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18 yr old shoots at off-duty St. Louis cop, gets killed

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Navorgska
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Founded: Nov 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Navorgska » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:15 am

Susurruses wrote:You really trust the police version of the story?
Without any actual evidence shown?
Despite other witnesses saying otherwise?

Hmmmmmmm.


He had a sandwich, with cheese! He was innocent!

>really trusting protesters to not exaggerate the event
>really trusting black protesters this much
>trusting black people

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Laerod
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Postby Laerod » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:15 am

DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:
Sdaeriji wrote:
Why do you believe the family would lie but you don't believe the police would? They both have the same interest, to protect one of their own.


The police doesn't have as strong an interest, if any, to protect an off-duty cop for a multitude of reasons. For starters, the deed was simply not done while on their clock, which is legally and PR relevant. They would get zero direct benefits by covering up for an off-duty cop, and considering the fact that he was wearing a police uniform whilst off-duty, few indirect ones.

The Blue Code of Silence is real thing. It doesn't have to make logical sense for people to engage in it.

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Kelinfort
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Postby Kelinfort » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:15 am

Until we actually solve these issues, the African American community will react violently whenever any perceived or real police brutality occurs.

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Wisconsin9
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Postby Wisconsin9 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:18 am

Navorgska wrote:
Susurruses wrote:You really trust the police version of the story?
Without any actual evidence shown?
Despite other witnesses saying otherwise?

Hmmmmmmm.


He had a sandwich, with cheese! He was innocent!

>really trusting protesters to not exaggerate the event
>really trusting black protesters this much
>trusting black people

Is this satire, or are you really that absurdly racist?
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DnalweN acilbupeR
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Postby DnalweN acilbupeR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:18 am

Laerod wrote:
DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:It's starting to get annoying when every time a black person is shot and killed by cops a protest spawns up.

That's the problem with cops lying and faking evidence. At some point the people that take most of the shit stop believing them. It's called "crying wolf".


Actually I was wrong. I was thinking of the FN FiveSeven which has a 20 rnd mag, but that uses a rather uncommon cartridge, the 5.7x28mm, which I think is almost never used by police. Most pistols in police use come with magazines up to 17-18 rounds in capacity.

I assume in this case the off-duty cop in question was using a Glock or a copy of it and emptied his entire magazine.
The Emerald Dawn wrote:I award you no points, and have sent people to make sure your parents refrain from further breeding.
Lyttenburgh wrote:all this is a damning enough evidence to proove you of being an edgy butthurt 'murican teenager with the sole agenda of prooving to the uncaring bitch Web, that "You Have A Point!"
Lyttenburgh wrote:Either that, or, you were gang-raped by commi-nazi russian Spetznaz kill team, who then painted all walls in your house in hammer and sickles, and then viped their asses with the stars and stripes banner in your yard. That's the only logical explanation.

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The Holy Therns
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Postby The Holy Therns » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:20 am

DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:It's starting to get annoying when every time a black person is shot and killed by cops a protest spawns up.


This, here, this thing I quoted, this was a thing that was typed by somebody. This.
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The Real Fascist Austria
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Postby The Real Fascist Austria » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:21 am

just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!
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DnalweN acilbupeR
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Postby DnalweN acilbupeR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:22 am

The Holy Therns wrote:
DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:It's starting to get annoying when every time a black person is shot and killed by cops a protest spawns up.


This, here, this thing I quoted, this was a thing that was typed by somebody. This.


and your point is
The Emerald Dawn wrote:I award you no points, and have sent people to make sure your parents refrain from further breeding.
Lyttenburgh wrote:all this is a damning enough evidence to proove you of being an edgy butthurt 'murican teenager with the sole agenda of prooving to the uncaring bitch Web, that "You Have A Point!"
Lyttenburgh wrote:Either that, or, you were gang-raped by commi-nazi russian Spetznaz kill team, who then painted all walls in your house in hammer and sickles, and then viped their asses with the stars and stripes banner in your yard. That's the only logical explanation.

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Laerod
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Postby Laerod » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:23 am

The Real Fascist Austria wrote:just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!

The problem that America faces is that getting shot, arrested, or pulled over happens disproportionately to blacks. Race is most certainly a factor.

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Tekania
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Postby Tekania » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:23 am

Susurruses wrote:You really trust the police version of the story?
Without any actual evidence shown?
Despite other witnesses saying otherwise?

Hmmmmmmm.


Relatives who were not there claiming he was not armed do not count as a "witness" to the event. Maybe a character witness.... but that's about it. If they were on the stand and said that their testimony would be struck as it would be speculation, rather than actual testimony.
Last edited by Tekania on Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
Such heroic nonsense!

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Organized States
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Postby Organized States » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:23 am

The Real Fascist Austria wrote:just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!

Being shot at is a perfectly acceptable reason to return fire.
Thank God for OS!- Deian
"In the old days, the navigators used magic to make themselves strong, but now, nothing; they just pray. Before they leave and at sea, they pray. But I, I make myself strong by thinking—just by thinking! I make myself strong because I despise cowardice. Too many men are afraid of the sea. But I am a navigator."-Mau Piailug
"I regret that I have only one life to give to my island." -Ricardo Bordallo, 2nd Governor of Guam
"Both are voyages of exploration. Hōkūle‘a is in the past, Columbia is in the future." -Colonel Charles L. Veach, USAF, Astronaut and Navigation Enthusiast

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DnalweN acilbupeR
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Postby DnalweN acilbupeR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:23 am

The Real Fascist Austria wrote:just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!


Massive protests don't spawn as easily, if at all, when an innocent person of another race is killed, however.
The Emerald Dawn wrote:I award you no points, and have sent people to make sure your parents refrain from further breeding.
Lyttenburgh wrote:all this is a damning enough evidence to proove you of being an edgy butthurt 'murican teenager with the sole agenda of prooving to the uncaring bitch Web, that "You Have A Point!"
Lyttenburgh wrote:Either that, or, you were gang-raped by commi-nazi russian Spetznaz kill team, who then painted all walls in your house in hammer and sickles, and then viped their asses with the stars and stripes banner in your yard. That's the only logical explanation.

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Laerod
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Postby Laerod » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:23 am

DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:
The Holy Therns wrote:
This, here, this thing I quoted, this was a thing that was typed by somebody. This.


and your point is

Therns is flabbergasted because they don't understand that the real victims of blacks getting shot by cops are white people reading about it on the news.

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DnalweN acilbupeR
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Postby DnalweN acilbupeR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:25 am

Laerod wrote:
The Real Fascist Austria wrote:just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!

The problem that America faces is that getting shot, arrested, or pulled over happens disproportionately to blacks. Race is most certainly a factor.


To quote myself:

Does racial profiling exist? YES it fucking does. Meaning that you're more likely to get stopped/ID'd/searched if you're black than if you're white for example. Now, implying that this = "shot for being blackkk!!!1111" or "all things being equal you're more likely to get shot if you're black" is a stinking pile of bullshit, and I wish the worst to anyone and everyone spreading it around. In lethal-force situations danger is perceived plainly as danger, not "is this kid black or white? oh he's black so I better shoot him lol" . The only reason more black individuals may be getting shot/killed by police than whites is that, because they are profiled they end up in those situations more often than them. It's not "whitey keepin us down", it's "we're fucking stupid and can't / don't want to handle interaction with cops civilly", for those blacks (or any person of any race for that matter) that are allegedly innocent yet end up getting shot by police.

EDIT: You don't fight racial profiling by giving police a real reason to use force on you.
Last edited by DnalweN acilbupeR on Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:35 am, edited 2 times in total.
The Emerald Dawn wrote:I award you no points, and have sent people to make sure your parents refrain from further breeding.
Lyttenburgh wrote:all this is a damning enough evidence to proove you of being an edgy butthurt 'murican teenager with the sole agenda of prooving to the uncaring bitch Web, that "You Have A Point!"
Lyttenburgh wrote:Either that, or, you were gang-raped by commi-nazi russian Spetznaz kill team, who then painted all walls in your house in hammer and sickles, and then viped their asses with the stars and stripes banner in your yard. That's the only logical explanation.

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Organized States
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Founded: Apr 26, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Organized States » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:26 am

Laerod wrote:
The Real Fascist Austria wrote:just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!

The problem that America faces is that getting shot, arrested, or pulled over happens disproportionately to blacks. Race is most certainly a factor.

This is unfortunately true. There is a disconnect, and this occurs both ways.

There are areas in the American South were the racism can go, and often does go both ways, and often is perpetuated by both sides.
Thank God for OS!- Deian
"In the old days, the navigators used magic to make themselves strong, but now, nothing; they just pray. Before they leave and at sea, they pray. But I, I make myself strong by thinking—just by thinking! I make myself strong because I despise cowardice. Too many men are afraid of the sea. But I am a navigator."-Mau Piailug
"I regret that I have only one life to give to my island." -Ricardo Bordallo, 2nd Governor of Guam
"Both are voyages of exploration. Hōkūle‘a is in the past, Columbia is in the future." -Colonel Charles L. Veach, USAF, Astronaut and Navigation Enthusiast

Pacific Islander-American (proud member of the 0.5%), Officer to be

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Navorgska
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Founded: Nov 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Navorgska » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:26 am

Wisconsin9 wrote:
Navorgska wrote:
He had a sandwich, with cheese! He was innocent!

>really trusting protesters to not exaggerate the event
>really trusting black protesters this much
>trusting black people

Is this satire, or are you really that absurdly racist?


Are you really this absurdly gullible to not figure out a moderate to heavy portion of black people are a lower class in society and that racial tensions have caused them to do things like this all the time?

I guess we'll find out in the next episode of... Shut, It, Down!

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Kelinfort
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Founded: Nov 10, 2013
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Postby Kelinfort » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:26 am

DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:
The Real Fascist Austria wrote:just get rid of race from this issue. Cop shoots dude for no reason= BAD!


Massive protests don't spawn as easily, if at all, when an innocent person of another race is killed, however.

Whites aren't shot at nor killed as much as African Americans. Plus, there is more legal recourse for the white community than for the black community.
Last edited by Kelinfort on Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

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DnalweN acilbupeR
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Postby DnalweN acilbupeR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:31 am

Laerod wrote:
DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:
The police doesn't have as strong an interest, if any, to protect an off-duty cop for a multitude of reasons. For starters, the deed was simply not done while on their clock, which is legally and PR relevant. They would get zero direct benefits by covering up for an off-duty cop, and considering the fact that he was wearing a police uniform whilst off-duty, few indirect ones.

The Blue Code of Silence is real thing. It doesn't have to make logical sense for people to engage in it.


There's a huge difference between silence and planting evidence/framing someone.
The Emerald Dawn wrote:I award you no points, and have sent people to make sure your parents refrain from further breeding.
Lyttenburgh wrote:all this is a damning enough evidence to proove you of being an edgy butthurt 'murican teenager with the sole agenda of prooving to the uncaring bitch Web, that "You Have A Point!"
Lyttenburgh wrote:Either that, or, you were gang-raped by commi-nazi russian Spetznaz kill team, who then painted all walls in your house in hammer and sickles, and then viped their asses with the stars and stripes banner in your yard. That's the only logical explanation.

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Wisconsin9
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Founded: May 18, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Wisconsin9 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:32 am

Navorgska wrote:
Wisconsin9 wrote:Is this satire, or are you really that absurdly racist?


Are you really this absurdly gullible to not figure out a moderate to heavy portion of black people are a lower class in society and that racial tensions have caused them to do things like this all the time?

I guess we'll find out in the next episode of... Shut, It, Down!

I was referring to the bit where you apparently think that all black people are untrustworthy.
~~~~~~~~
We are currently 33% through the Trump administration.
................................................................................................................................................................................................................
................................................................................................................................................................................................................

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Laerod
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Postby Laerod » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:34 am

DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:EDIT: You don't fight racial profiling by giving police a real reason to use force on you.

You can't detach this case from the greater context. Even if the cop did everything right, we live in a world where American cops need to be treated as though they were potentially rabid animals or muggers.

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Organized States
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Postby Organized States » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:37 am

Laerod wrote:
DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:EDIT: You don't fight racial profiling by giving police a real reason to use force on you.

You can't detach this case from the greater context. Even if the cop did everything right, we live in a world where American cops need to be treated as though they were potentially rabid animals or muggers.

To be honest with you, let's just put everyone there in that category.

That's the way I run my life. I trust only about 4 or 5 people, that's it really.
Thank God for OS!- Deian
"In the old days, the navigators used magic to make themselves strong, but now, nothing; they just pray. Before they leave and at sea, they pray. But I, I make myself strong by thinking—just by thinking! I make myself strong because I despise cowardice. Too many men are afraid of the sea. But I am a navigator."-Mau Piailug
"I regret that I have only one life to give to my island." -Ricardo Bordallo, 2nd Governor of Guam
"Both are voyages of exploration. Hōkūle‘a is in the past, Columbia is in the future." -Colonel Charles L. Veach, USAF, Astronaut and Navigation Enthusiast

Pacific Islander-American (proud member of the 0.5%), Officer to be

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Laerod
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Postby Laerod » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:37 am

DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:
Laerod wrote:The Blue Code of Silence is real thing. It doesn't have to make logical sense for people to engage in it.


There's a huge difference between silence and planting evidence/framing someone.

Not the point, really. The code of silence protects those that do so because their comrades that won't engage in that kind of behavior per se are discouraged from reporting those that do.

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Laerod
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Postby Laerod » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:38 am

Organized States wrote:
Laerod wrote:You can't detach this case from the greater context. Even if the cop did everything right, we live in a world where American cops need to be treated as though they were potentially rabid animals or muggers.

To be honest with you, let's just put everyone there in that category.

That's the way I run my life. I trust only about 4 or 5 people, that's it really.

Not everyone has the legal authority to bust you or carries guns. Hell, I don't live in the US and I don't have to treat cops this way, proving there's another way.

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DnalweN acilbupeR
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Ex-Nation

Postby DnalweN acilbupeR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:38 am

Laerod wrote:
DnalweN acilbupeR wrote:EDIT: You don't fight racial profiling by giving police a real reason to use force on you.

You can't detach this case from the greater context. Even if the cop did everything right, we live in a world where American cops need to be treated as though they were potentially rabid animals or muggers.


Do we, or was this sarcasm?

It isn't about detaching certain cases from the greater context. It's about detaching "profiling" from "use of lethal force" which must be done by all means because it is reality. Until it can be proven that all things being equal a cop will kill a black mean deader than a white man, people making such statements can keep their unsubstantiated claims to themselves.
The Emerald Dawn wrote:I award you no points, and have sent people to make sure your parents refrain from further breeding.
Lyttenburgh wrote:all this is a damning enough evidence to proove you of being an edgy butthurt 'murican teenager with the sole agenda of prooving to the uncaring bitch Web, that "You Have A Point!"
Lyttenburgh wrote:Either that, or, you were gang-raped by commi-nazi russian Spetznaz kill team, who then painted all walls in your house in hammer and sickles, and then viped their asses with the stars and stripes banner in your yard. That's the only logical explanation.

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Navorgska
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Founded: Nov 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Navorgska » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:38 am

Wisconsin9 wrote:
Navorgska wrote:
Are you really this absurdly gullible to not figure out a moderate to heavy portion of black people are a lower class in society and that racial tensions have caused them to do things like this all the time?

I guess we'll find out in the next episode of... Shut, It, Down!

I was referring to the bit where you apparently think that all black people are untrustworthy.


Not all, but pretty much 75% of them are untrustworthy. I can back this up since a part of my family are adopted African-Americans, and pretty much 3 out of 4 of them ended up becoming hooligans/jobless/thieves. They lived in a pretty upper-class white neighborhood also. However, like most African-Americans apparently, they lacked a strong traditional institution to guide them.

This is a pretty common pattern.

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