Bari wrote:Ublia wrote:
Hmmm I must admit your view is a lot more enlightened then I've usually encountered. Most people I've had to argue with believe he knows and controls all and denies the whole 'freedom of choice' thing which is where their argument falls apart. Anywho needless to say I'm pleased. However I still reject the notion that as you say without baptism its impossible to achieve heaven, because being a lover of history it should be noted there are many different religions that have preceded Christianity and it is notable Christianity heavily borrowed from several older religions. For example the idea of a dying and rising god can be found in Greek and other Mythos. Not to mention they took the pagan holidays involving Sol Invictus and corrupted it into modern Christmas. And plus and no offence the fact the bulk of the bible has been edited so many times that in many ways its been 'corrupted' if you put it under the microscope and thus while god may exist and if he is a Christian god then that would mean that Christian doctrine has been corrupted and thus we cannot rely on the bible in its entirety. And again I would note it hardly seems fair that -going back to your baptism point- god denies salvation to good people who may not have been baptized for this one fact. As one they may be ignorant to such and so on. Don't you think?
You will receive faulty logic and reasoning from faulty denominations. However, the idea that there is no free will is another theory.
Simply because similarities can be found among several religions is no reason to dismiss them. However, I will say this of Christmas, Christmas is not purported to be the birthday of Jesus. It is date whereon we celebrate His Nativity. Originally, it was celebrated belatedly because Christians were suffering from persecution. They, therefore, celebrated the Nativity in line with a popular pagan holiday, that they could furtively celebrate the Nativity without being persecuted therefor. There was no corruption of anything in the process. They merely maintained the date as tradition.
As a Christian, I believe that the Holy Bible is infallible, and that the Word of God, whether revealed through the Holy Scripture or through the Church in tradition, is divinely revealed. I believe we can rely on the Holy Bible.
Treating of those who are ignorant of the Holy Gospels, there may be salvation for them. There are known as "ignorant natives." This term is not intended as an insult. There are different beliefs on what happens to the "fate of the unlearned." The Church teaches that a "virtuous pagan" or a "righteous gentile" may indeed go to Heaven if he long for God, according to his understanding, and does good acts in his temporal life.
Uh your Catholic aren't you? After all Catholicsm was the one that instituted the virtuous pagan idea. Furthermore does it not dictate that some pagans are sent to a sort of earth like limbo similar to the Fields of Elysium? If so should that not apply to people for example deists such as myself (were to be true that is) would be sent to such a place if we're virtuous enough as it were. After all I desire god but merely disagree with doctrine. Just saying.
