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Do you agree with Democracy?

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Do you agree with Democracy?

Yes
204
54%
No
105
28%
I believe Alpacas are smug, and prideful
67
18%
 
Total votes : 376

User avatar
Republique della France
Diplomat
 
Posts: 630
Founded: Sep 04, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Republique della France » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:21 pm

Shnercropolis wrote:
Republique della France wrote:He also invaded Czechoslovakia, and not one nation lifted a finger.

The fact is, that Gdansk belonged to Germany, and they had a right to save Germans that were being persecuted by the Poles.

are you a troll or something? I find it hard to believe that anyone could believe in this.

No, I am not a 'troll."

Ostpreussen needed to be connected to the rest of Germany. Why would any nation accept to be divided by the whims of another?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goXvk2w ... 1410138026

I am a Fascist. My grandparents served in the Charlemagne-SS and the Spanish Blue Division, they fought to defend Europe from what it is today: A Marxist Multicultural craphole.

User avatar
Arglorand
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12597
Founded: Jan 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Arglorand » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:21 pm

Celesburg wrote:I like parliamentary federal democracies.

What if the country is small enough for any federalism to be unnecessary?
Kosovo is Morrowind. N'wah.
Impeach Dagoth Ur, legalise Daedra worship, the Empire is theft. Nerevarine 3E 427.

Pros: Dunmeri independence, abolition of the Empire, the Daedra, Morag Tong, House Redoran, Ashlander interests, abolitionism, Dissident Priests, canonisation of St. Jiub the Cliff Racer Slayer.
Cons: Imperials, the Empire, the False Tribunal, Dagoth Ur, House Hlaalu, Imperials, the Eight Divines, "Talos", "Nords", Imperial unionism, Imperials.

I am a: Social Democrat | Bright green | Republican | Intersectional feminist | Civic nationalist | Multiculturalist
(and i blatantly stole this from Old Tyrannia)

User avatar
Infected Mushroom
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38837
Founded: Apr 15, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Infected Mushroom » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:21 pm

The Orson Empire wrote:
Infected Mushroom wrote:
I think it depends on who you choose for the position. Some people are more corruptible than others, but if you choose a real man of honor (someone like Eddard Stark from Game of Thrones for example), it could be a really great system.

And it wouldn't be vulnerable to the flaws of democracy (always being tied by the majority even when they are wrong, vulnerability to corruption by corporations, gridlock and bickering etc).

It is very vulnerable into turning into an authoritarian regime, along with corruption. A benevolent dictatorship is unrealistic. Over time, it is inevitable that it will become authoritarian.


which is why succession is so important in such a system.

User avatar
Shnercropolis
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9391
Founded: Sep 30, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Shnercropolis » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:21 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Scomagia wrote:No it isn't. Also, I was waiting for you to say this. You were so neatly tap-dancing around it that I had a strong feeling you would.

It's no secret masses of people, especially Europeans do not believe the holocaust happened.

So they live closer to the death camps, where you can literally see mass graves... and they don't believe it?
:eyebrow:
it is my firm belief that I should never have to justify my beliefs.

User avatar
Scomagia
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18703
Founded: Apr 14, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Scomagia » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:21 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Scomagia wrote:No it isn't. Also, I was waiting for you to say this. You were so neatly tap-dancing around it that I had a strong feeling you would.

It's no secret masses of people, especially Europeans do not believe the holocaust happened.

It's also no secret that masses of people don't believe the moon landing happened. Both groups are factually, provably wrong.
Insert trite farewell here

User avatar
The New Lowlands
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12498
Founded: Jun 26, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The New Lowlands » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

The Fascist American Empire wrote:
Arglorand wrote:I like to think the question is ridiculous. Of course I do.

Then why are you Pro-Ukraine? Crimea held a referendum which stated that the overwhelming majority wanted to be under Russian rule. If you support Democracy, you should support Putin.

How does being Pro-Ukraine necessarily equate to opposing Crimean secession from the country?

User avatar
Republique della France
Diplomat
 
Posts: 630
Founded: Sep 04, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Republique della France » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

The New Lowlands wrote:
Republique della France wrote:He also invaded Czechoslovakia, and not one nation lifted a finger.

The fact is, that Gdansk belonged to Germany, and they had a right to save Germans that were being persecuted by the Poles.

You know that that was a bullshit excuse invented out of nothing to justify internally a war of expansion, right?

Democracy has thus far proven to lead to some of the most stable, equitable, and powerful countries on earth. It has a pretty good rap in my book.

No, it wasn't an excuse.

If you read Mein Kampf, you will know the Soviet Union was to be invaded any day.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goXvk2w ... 1410138026

I am a Fascist. My grandparents served in the Charlemagne-SS and the Spanish Blue Division, they fought to defend Europe from what it is today: A Marxist Multicultural craphole.

User avatar
Arglorand
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12597
Founded: Jan 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Arglorand » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Shnercropolis wrote:are you a troll or something? I find it hard to believe that anyone could believe in this.

No, I am not a 'troll."

Ostpreussen needed to be connected to the rest of Germany. Why would any nation accept to be divided by the whims of another?

Yes. Why would Poland accept to be divided by Germany over its whim to have a land corridor to its first historical colony?
Kosovo is Morrowind. N'wah.
Impeach Dagoth Ur, legalise Daedra worship, the Empire is theft. Nerevarine 3E 427.

Pros: Dunmeri independence, abolition of the Empire, the Daedra, Morag Tong, House Redoran, Ashlander interests, abolitionism, Dissident Priests, canonisation of St. Jiub the Cliff Racer Slayer.
Cons: Imperials, the Empire, the False Tribunal, Dagoth Ur, House Hlaalu, Imperials, the Eight Divines, "Talos", "Nords", Imperial unionism, Imperials.

I am a: Social Democrat | Bright green | Republican | Intersectional feminist | Civic nationalist | Multiculturalist
(and i blatantly stole this from Old Tyrannia)

User avatar
The Orson Empire
Post Czar
 
Posts: 31410
Founded: Mar 20, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Orson Empire » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Scomagia wrote:No it isn't. Also, I was waiting for you to say this. You were so neatly tap-dancing around it that I had a strong feeling you would.

It's no secret masses of people, especially Europeans do not believe the holocaust happened.

It's no secret that masses of people believe climate change isn't real. That doesn't make them right, though.

User avatar
Laerod
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 26183
Founded: Jul 17, 2004
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Laerod » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

The Fascist American Empire wrote:
Arglorand wrote:I like to think the question is ridiculous. Of course I do.

Then why are you Pro-Ukraine? Crimea held a referendum which stated that the overwhelming majority wanted to be under Russian rule. If you support Democracy, you should support Putin.

A referendum that was botched and unfair even by the standards the Nazis set for unfair elections in the referendum to the Austrian Anschluss.

User avatar
Republique della France
Diplomat
 
Posts: 630
Founded: Sep 04, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Republique della France » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:22 pm

Arglorand wrote:
Republique della France wrote:No, I am not a 'troll."

Ostpreussen needed to be connected to the rest of Germany. Why would any nation accept to be divided by the whims of another?

Yes. Why would Poland accept to be divided by Germany over its whim to have a land corridor to its first historical colony?

It wouldn't be divided.

Germany was divided.

Not Poland. Ostpreussen had no connection to Mainland Germany.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goXvk2w ... 1410138026

I am a Fascist. My grandparents served in the Charlemagne-SS and the Spanish Blue Division, they fought to defend Europe from what it is today: A Marxist Multicultural craphole.

User avatar
Arglorand
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12597
Founded: Jan 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Arglorand » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:23 pm

The Fascist American Empire wrote:
Arglorand wrote:I like to think the question is ridiculous. Of course I do.

Then why are you Pro-Ukraine? Crimea held a referendum which stated that the overwhelming majority wanted to be under Russian rule. If you support Democracy, you should support Putin.

If I support democracy, I should support a homophobic ukrainophobic bigot dictator whose idea of a referendum is to let Russian soldiers vote and Neo-Nazis act as "foreign observers"?

Don't make me laugh, fascist. Submit to your idol all you like, but I like freedom.
Last edited by Arglorand on Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kosovo is Morrowind. N'wah.
Impeach Dagoth Ur, legalise Daedra worship, the Empire is theft. Nerevarine 3E 427.

Pros: Dunmeri independence, abolition of the Empire, the Daedra, Morag Tong, House Redoran, Ashlander interests, abolitionism, Dissident Priests, canonisation of St. Jiub the Cliff Racer Slayer.
Cons: Imperials, the Empire, the False Tribunal, Dagoth Ur, House Hlaalu, Imperials, the Eight Divines, "Talos", "Nords", Imperial unionism, Imperials.

I am a: Social Democrat | Bright green | Republican | Intersectional feminist | Civic nationalist | Multiculturalist
(and i blatantly stole this from Old Tyrannia)

User avatar
Republique della France
Diplomat
 
Posts: 630
Founded: Sep 04, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Republique della France » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:23 pm

Shnercropolis wrote:
Republique della France wrote:It's no secret masses of people, especially Europeans do not believe the holocaust happened.

So they live closer to the death camps, where you can literally see mass graves... and they don't believe it?
:eyebrow:

Yes.

I thought it was common knowledge that Europeans don't really believe the holocaust happened.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goXvk2w ... 1410138026

I am a Fascist. My grandparents served in the Charlemagne-SS and the Spanish Blue Division, they fought to defend Europe from what it is today: A Marxist Multicultural craphole.

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Scomagia wrote:Beautiful aside from the Ghettos and Genocide, of course.

The genocide is up for debate as to whether or not it even happened.

no, reality is not up for debate.
American & German, ich kann auch Deutsch. I have a B.S. in finance.
Pro: Human rights, equality, LGBT rights, socialized healthcare, the EU in theory, green energy, public transportation, the internet as a utility
Anti: Authoritarian regimes and systems, the Chinese government, identity politics, die AfD, populism, organized religion, Erdogan, assault weapon ownership
Free Tibet and Hong Kong | Keep Taiwan Independent

User avatar
The New Lowlands
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12498
Founded: Jun 26, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The New Lowlands » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Shnercropolis wrote:are you a troll or something? I find it hard to believe that anyone could believe in this.

No, I am not a 'troll."

Ostpreussen needed to be connected to the rest of Germany. Why would any nation accept to be divided by the whims of another?

Russia seems okay with it.
As does Azerbaijan.
And Spain.
Modern Italy, and, surprise, surprise, Germany.

User avatar
The Fascist American Empire
Minister
 
Posts: 3101
Founded: Oct 12, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby The Fascist American Empire » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Laerod wrote:
The Fascist American Empire wrote:Then why are you Pro-Ukraine? Crimea held a referendum which stated that the overwhelming majority wanted to be under Russian rule. If you support Democracy, you should support Putin.

A referendum that was botched and unfair even by the standards the Nazis set for unfair elections in the referendum to the Austrian Anschluss.

Any non-American/EU, completely unbiased evidence?

And no, anybody could edit wikipedia... It is not a source.

Americans, hands off Ukraine and let Russia do what they will in their own sphere of influence! You are not the world's police!
You obviously do since you posted a response like the shifty little red velvet pseudo ant you are. Yes I am onto your little tricks you hissing pest you exoskeleton brier patch you. Now crawl back in to that patch of grass you call hell and hiss some more. -Benuty
[quote="Arkandros";p="20014230"]

RIP Eli Waller
Race! It is a feeling, not a reality: ninety-five percent, at least, is a feeling. Nothing will ever make me believe that biologically pure races can be shown to exist today. -Benito Mussolini

User avatar
Scomagia
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 18703
Founded: Apr 14, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Scomagia » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Shnercropolis wrote:So they live closer to the death camps, where you can literally see mass graves... and they don't believe it?
:eyebrow:

Yes.

I thought it was common knowledge that Europeans don't really believe the holocaust happened.

It's irrelevant because The Holocaust did happen.
Insert trite farewell here

User avatar
SaintB
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21792
Founded: Apr 18, 2007
Ex-Nation

Postby SaintB » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

I don't have to agree with it but I get my say anyway; that's kind of the point of democracy.
Hi my name is SaintB and I am prone to sarcasm and hyperbole. Because of this I make no warranties, express or implied, concerning the accuracy, completeness, reliability or suitability of the above statement, of its constituent parts, or of any supporting data. These terms are subject to change without notice from myself.

Every day NationStates tells me I have one issue. I am pretty sure I've got more than that.

User avatar
Laerod
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 26183
Founded: Jul 17, 2004
Iron Fist Socialists

Postby Laerod » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Arglorand wrote:
Celesburg wrote:I like parliamentary federal democracies.

What if the country is small enough for any federalism to be unnecessary?

Then we shall call it Belgium.

User avatar
The New Lowlands
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12498
Founded: Jun 26, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The New Lowlands » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Shnercropolis wrote:So they live closer to the death camps, where you can literally see mass graves... and they don't believe it?
:eyebrow:

Yes.

I thought it was common knowledge that Europeans don't really believe the holocaust happened.

Speaking as a European, that's bullshit.

User avatar
Arglorand
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12597
Founded: Jan 08, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Arglorand » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

The New Lowlands wrote:
The Fascist American Empire wrote:Then why are you Pro-Ukraine? Crimea held a referendum which stated that the overwhelming majority wanted to be under Russian rule. If you support Democracy, you should support Putin.

How does being Pro-Ukraine necessarily equate to opposing Crimean secession from the country?

I oppose that secession too, don't you think for a moment that I don't.
Kosovo is Morrowind. N'wah.
Impeach Dagoth Ur, legalise Daedra worship, the Empire is theft. Nerevarine 3E 427.

Pros: Dunmeri independence, abolition of the Empire, the Daedra, Morag Tong, House Redoran, Ashlander interests, abolitionism, Dissident Priests, canonisation of St. Jiub the Cliff Racer Slayer.
Cons: Imperials, the Empire, the False Tribunal, Dagoth Ur, House Hlaalu, Imperials, the Eight Divines, "Talos", "Nords", Imperial unionism, Imperials.

I am a: Social Democrat | Bright green | Republican | Intersectional feminist | Civic nationalist | Multiculturalist
(and i blatantly stole this from Old Tyrannia)

User avatar
Greater Mackonia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5085
Founded: Sep 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Greater Mackonia » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:24 pm

Conscentia wrote:
Greater Mackonia wrote:I doubt that.

You doubt the empirically verified phenomenon?


I could just be mis-interpreting this but according to the article itself:

"...has generally been found to be as good as, and often better than, the answer given by any of the individuals within the group"

That has nothing to do with their reasoning in comparison to experts, anyway the entire phenomenon seems rather bogus and I see little real empirical evidence to its truth. There will always emerge superior individuals, there will always be stupider individuals and it is paramount that the views of the second group do not override the first.
The Agonocracy of Greater Mackonia
"Show me someone without an ego, and I'll show you a loser."
-Donald J. Trump.

User avatar
Shnercropolis
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9391
Founded: Sep 30, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Shnercropolis » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:25 pm

The Fascist American Empire wrote:
Laerod wrote:A referendum that was botched and unfair even by the standards the Nazis set for unfair elections in the referendum to the Austrian Anschluss.

Any non-American/EU, completely unbiased evidence?

And no, anybody could edit wikipedia... It is not a source.

Amnesty International.
it is my firm belief that I should never have to justify my beliefs.

User avatar
The Orson Empire
Post Czar
 
Posts: 31410
Founded: Mar 20, 2012
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Orson Empire » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:25 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Shnercropolis wrote:So they live closer to the death camps, where you can literally see mass graves... and they don't believe it?
:eyebrow:

Yes.

I thought it was common knowledge that Europeans don't really believe the holocaust happened.

That is a crock of shit. Who told you that?

User avatar
Othelos
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12729
Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:25 pm

Republique della France wrote:
Othelos wrote:...he invaded poland...

He also invaded Czechoslovakia, and not one nation lifted a finger.

appeasement.

Republique della France wrote:The fact is, that Gdansk belonged to Germany, and they had a right to save Germans that were being persecuted by the Poles.

even if that were true, irrelevant to the fact that he started the war.
Last edited by Othelos on Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
American & German, ich kann auch Deutsch. I have a B.S. in finance.
Pro: Human rights, equality, LGBT rights, socialized healthcare, the EU in theory, green energy, public transportation, the internet as a utility
Anti: Authoritarian regimes and systems, the Chinese government, identity politics, die AfD, populism, organized religion, Erdogan, assault weapon ownership
Free Tibet and Hong Kong | Keep Taiwan Independent

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