Malaysian Airliner crashes in Ukraine

[Northwest Slobovia]

Hell, we screwed that up once: the Vincennes shot down an Iranian Airbus back in the late 80s.

That was because the captain half assed the best aerial identification system in the world.

Details, details. Great tech, crappy crew (captain) doesn't get you any more than crappy tech does. The point, though, is that we screwed up. We coughed up a lot of compensation, IIRC. Not sure that's gonna cut it in this case; in fact, I think it won't.

[SuperFruitland]

Hell, we screwed that up once: the Vincennes shot down an Iranian Airbus back in the late 80s.

That was because the captain half assed the best aerial identification system in the world.

According to the Wikipedia page on it, they managed to mistake a jumbo jet for a fighter jet. I know as close to nothing about planes as you can get, and I'm pretty sure that's a big mistake to make...

[Roski]

That was because the captain half assed the best aerial identification system in the world.

According to the Wikipedia page on it, they managed to mistake a jumbo jet for a fighter jet. I know as close to nothing about planes as you can get, and I'm pretty sure that's a big mistake to make...

Not necessarily.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_large_aircraft

[Planita]

Friends I know have lost a mutual dear friend in that flight. ):

I feel shit.

I'm sorry

[United Marxist Nations]

According to the Wikipedia page on it, they managed to mistake a jumbo jet for a fighter jet. I know as close to nothing about planes as you can get, and I'm pretty sure that's a big mistake to make...

Not necessarily.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_large_aircraft

Wrong class of aircraft; both the planes the Separatists thought they shot down and the plane that was shot down are considerably smaller than all the planes on that list.

Also, Igor Strelkov, the guy who supposedly gave the order to shoot it down (or at least, the guy who made the VK post about shooting down an AN-26) is receiving death threats all across the internet. Which isn't surprising, it's the internet. Though, he's actually calling for a ceasefire, and is one of the few in the Rebel government who is openly questioning the cause.

[Roski]

Not necessarily.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_large_aircraft

Wrong class of aircraft; both the planes the Separatists thought they shot down and the plane that was shot down are considerably smaller than all the planes on that list.

Also, Igor Strelkov, the guy who supposedly gave the order to shoot it down (or at least, the guy who made the VK post about shooting down an AN-26) is receiving death threats all across the internet. Which isn't surprising, it's the internet.

Talking about the Iranian Airbus that was shot down.

[United Marxist Nations]

Wrong class of aircraft; both the planes the Separatists thought they shot down and the plane that was shot down are considerably smaller than all the planes on that list.

Also, Igor Strelkov, the guy who supposedly gave the order to shoot it down (or at least, the guy who made the VK post about shooting down an AN-26) is receiving death threats all across the internet. Which isn't surprising, it's the internet.

Talking about the Iranian Airbus that was shot down.

Oh.

[Roski]

Talking about the Iranian Airbus that was shot down.

Oh.

What type of plane was the flight?
The One shot down today.

[United Marxist Nations]

Oh.

What type of plane was the flight?
The One shot down today.

777, I think.

[The Black Forrest]

What type of plane was the flight?
The One shot down today.

777, I think.

Indeed.

From what I read it sounds like the Russians knocked it down thinking it was unknown, flying our way and we are in a conflict zone.....

[

[United Marxist Nations]

777, I think.

Indeed.

From what I read it sounds like the Russians knocked it down thinking it was unknown, flying our way and we are in a conflict zone.....

[

The rebel commander, Igor Strelkov (who I'm doing research on, he's a 43 year old retiree from the Russian intelligence services, apparently big into military history and reenactments; he's also been largely disowned by the Rebel government because he is having misgivings about the conflict) who reportedly saw it shot down himself (in a video, he is heard talking about it being shot down) said "Our forces shot down an AN-26 [Ukrainian military transport]. That will teach you to fly in our sky!" He's also been heard in the phone call where the separatists found out it was a civilian plane.

[Costa Fierro]

777, I think.

Indeed.

From what I read it sounds like the Russians knocked it down thinking it was unknown, flying our way and we are in a conflict zone.....

[

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

Edit: New Zealand woman confirmed on flight.

[United Marxist Nations]

Indeed.

From what I read it sounds like the Russians knocked it down thinking it was unknown, flying our way and we are in a conflict zone.....

[

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

However, I think that Ukraine actually closed off that specific area for commercial flights, but I could be wrong.

[The Black Forrest]

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

However, I think that Ukraine actually closed off that specific area for commercial flights, but I could be wrong.

If they did that and put the word out, then Malaysia airlines

Still it doesn't excuse what happened......

[The Alma Mater]

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

However, I think that Ukraine actually closed off that specific area for commercial flights, but I could be wrong.

EUROCONTROL says there were no restrictions for flying in that airspace.

[Kamchastkia]

Indeed.

From what I read it sounds like the Russians knocked it down thinking it was unknown, flying our way and we are in a conflict zone.....

[

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

Edit: New Zealand woman confirmed on flight.

The rebels are not well equipped enough to engage these aircraft, however Ukrainian equipment of the type that is suspected to have brought down the jetliner was in the area at the time of the incident in order to enforce the no-fly zone. Out of all parties involved the Ukrainian Military whether on purpose or not, is the most likely suspect. It wouldn't be the first time they've accidentally shot down an airliner.

[United Marxist Nations]

However, I think that Ukraine actually closed off that specific area for commercial flights, but I could be wrong.

If they did that and put the word out, then Malaysia airlines

Still it doesn't excuse what happened......

It was a tragic mistake, we should remember that before we pass judgement. Kind of disconcerting what some people on teh interwebz are saying should be done to Strelkov.

[United Marxist Nations]

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

Edit: New Zealand woman confirmed on flight.

The rebels are not well equipped enough to engage these aircraft, however Ukrainian equipment of the type that is suspected to have brought down the jetliner was in the area at the time of the incident in order to enforce the no-fly zone. Out of all parties involved the Ukrainian Military whether on purpose or not, is the most likely suspect. It wouldn't be the first time they've accidentally shot down an airliner.

The Rebels do have an SA-11 launcher, which is more than capable of hitting the aircraft at that altitude. It was a case of mistaken identity, which, in this instance, turned out horribly.

[Kamchastkia]

The rebels are not well equipped enough to engage these aircraft, however Ukrainian equipment of the type that is suspected to have brought down the jetliner was in the area at the time of the incident in order to enforce the no-fly zone. Out of all parties involved the Ukrainian Military whether on purpose or not, is the most likely suspect. It wouldn't be the first time they've accidentally shot down an airliner.

The Rebels do have an SA-11 launcher, which is more than capable of hitting the aircraft at that altitude. It was a case of mistaken identity, which, in this instance, turned out horribly.

They have the launcher, which by itself is not capable of attacking jack shit. The Buk system is a 3 module system which consists of a Radar Module, a Launcher Module, and a Command Module. The only photographic proof I've seen for the rebels possessing anything is solely the launcher module. Additionally you'd have to be relatively well trained to accurately use the weaponry which some rebels in the eastern Ukraine most likely aren't.

[Inyourfaceistan]

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

Edit: New Zealand woman confirmed on flight.

The rebels are not well equipped enough to engage these aircraft, however Ukrainian equipment of the type that is suspected to have brought down the jetliner was in the area at the time of the incident in order to enforce the no-fly zone. Out of all parties involved the Ukrainian Military whether on purpose or not, is the most likely suspect. It wouldn't be the first time they've accidentally shot down an airliner.

It has been stated multiple times that the separatists have captured at least one, if not more Buk missile systems.
Bear in mind a lot of these separatists are former Ukranian or even Russian military folk, it would not be a stretch of the imagination at all to say the separatists have weapons that can down an aircraft like that and the knowledge on how to use them.

[Costa Fierro]

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

However, I think that Ukraine actually closed off that specific area for commercial flights, but I could be wrong.

It was only closed off at altitudes below 4,000 ft, largely because that was the limit that rebel SAM systems could operate. Anything above that was relatively safe.

[Northwest Slobovia]

Generally speaking, you are safe flying over conflict zones most of the time owing to the fact that most airliners fly at altitude and avoid the kinds of low-level missile systems. It is not often that rebel forces acquire missile systems capable of shooting down large aircraft.

Edit: New Zealand woman confirmed on flight.

The rebels are not well equipped enough to engage these aircraft,

The rebels captured Buk air defense systems from Ukraine a few weeks ago (on June 29).

That doesn't rule the possibility of Russia providing Buks to the separatists, but there is no evidence for that. So more than likely the system used (if it was the rebels who shot down the plane) was captured.

Do try to keep up, please.

[Kamchastkia]

The rebels are not well equipped enough to engage these aircraft, however Ukrainian equipment of the type that is suspected to have brought down the jetliner was in the area at the time of the incident in order to enforce the no-fly zone. Out of all parties involved the Ukrainian Military whether on purpose or not, is the most likely suspect. It wouldn't be the first time they've accidentally shot down an airliner.

It has been stated multiple times that the separatists have captured at least one, if not more Buk missile systems.
Bear in mind a lot of these separatists are former Ukranian or even Russian military folk, it would not be a stretch of the imagination at all to say the separatists have weapons that can down an aircraft like that and the knowledge on how to use them.

The above comment applies, just having the launching module doesn't really mean they are capable of firing at jack shit.

[Registug]

27 Australians were confirmed on that flight, 9 of which were from my state.

Safe to say I am pissed off. For once I agree with Tony Abbott on something.

[United Marxist Nations]

The Rebels do have an SA-11 launcher, which is more than capable of hitting the aircraft at that altitude. It was a case of mistaken identity, which, in this instance, turned out horribly.

They have the launcher, which by itself is not capable of attacking jack shit. The Buk system is a 3 module system which consists of a Radar Module, a Launcher Module, and a Command Module. The only photographic proof I've seen for the rebels possessing anything is solely the launcher module. Additionally you'd have to be relatively well trained to accurately use the weaponry which some rebels in the eastern Ukraine most likely aren't.

They've managed to shoot down plenty of actual AN-26's in the last week or so, so I don't think it's out of the question. Not to mention that there are former Soviet troops on both sides of the conflict.