

you're fucked, as it's supposed to be
unless, of course, you show a will to improve

Thanks, NSSA, for some sense in this particular reply thread. Many people are naturally unlucky and simply can't make it, and others are simply lacking in opportunity. Lacking opportunity is a VERY wide category--it can be anything from being stuck in an area with a poor transportation system that keeps them from accessing jobs (no, not everyone can simply move on a whim), to having a physical disability. To say that those people should just be "fucked" is a horrible attitude to have, and actually constitutes an issue that requires treatment by mental health professionals.

Well shit, at least I can afford to be treated by mental health professionals. As I said before, I escaped poverty and it wasn't easy. I really don't believe it's just to make it easy, that's the whole allure of capitalism, hard work and a good idea = money. You are right, though, we are the last bastion of conservatism left in the world, but it is doubtlessly being whittled away. Collectivist societies care for the freeloaders at the expense of the hard-working. Some people are genuinely helped by it, but there's no 100% good way to determine a freeloader from a sincere hard-working individual.

[Quintium]

You could say Seyss-Inquart, but he was not Dutch and he was not our leader. In fact, he didn't even want to be here, and to be assigned to the Netherlands after having been in control of much of Poland must have felt like being sidelined for him. He was just Hitler's fool, sent to control the least volatile part of the occupied territories because no one really trusted him.

No, our worst leader came just before Seyss-Inquart. It was Hendrikus Colijn, who was Premier from 1933 until 1939. He took power when there was a severe economic crisis going on, and decided to respond to it by keeping the government budget as tight as a miser's purse. He also kept adhering to the Gold Standard, which made the crisis even worse. He also insisted that our outdated and underfunded military was more than capable of resisting any attacks, and that Germany wouldn't attack us because we were neutral. After the remilitarization of the Rhineland, he told the public in a radio broadcast that "there is still nothing to worry about, and you can all sleep sound knowing that we're in full control of the situation." Ironically, he died in German captivity (he was 'imprisoned' in a Thuringian hotel).

And after the war, that prize goes to Mark 'smiley face' Rutte, our current premier. He's a man who keeps making crazy promises ("one thousand euros for every working Dutchman", and "not a penny more to Brussels" are my favourites) and then, after getting elected, does the exact opposite (raising taxes, paying more to Brussels and refusing to join Cameron in resisting this ridiculous surcharge). Whenever election season is coming up, he turns as far-right as Geert Wilders but with a more trustworthy face, but after the elections he turns into a social liberal, which is what he really is, and pretty much governs the country for his own political prestige and little more (his current cabinet consists of easily-controlled misfits, with a Minister of Justice who hasn't finished a spoken sentence since 1983 and should have been retired for a decade now and a Minister of Social Security who's caused a rift in his own party by alienating the Turkish members of parliament on behalf of that party).

[Carrasastova]

Uh... no. The USA is not even glancing in the direction of true collectivism. This is one of the most hard-right countries on Earth--best described as a corporatocracy, since mega-corps pretty much own every politician now, with only a small few exceptions (like the great Bernie Sanders).

The fact of the matter is, there will ALWAYS be the less fortunate in society. Moral, collectivist societies care for the less fortunate. Immoral and sociopathic ones leave them to rot. Simple as that.



Thanks, NSSA, for some sense in this particular reply thread. Many people are naturally unlucky and simply can't make it, and others are simply lacking in opportunity. Lacking opportunity is a VERY wide category--it can be anything from being stuck in an area with a poor transportation system that keeps them from accessing jobs (no, not everyone can simply move on a whim), to having a physical disability. To say that those people should just be "fucked" is a horrible attitude to have, and actually constitutes an issue that requires treatment by mental health professionals.

Well shit, at least I can afford to be treated by mental health professionals. As I said before, I escaped poverty and it wasn't easy. I really don't believe it's just to make it easy, that's the whole allure of capitalism, hard work and a good idea = money. You are right, though, we are the last bastion of conservatism left in the world, but it is doubtlessly being whittled away. Collectivist societies care for the freeloaders at the expense of the hard-working. Some people are genuinely helped by it, but there's no 100% good way to determine a freeloader from a sincere hard-working individual.

Except it's harder and harder to do that when big companies intend on making sure they stay at the top.

[The Confederacy of Nationalism]

If they lack the capacity to improve, they don't. People from a poor background do not lack the capacity to improve, I myself was born into poverty and so were my parents, but now I have an income in the top 20%.

I didn't get it free, for sure.

Ya. You got there based on a mixture of luck, intelligence and talent you were born with (so more luck) and being born and raised in a way that gave you the motivation to work hard (so even more luck). Not everyone is born with that much luck, sure some are born with even more luck in that they are already rich in addition to being born intelligent, talented and being raised to have a good work ethic, but others lack all of those factors. my question is what about the truly unlucky? What about someone who is born poor, without being born lucky, talented or intelligent and is not raised to have a good work ethic, or is extremely sick or mentally and / or physically handicapped?

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

[Benuty]

Ya. You got there based on a mixture of luck, intelligence and talent you were born with (so more luck) and being born and raised in a way that gave you the motivation to work hard (so even more luck). Not everyone is born with that much luck, sure some are born with even more luck in that they are already rich in addition to being born intelligent, talented and being raised to have a good work ethic, but others lack all of those factors. my question is what about the truly unlucky? What about someone who is born poor, without being born lucky, talented or intelligent and is not raised to have a good work ethic, or is extremely sick or mentally and / or physically handicapped?

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

Problem being, not everyone lives in the land of milk, and honey or in todays case the land of green.

[The Confederacy of Nationalism]

Well shit, at least I can afford to be treated by mental health professionals. As I said before, I escaped poverty and it wasn't easy. I really don't believe it's just to make it easy, that's the whole allure of capitalism, hard work and a good idea = money. You are right, though, we are the last bastion of conservatism left in the world, but it is doubtlessly being whittled away. Collectivist societies care for the freeloaders at the expense of the hard-working. Some people are genuinely helped by it, but there's no 100% good way to determine a freeloader from a sincere hard-working individual.

Except it's harder and harder to do that when big companies intend on making sure they stay at the top.

Big companies are productive, that's why they stay at the top. It's shit like the 2008 bailouts that give corporations a bad name

[The Confederacy of Nationalism]

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

Problem being, not everyone lives in the land of milk, and honey or in todays case the land of green.

I would know, I wasn't born in a 'land of green' either.

[Firsthome]

Ya. You got there based on a mixture of luck, intelligence and talent you were born with (so more luck) and being born and raised in a way that gave you the motivation to work hard (so even more luck). Not everyone is born with that much luck, sure some are born with even more luck in that they are already rich in addition to being born intelligent, talented and being raised to have a good work ethic, but others lack all of those factors. my question is what about the truly unlucky? What about someone who is born poor, without being born lucky, talented or intelligent and is not raised to have a good work ethic, or is extremely sick or mentally and / or physically handicapped?

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

Conservative backwater views. Medicine should be a right. And someone being born handicapped isn't necessarily the mothers fault.

[Benuty]

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

Conservative backwater views. Medicine should be a right. And someone being born handicapped isn't necessarily the mothers fault.

Give them time parts of America are still in the 1860s after all.

[Alyakia]

Ya. You got there based on a mixture of luck, intelligence and talent you were born with (so more luck) and being born and raised in a way that gave you the motivation to work hard (so even more luck). Not everyone is born with that much luck, sure some are born with even more luck in that they are already rich in addition to being born intelligent, talented and being raised to have a good work ethic, but others lack all of those factors. my question is what about the truly unlucky? What about someone who is born poor, without being born lucky, talented or intelligent and is not raised to have a good work ethic, or is extremely sick or mentally and / or physically handicapped?

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

1) there are a lot of rich people with shit work ethic. please explain this.
2) speaking of which, what if they don't have a family lol

[Firsthome]

Conservative backwater views. Medicine should be a right. And someone being born handicapped isn't necessarily the mothers fault.

Give them time parts of America are still in the 1860s after all.

I'm a liberal stuck in a conservative county.

The only way our town supervisor got elected was he managed to hide as a liberal republican

Democrats have a very low chance of election In My county

[Forsaken lands]

For the U.S. it's President Obama, wish i could just kick him out of the White House, ugh he irritates everyone.

He's too conservative for me....

He feels like a dictator.

But then again, the fucking governments treating to take me away if I don't clean my house

Fucking CFY services need to burn in hell. My parents are fine

Fuck you government

Too conservative?

[Firsthome]

He's too conservative for me....

He feels like a dictator.

But then again, the fucking governments treating to take me away if I don't clean my house

Fucking CFY services need to burn in hell. My parents are fine

Fuck you government

Too conservative?

Compared to Mandela....


To bad he wasn't an American....

[The Confederacy of Nationalism]

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

Conservative backwater views. Medicine should be a right. And someone being born handicapped isn't necessarily the mothers fault.

It's more the mother's fault than the state's fault, wouldn't you agree? I don't believe that medicine should be a right, all the companies that make said medicine would be systematically eradicated if that were the case.

[The Confederacy of Nationalism]

Work ethic is a matter of consciousness, there is no luck involved. Intellect is less important than work ethic, and so is talent. If someone is extremely sick or handicapped, they should be the burden of their family, not the state.

1) there are a lot of rich people with shit work ethic. please explain this.
2) speaking of which, what if they don't have a family lol

1. they inherited it, I am anti-inheritance
2. that's almost impossible, put them in a homeless shelter or something then.