Iraqi PM declares "State of Emergency" as ISIS occupy Mosul

[Valaran]

Well they have been arguing for a proper Kurdistan for some time now, and of course they should get it.

If a democratic Kurdish nation were formed from the region know as Kurdistan in Iraq, Iran, and Syria then the US might have itself a real ally other then Israel.
Frankly I think the US and the West in general NEED a muslim majority ally.

Well don't forget Turkey and Jordan. Turkey (as everyone knows) is the second largest army in NATO and Jordan was one of the first Arab countries to recognize Israel. Also the Saudis are erratic allies, and most of the Gulf states are friendly, especially Kuwait. Even Iran is helpful combating the ISIS.

So yeah I agree, but its not like the US has no Muslim friends in the region. Of course most aren't the strong allies it needs, but I would count Turkey as being so.

[Volnotova]

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

[Genivaria]

If a democratic Kurdish nation were formed from the region know as Kurdistan in Iraq, Iran, and Syria then the US might have itself a real ally other then Israel.
Frankly I think the US and the West in general NEED a muslim majority ally.

Well don't forget Turkey and Jordan. Turkey (as everyone knows) is the second largest army in NATO and Jordan was one of the first Arab countries to recognize Israel. Also the Saudis are erratic allies, and most of the Gulf states are friendly, especially Kuwait. Even Iran is helpful combating the ISIS.

So yeah I agree, but its not like the US has no Muslim friends in the region. Of course most aren't the strong allies it needs, but I would count Turkey as being so.

Fair enough, still though always good to have more allies in a volatile region.

[Valaran]

Well don't forget Turkey and Jordan. Turkey (as everyone knows) is the second largest army in NATO and Jordan was one of the first Arab countries to recognize Israel. Also the Saudis are erratic allies, and most of the Gulf states are friendly, especially Kuwait. Even Iran is helpful combating the ISIS.

So yeah I agree, but its not like the US has no Muslim friends in the region. Of course most aren't the strong allies it needs, but I would count Turkey as being so.

Fair enough, still though always good to have more allies in a volatile region.

Of course, and the Kurds are very good allies to have.

[Aushanit]

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

Selling/using all that stolen US Aid.

[Valaran]

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

That is troubling. However, at least it has been uncovered, and they don't have support from Al Qaeda as a whole, so this is likely one of their only funding lines.

[Scholmeria]

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

The US should stop being allied with Saudi Arabia.

[Valaran]

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

The US should stop being allied with Saudi Arabia.

While Saudi Arabia is unpredictable at the best of times, and down right against us at the worst, I feel that it is somewhat similar to Pakistan. We don't like it, and its not a good ally, but for it to be an enemy (or collapse) is a worse situation.

Many terrorists come from it, and it may disintegrate and fall into a jihadist hotbed without western help (on its military for example - it spends as much as the UK on soldiers and US weapons).

Also, it has a lot of regional influence, over the gulf, sunnis and Syrian rebels (to name but a few) plus its oil wealth, so I would not want to alienate such a nation, as it creates an enemy that is far more powerful than Iran and has numerous proxies. Real politik might have to triumph here, unfortunately.

[Scholmeria]

Also, it has a lot of regional influence, over the gulf, sunnis and Syrian rebels (to name but a few) plus it s oil wealth, so I would not want to alienate, as it creates an enemy that is far more powerful than Iran and has numerous proxies. Real politik might have to triumph here, unfortunately.

The SA might also lose a good costumer (the US) for their oil. So their economy might be hurt. At least the US should try to stage a coup there.

[Valaran]

Also, it has a lot of regional influence, over the gulf, sunnis and Syrian rebels (to name but a few) plus it s oil wealth, so I would not want to alienate, as it creates an enemy that is far more powerful than Iran and has numerous proxies. Real politik might have to triumph here, unfortunately.

The SA might also lose a good costumer (the US) for their oil. So their economy might be hurt. At least the US should try to stage a coup there.

That kind of thinking lead to the formation of the current Iran. It was our ally, until we overthrew the govt. and put a Shah back in, who then ruined everything and paved the way for the hostile theocracy. Forming coups doesn't solve anything, and merely destabilizes the country. Who would we install? How would it help, and not erode stability? (It might even get the US sucked into a conflict there again)

Also, this isn't the cold war anymore; the US doesn't need to do that, especially if it wants to keep and moral high ground on anything else.

I really don't think coups are the answer here.

[-The Unified Earth Governments-]

Also, it has a lot of regional influence, over the gulf, sunnis and Syrian rebels (to name but a few) plus it s oil wealth, so I would not want to alienate, as it creates an enemy that is far more powerful than Iran and has numerous proxies. Real politik might have to triumph here, unfortunately.

The SA might also lose a good costumer (the US) for their oil. So their economy might be hurt. At least the US should try to stage a coup there.

This, come on, you telling me we can't get to to fight each other, or start a puppet there, come on fellas, stop beating us up and bully someone who isn't US Citizens, do it Government, do it!

[Scholmeria]

That kind of thinking lead to the formation of the current Iran. It was our ally, until we overthrew the govt. and put a Shah back in, who then ruined everything and paved the way for the hostile theocracy. Forming coups doesn't solve anything, and merely destabilizes the country. Who would we install? How would it help, and not erode stability? (It might even get the US sucked into a conflict there again)

Also, this isn't the cold war anymore; the US doesn't need to do that, especially if it wants to keep and moral high ground on anything else.

I really don't think coups are the answer here.

Well, it had to do something as the Saudi government is funding radical islamic movements in Europe and America. They are doing everything to spread Islam as that benefits the Saudi royal family (islam consider them as some high priests). SA become a holy cow to the western media and are not allowed to critise it. You know, you will never heard from CNN every critics about SA but you will also hea how gays in Russia are tortured (hypocrisy).

Also, the situation with Iran would not be comparable. The guy which was deposited in Iran was a secular socialist. In Saudi Arabia it will be a theocracy that will be deposited. But yes I agree it will be hard to find somebody from SA to make the coup. The only good thing would be to fund NGOs like in Russia.

[Valaran]

That kind of thinking lead to the formation of the current Iran. It was our ally, until we overthrew the govt. and put a Shah back in, who then ruined everything and paved the way for the hostile theocracy. Forming coups doesn't solve anything, and merely destabilizes the country. Who would we install? How would it help, and not erode stability? (It might even get the US sucked into a conflict there again)

Also, this isn't the cold war anymore; the US doesn't need to do that, especially if it wants to keep and moral high ground on anything else.

I really don't think coups are the answer here.

Well, it had to do something as the Saudi government is funding radical islamic movements in Europe and America. They are doing everything to spread Islam as that benefits the Saudi royal family (islam consider them as some high priests).

Also, the situation with Iran would not be comparable. The guy which was deposited in Iran was a secular socialist. In Saudi Arabia it will be a theocracy that will be deposited. But yes I agree it will be hard to find somebody from SA to make the coup. The only good thing would be to fund NGOs like in Russia.

The result of instability would be similar to Iran though. (sorry for short post)

[Volnotova]

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

The US should stop being allied with Saudi Arabia.

The whole US-Saudi alliance dates back to the Nixon era, in which, in return for American support the Saudi's (And OPEC as a whole through Saudi influence) would only accept US dollars in return for oil (thus de facto turning the US dollar into the world's reserve currency).

As much as they are a pain in the butt (It probably never would have gotten to this point if the gulf states including Saudi Arabia hadn't supported Al Nusra, of which ISIS/ISIL is the offshoot), abandoning them would create even more problems.

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

That is troubling. However, at least it has been uncovered, and they don't have support from Al Qaeda as a whole, so this is likely one of their only funding lines.

Well, it seems the influence of foreign donors was overstated and that most of the funding came from ISIS/ISIL it self through controlling oil and gas fields, refineries, power plants, taxes, archeological diggings, looting, kidnappings, etc.

ISIS/ISIL allegedly controls up to $2bn in assets and funds



To give you an idea, Al Qaeda's annual pre-9/11 budget was 30 million, which was consider 'a lot'.

Selling/using all that stolen US Aid.

Well, it is a substantial part of their available resources (It seems that even before Mosul they got their hands on American made gear).

[Volnotova]

That kind of thinking lead to the formation of the current Iran. It was our ally, until we overthrew the govt. and put a Shah back in, who then ruined everything and paved the way for the hostile theocracy. Forming coups doesn't solve anything, and merely destabilizes the country. Who would we install? How would it help, and not erode stability? (It might even get the US sucked into a conflict there again)

Also, this isn't the cold war anymore; the US doesn't need to do that, especially if it wants to keep and moral high ground on anything else.

I really don't think coups are the answer here.

Well, it had to do something as the Saudi government is funding radical islamic movements in Europe and America. They are doing everything to spread Islam as that benefits the Saudi royal family (islam consider them as some high priests). SA become a holy cow to the western media and are not allowed to critise it. You know, you will never heard from CNN every critics about SA but you will also hea how gays in Russia are tortured (hypocrisy).

Also, the situation with Iran would not be comparable. The guy which was deposited in Iran was a secular socialist. In Saudi Arabia it will be a theocracy that will be deposited. But yes I agree it will be hard to find somebody from SA to make the coup. The only good thing would be to fund NGOs like in Russia.

Only a certain sect tends to venerate them. They are viewed by many as apostates and the enemies of Islam.

[Aushanit]

The US should stop being allied with Saudi Arabia.

The whole US-Saudi alliance dates back to the Nixon era, in which, in return for American support the Saudi's (And OPEC as a whole through Saudi influence) would only accept US dollars in return for oil (thus de facto turning the US dollar into the world's reserve currency).

As much as they are a pain in the butt (It probably never would have gotten to this point if the gulf states including Saudi Arabia hadn't supported Al Nusra, of which ISIS/ISIL is the offshoot), abandoning them would create even more problems.

That is troubling. However, at least it has been uncovered, and they don't have support from Al Qaeda as a whole, so this is likely one of their only funding lines.

Well, it seems the influence of foreign donors was overstated and that most of the funding came from ISIS/ISIL it self through controlling oil and gas fields, refineries, power plants, taxes, archeological diggings, looting, kidnappings, etc.

Selling/using all that stolen US Aid.

Well, it is a substantial part of their available resources (It seems that even before Mosul they got their hands on American made gear).

A lot of it was stolen from FSA members in Syria as well as gun markets in Lebanon with the fact that many American weapons from Israel are in the country. Although they obviously have other forms of fund raising probably trafficking and extortion are a big part of there funds as well not to mention operation businesses.

[Alien Space Bats]

How long until Baghdad falls becomes the 21st Century version of Beirut?

Fixed that for you. The Shi'ite half of the country will fight like maniacs rather than be exterminated. Since Baghdad is divided between Sunnis and Shi'ites, it's not hard to see how this is going to go down once the conflict gets there.

[Alien Space Bats]

This talk of partition is a waste of time. Germany has a traditionally Catholic area and a traditionally Protestant area yet don't see them continuously fighting each other over religion.

Remember the Thirty Years' War?

There was once a time when partition was EXACTLY what was needed to keep Germans from slaughtering each other. Indeed, the Thirty Years' War was the bloodiest European war of its day, only eventually surpassed by the First and Second World Wars.

[Alien Space Bats]

Of the Iraqi's can get competent leadership they will be a force to be reckoned with, the Revolutionary Guard are a powerful and well trained not to mention combat experienced.

What Revolutionary Guard are you talking about?

You DO realize that we completely dismantled Saddam's military and then rebuilt a new one all our own that had no connection whatsoever to the old one, right?

[Lackadaisical2]

This talk of partition is a waste of time. Germany has a traditionally Catholic area and a traditionally Protestant area yet don't see them continuously fighting each other over religion.

They had their own wars about it... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirty_Years%27_War

Because Iraq is Germany, Sunnis are Protestants, and Shi'ites are Catholics?

Germany has been a nation-state for a lot longer than Iraq has been. Germany has been through some pretty rough transitions that united the people - can Iraqis say the same? Etc etc etc.

Germany existed prior as the Holy Roman Empire so the German nation exist at least 500 years.

What are the Kurds in the German case?

The Kurds are pro-western and religious tolerant, in case they have freedom they could serve as a base from which freedom and democracy woul be spread in the region.

Did you just say we could spread freedom and democracy without using the term ironically?

[Volnotova]

Did you just say we could spread freedom and democracy without using the term ironically?

Third time's the charm.

[United Marxist Nations]

Don't know if anyone has commented, but I've seen lots of pictures and videos on the news that seem to show local Sunnis joining up with the ISIL forces; does anyone have an estimate on how many have joined the ISIL fighters?

[Aushanit]

Of the Iraqi's can get competent leadership they will be a force to be reckoned with, the Revolutionary Guard are a powerful and well trained not to mention combat experienced.

What Revolutionary Guard are you talking about?

You DO realize that we completely dismantled Saddam's military and then rebuilt a new one all our own that had no connection whatsoever to the old one, right?

No not the Republican Guard but the Revolutionary Guard a branch of the Iranian army.

[Aushanit]

Don't know if anyone has commented, but I've seen lots of pictures and videos on the news that seem to show local Sunnis joining up with the ISIL forces; does anyone have an estimate on how many have joined the ISIL fighters?

Probably no more then a few thousand although from what I've heard most ISIS fighters in Iraq are Iraqi Sunnis although it's definitely safe to say you a lot of fighters crossing over from Syria as well.

[Volnotova]

Don't know if anyone has commented, but I've seen lots of pictures and videos on the news that seem to show local Sunnis joining up with the ISIL forces; does anyone have an estimate on how many have joined the ISIL fighters?

Probably no more then a few thousand although from what I've heard most ISIS fighters in Iraq are Iraqi Sunnis although it's definitely safe to say you a lot of fighters crossing over from Syria as well.

Regarding POWs, their position basically boils down to "Repent (join us) or die".

Same with their 'allies': Join us and enjoy the spoils of war, or fight us and end up being exterminated.

I wonder if this Abu Bakr guy (head of ISIS/ISIL) was somehow inspired by the rulers of the Mongolian empire...