Elton John: "Jesus Would Support Gay Marriage"

[Scholmeria]

But Jesus told to the first Pope that he will built a Church upon him. Also mt 16; 18.
The 1st pope is authorized by Jesus.

Do you even know what that means? Or do you just think that's what it means?

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

[Kelinfort]

Please provide the statement, and state why you believe it to be wrong, I've no interest in digging through pages of weak arguments.

I believe it is wrong because of the various type of scriptures within the Bible that state that it is wrong. While I believe that love is universal, I believe that it should be between a man and a woman. Now lets talk science. We are all animals, homo sapiens, that is our scientific name. You don't see animals engaging in homsexual acts. When have you ever seen a lion mate with another lion, I have lived in Africa where lions are very famous and I have visited many national parks and I can tell you this, I have never seen any lion mate with another lion. Whiel I am aware that animals have engaged in homosexual behavior, I can tell you that it is not the majority of animals, it is the minority. From what I have been told so this isn't my opinion, the western world promotes homosexuality and when President Obama stated that he supported it, I was quite surprised and my opinion of the President diminished however I still like how he runs the country. I purely believe that it is wrong. Also it doesn't represent any benefit to humanity because if all humans were homosexual, we would soon be extinct because it is basick knowledge that in order to reproduce, a man and a woman must engage in sexual intercourse.

Thanks for the anecdotes, but you're clearly incorrect. They're have been enough natural fallacies on this forum to fill a book, but I'll tell you exactly where you went wrong. Firstly, 1500 animals practice and engage in homosexuality. Secondly, discounting other passages in your holy book notwithstanding, following an ancient text on morality in which the killing of infants and civilians is morally just doesn't make sense.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Do you even know what that means? Or do you just think that's what it means?

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

The Catholic Church merely legitimized Peter as the first pope, you guys were the ones who appointed him; he never appointed himself shit. He was dead ~400 years before even Constantine was even born.

Again, unless Peter is a highlander your statement is inaccurate. Also, look at what Jesus also says a bit later on where he says that he didn't come to bring peace, but dissent.

[Kelinfort]

Do you even know what that means? Or do you just think that's what it means?

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

Based on ancestry...wait, the only reason it is considered the only Church is due to councils set up by this specific set that codified the Church as the only Church. It's a catch 22 and it discounts the Nestorians and Arians of the period.

[Genivaria]

Technically if you we're talking about the oldest still existing branch of Christianity that would actually be the Eastern Orthodox Church which the 1st Pope broke away from.
So really Catholics are the heretics.

But Jesus told to the first Pope that he will built a Church upon him. Also mt 16; 18.
The 1st pope is authorized by Jesus.

According to the Catholic Church yes, that would be very convenient for them.
The Catholic Church didn't exist until it broke away from the Orthodox church in the middle ages.

[United States Kingdom]

I believe it is wrong because of the various type of scriptures within the Bible that state that it is wrong. While I believe that love is universal, I believe that it should be between a man and a woman.

Now lets talk science. We are all animals, homo sapiens, that is our scientific name. You don't see animals engaging in homsexual acts. When have you ever seen a lion mate with another lion, I have lived in Africa where lions are very famous and I have visited many national parks and I can tell you this, I have never seen any lion mate with another lion.

Whiel I am aware that animals have engaged in homosexual behavior, I can tell you that it is not the majority of animals, it is the minority. From what I have been told so this isn't my opinion, the western world promotes homosexuality and when President Obama stated that he supported it, I was quite surprised and my opinion of the President diminished however I still like how he runs the country.

I purely believe that it is wrong. Also it doesn't represent any benefit to humanity because if all humans were homosexual, we would soon be extinct because it is basick knowledge that in order to reproduce, a man and a woman must engage in sexual intercourse.

We're already at over 7.3 billion people. How the fuck do you intend to keep everyone alive above the 8 billion mark? That should be our problem, innit?

Homosexual behavior is a minority, yes; how the fuck do you think so many alternative sexualities have appeared with over 7 billion people? Care to take a guess?

Their are only three types of sexualities people will follow. Bisexual, homosexuality, and what people term as being 'straight' which is when a man likes another woman, etc.

Colonizing other worlds recently has become an approach to make sure the human population live and FYI, the fertility rate has been decreasing in places like Africa, and Asia which have most of the world's population.

[Genivaria]

Do you even know what that means? Or do you just think that's what it means?

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

History proves otherwise.

[Kelinfort]

We're already at over 7.3 billion people. How the fuck do you intend to keep everyone alive above the 8 billion mark? That should be our problem, innit?

Homosexual behavior is a minority, yes; how the fuck do you think so many alternative sexualities have appeared with over 7 billion people? Care to take a guess?

Their are only three types of sexualities people will follow. Bisexual, homosexuality, and what people term as being 'straight' which is when a man likes another woman, etc.

Colonizing other worlds recently has become an approach to make sure the human population live and FYI, the fertility rate has been decreasing in places like Africa, and Asia which have most of the world's population.

You're quite mistaken. There are androgynous people, pansexuals, along with asexuals to name a few.

Yes, but at the current rate of growth, there shouldn't be even a hint in the decrease of the human population.

[Genivaria]

Technically if you we're talking about the oldest still existing branch of Christianity that would actually be the Eastern Orthodox Church which the 1st Pope broke away from.
So really Catholics are the heretics.

I'm a Catholic, how am I a heretic.

Because the Catholic Church merely broke away from the previously existing Orthodox Church.
Therefore the Catholic Church cannot be the 'original' anything.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

We're already at over 7.3 billion people. How the fuck do you intend to keep everyone alive above the 8 billion mark? That should be our problem, innit?

Homosexual behavior is a minority, yes; how the fuck do you think so many alternative sexualities have appeared with over 7 billion people? Care to take a guess?

Their are only three types of sexualities people will follow. Bisexual, homosexuality, and what people term as being 'straight' which is when a man likes another woman, etc.

Colonizing other worlds recently has become an approach to make sure the human population live and FYI, the fertility rate has been decreasing in places like Africa, and Asia which have most of the world's population.

Yes, again, how do you think so many homosexuals and bisexuals and other such alternative sexualities have appeared? It's not something that all of a sudden there was a tidal wave of homosexuals just invading our surface world like the Lizardmen. These people are more visible precisely because there's above 7 billion people.

[Nierr]

Do you even know what that means? Or do you just think that's what it means?

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

No, it really isn't.

Anything that has strayed from the original following of Jesus and the original Christian community is a heresy. The Catholic Church is heretical, and thus cannot be the 'real' Christian Church.

[Death Metal]

Do you even know what that means? Or do you just think that's what it means?

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

And No True Scotsman sugars his porridge.

[Farnhamia]

But Jesus told to the first Pope that he will built a Church upon him. Also mt 16; 18.
The 1st pope is authorized by Jesus.

According to the Catholic Church yes, that would be very convenient for them.
The Catholic Church didn't exist until it broke away from the Orthodox church in the middle ages.

Mmm ... that's stretching things, methinks, to say that the Catholic Church didn't exist until the Middle Ages. Arch will know better, with details, but the See of Rome is equally as old as Constantinople and has the advantage of having been founded by Saints Peter and Paul, whereas Constantinople can boast only of Saint Andrew. And Scholmeria is wrong, too, the first Pope, Saint Peter, didn't break away from the "Eastern Orthodox Church" since he himself pre-dated it. The real break between Rome and Constantinople came in 1054 and it came over issues with the liturgy and whether the other Apostolic Sees should obey Rome. It was complicated.

Anyway, Jesus' opinion on same-sex marriage is irrelevant, at least to me. If Sir Elton wants to voice an opinion on it, well, that's his prerogative.

[Puerto Tyranus]

Hmmm...I feel as though Jesus would stay quiet on the matter. He was a more "follow my example" kind of guy than a "you are all wrong" one. As far as gay marriage goes, I support it. Not because I believe it is right (I think that it is a sin), but because the separation of church and state here in the US (where I assume you are talking about) means that there is no legitimate reason to keep peoples from being married for a reason as flimsy as sexual preference.

[Farnhamia]

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

And No True Scotsman sugars his porridge.

Only because ... have you seen the price of sugar in Scotland?

[Scholmeria]

Yes, I know what that means. The Catholic Church is the only real Christian Church.

History proves otherwise.

The CC could never secede from the Orthodox Church as it never existed. It is a social construct and imagination.

Also go to wikipedia and see the list of popes I am a phone now.

[Fascist Russian Empire]

[Insert Generic "God hates fags, Jesus would never stoop so low as to support the disgusting abomination that is same sex marriage; fuck the lack of Biblical evidence to support my case, I think fags are disgusting and God has to think what I think," Comment Here]

But, seriously, there should be more people like Elton John in the world. Christ would, indeed, almost certainly support same-sex marriage, and it's ridiculous to think that he wouldn't just because of your own personal views against homosexuality.

[Genivaria]

History proves otherwise.

The CC could never secede from the Orthodox Church as it never existed. It is a social construct and imagination.

Also go to wikipedia and see the list of popes I am a phone now.

Religion itself is a social construct so I'm not sure what your point is.
And 300 million people will be very surprised to hear they don't exist.

[MERIZoC]

History proves otherwise.

I am a phone now.

How did it happen?

[Farnhamia]

I am a phone now.

How did it happen?

It was bound to.

[United States Kingdom]

Their are only three types of sexualities people will follow. Bisexual, homosexuality, and what people term as being 'straight' which is when a man likes another woman, etc.

Colonizing other worlds recently has become an approach to make sure the human population live and FYI, the fertility rate has been decreasing in places like Africa, and Asia which have most of the world's population.

Yes, again, how do you think so many homosexuals and bisexuals and other such alternative sexualities have appeared? It's not something that all of a sudden there was a tidal wave of homosexuals just invading our surface world like the Lizardmen. These people are more visible precisely because there's above 7 billion people.

Your telling me that their are above 7 billion homosexuals in the world. Your calculations are absolutely incorrect.

[Scholmeria]

I am a phone now.

How did it happen?

I meant that I am on a phone now so it is hard to answer to everybody.

[Geanna]

Please provide the statement, and state why you believe it to be wrong, I've no interest in digging through pages of weak arguments.

I believe it is wrong because of the various type of scriptures within the Bible that state that it is wrong. While I believe that love is universal, I believe that it should be between a man and a woman. Now lets talk science. We are all animals, homo sapiens, that is our scientific name. You don't see animals engaging in homsexual acts. When have you ever seen a lion mate with another lion, I have lived in Africa where lions are very famous and I have visited many national parks and I can tell you this, I have never seen any lion mate with another lion. Whiel I am aware that animals have engaged in homosexual behavior, I can tell you that it is not the majority of animals, it is the minority. From what I have been told so this isn't my opinion, the western world promotes homosexuality and when President Obama stated that he supported it, I was quite surprised and my opinion of the President diminished however I still like how he runs the country. I purely believe that it is wrong. Also it doesn't represent any benefit to humanity because if all humans were homosexual, we would soon be extinct because it is basick knowledge that in order to reproduce, a man and a woman must engage in sexual intercourse.

I've seen plenty of animals engage in 'homosexual' acts, hell I use to have a dog that'd hump anything including the neighbour's cat [both male]. Try again.

You also do realize that a little curve to the population wouldn't be a bad thing right? We're at a population of 7 Billion and by 2050? I think it was, we'll have to produce more food to feed ourselves then we've created in the last 8,000 years.

Let us take a look;

Leviticus 18:22; One of the most common scriptures pointed to for ''HOMOESEKSUALZ BAD''
Thou shalt not lie with a man, as with a woman: it is abomination.

At first glimpse, one could manipulate such with ease, lie becomes sex, and it says, ''You shall not have sex with a man, as with a woman''

Let's take a look at another;

Leviticus 20:13;

If a man lie with a man, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Pretty much the same spout, just a little more.

Firstly, let's agree that this applied to Homosexuality, Apostle Paul stated in Galatians 3:10, That we, as Humans are no longer bound to the laws of the Old Testament. They couldn't apply to the world anymore,

All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

Basically what this means, is that if we continue to follow the Old Testament we have cursed and bound ourselves to something that no longer applies, what changed? Christ.

Galations 3:13
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law by becoming a curse for us.

That should be pretty self explanatory, we're no longer bound to the Old Testament because Jesus sacrificed himself on the Cross, thus relieving us of a curse, because now we could be forgiven for what we've done. In fact, to continue to live by the old laws in the Old Testament would be a slap in the face to Christ.

Galatians 5:1
It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.

Basically what Paul was pointing out, is that we had become slaves to the Old Testament and it's laws, because in doing so you can not ''Walk of the spirit'', essentially it kept people from becoming slaves or slave masters by the Old Testament, Jesus points out that you can not follow ''two masters'' as it would be like ''having a dog return to it's own vomit'', thus meaning that you could not force someone to observe the old laws as that would make you a slave master. Likewise, you could not observe the law, and walk among the spirit at the same time.


Now, let's look at 18:22 again; Thou shalt not lie with a man, as with a woman: it is abomination.
Seems clear cut and dry, except this is a bastardization for a translation from Hebrew. The word for 'lie' in Hebrew would not have translated as such, they would've used 'zimah' when translating to Greek. They didn't however, this verse is not saying do not have sexual relationships with a man, [the actual connotation in Hebrew could be applied as Mankind] it's saying do not cheat on your wife.

Through out the Bible, when it references a man and a woman, it usually is implying they have been ceremonially wed. When you look at the actual translation, 'Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with a woman: it is abomination' it is stating that one should not have intercourse with another of humanity while married. You're using a book that was translated from Hebrew [which has some 80,000 words vs English's some 600,000 words] into Greek than into whatever else it was translated.

As well, you may think it's wrong, you may condemn it, but may I remind you that by doing so you are committing judgement and undermining the power of God.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Yes, again, how do you think so many homosexuals and bisexuals and other such alternative sexualities have appeared? It's not something that all of a sudden there was a tidal wave of homosexuals just invading our surface world like the Lizardmen. These people are more visible precisely because there's above 7 billion people.

Your telling me that their are above 7 billion homosexuals in the world. Your calculations are absolutely incorrect.

How did you even get that from my statement?!

[Genivaria]

Yes, again, how do you think so many homosexuals and bisexuals and other such alternative sexualities have appeared? It's not something that all of a sudden there was a tidal wave of homosexuals just invading our surface world like the Lizardmen. These people are more visible precisely because there's above 7 billion people.

Your telling me that their are above 7 billion homosexuals in the world. Your calculations are absolutely incorrect.

Reading comprehension. What is it?
No what he's saying is that because homosexuality is statically proportional to the overall population the increase of population means an increase in the number of homosexuals.