No dates? Shoot a bunch of people. Santa Barbara Drive By.

[Llamalandia]

Well it's possible for things to happen and be isolated incidents, I just want more robust evidence of that being his clear motivation in this case.

*sigh*

No. There is hardly ever a such thing as an isolated incident. An isolated incident would be a random killing happening to a random person from a random source for no discernible reason. A crime committed because of a belief of entitlement to sex is not "isolated" in any sense of the term.

No what I'm saying is that it is possible this incident was motivated purely because he felt he was entitled to sex and that it happened just that way even though we don't necessarily see a huge pattern of these types of killings. It's possible for a unique event to occur just as described above. IT's also possible that it's part of pattern of guys entitled to sex becoming murderers too. It could be either way.

[Condunum]

Right, just sweep it under the rug like we do with any other problem we can't just blame on X evil cause.

Pretty much. What's the point? Murderers have been murdering from the beginning of time. We do what we can to police it. We can't stop it completely though. It happened. It's sad, but it happened and there's nothing you or I can do. The dead are dead. The rest just do what they can to keep going.

*sighs again* I'm gonna be doing that a lot in this thread I think.

Look, I get that you probably live in a relatively safe neighborhood, but most of us don't and many of us would like it if we make a concerted effort to actually make sure communities don't go to shit. If you're going to suggest that we should stop, look at the dead, and then pick the fuck back up without at least attempting to understand and solve the underlying issues which are so very obviously our problem, then you can shove it buddy.

[Dakini]

What the fuck?


You say as you punctuate that sentence with a fucking winky smiley face.

Well, I seriously doubt it was appropriate here barring some huge shocking twist in the story.

Jesus fucking Christ, what the fuck is wrong with you?

[Navarroia]

Seriously what a deprived asshole.

[Llamalandia]

Pretty much. What's the point? Murderers have been murdering from the beginning of time. We do what we can to police it. We can't stop it completely though. It happened. It's sad, but it happened and there's nothing you or I can do. The dead are dead. The rest just do what they can to keep going.

*sighs again* I'm gonna be doing that a lot in this thread I think.

Look, I get that you probably live in a relatively safe neighborhood, but most of us don't and many of us would like it if we make a concerted effort to actually make sure communities don't go to shit. If you're going to suggest that we should stop, look at the dead, and then pick the fuck back up without at least attempting to understand and solve the underlying issues which are so very obviously our problem, then you can shove it buddy.

Umm wtf, what country do you live in Somalia? I mean I believe the vast majority of americans live in fairly safe and polite neighborhoods. Heck even the least well off in american society are orders of magnitude safer than say the richest Iraqis (excluding say perhaps innercity Chicago)

[Keyboard Warriors]

People just don't like being rejected. It's not just men; more extreme in the male gender of course but there are plenty of women who bitch about Guy X turning down their advances.

Complaining about being turned down is totally the same as shooting them.

I never said it was. Just trying to explain the notion of people thinking they deserve to get laid. I don't condone or sympathize with what he did in any way shape or form, nor do I accept his reasoning as even somewhat understandable for a rational person.

[Llamalandia]

Well, I seriously doubt it was appropriate here barring some huge shocking twist in the story.

Jesus fucking Christ, what the fuck is wrong with you?

Well hey I mean what if we find out that say the people he killed had tortured him a few months earlier? That would certainly change my opinion of the situation I would think such a "twist" would cause any reasonable person to rethink which side was right and which was wrong. It's a hugely imrobable twist I admit but hey stranger things have happened.

[Keyboard Warriors]

Jesus fucking Christ, what the fuck is wrong with you?

Well hey I mean what if we find out that say the people he killed had tortured him a few months earlier? That would certainly change my opinion of the situation I would think such a "twist" would cause any reasonable person to rethink which side was right and which was wrong. It's a hugely imrobable twist I admit but hey stranger things have happened.

You really should stop using smilies in every post.

[Norstal]

*sighs again* I'm gonna be doing that a lot in this thread I think.

Look, I get that you probably live in a relatively safe neighborhood, but most of us don't and many of us would like it if we make a concerted effort to actually make sure communities don't go to shit. If you're going to suggest that we should stop, look at the dead, and then pick the fuck back up without at least attempting to understand and solve the underlying issues which are so very obviously our problem, then you can shove it buddy.

Umm wtf, what country do you live in Somalia? I mean I believe the vast majority of americans live in fairly safe and polite neighborhoods. Heck even the least well off in american society are orders of magnitude safer than say the riches Iraqis (excluding say perhaps innercity Chicago)

You see this graph?


This is you if you were a plane.

[Condunum]

Seriously what a deprived asshole.

You really, really can't get much lower on the moral scale then, "WELL FUK U IF UR NOT GUNA FUK ME POP POP"

[Condunum]

*sighs again* I'm gonna be doing that a lot in this thread I think.

Look, I get that you probably live in a relatively safe neighborhood, but most of us don't and many of us would like it if we make a concerted effort to actually make sure communities don't go to shit. If you're going to suggest that we should stop, look at the dead, and then pick the fuck back up without at least attempting to understand and solve the underlying issues which are so very obviously our problem, then you can shove it buddy.

Umm wtf, what country do you live in Somalia? I mean I believe the vast majority of americans live in fairly safe and polite neighborhoods. Heck even the least well off in american society are orders of magnitude safer than say the richest Iraqis (excluding say perhaps innercity Chicago)

Do you live under a rock? I watched a man get carted into an ambulance for a stabbing a few weeks ago. Believe it or not but America has a fucking gnarly crime problem and ignoring it will not make the problem go away, it will only make it worse.

[Llamalandia]

Umm wtf, what country do you live in Somalia? I mean I believe the vast majority of americans live in fairly safe and polite neighborhoods. Heck even the least well off in american society are orders of magnitude safer than say the richest Iraqis (excluding say perhaps innercity Chicago)

Do you live under a rock? I watched a man get carted into an ambulance for a stabbing a few weeks ago. Believe it or not but America has a fucking gnarly crime problem and ignoring it will not make the problem go away, it will only make it worse.

Perhaps, still violent crime tends to only affect a fairly small minority of americans every year. Especially when one considers are specific makeup, history, and the fact that americans are largely on average pretty well armed it's actually rather amazing we don't have a more intense and more prevalent violent crime problem. Not to minimze the impact on victims, but I think saying that it's a problem affecting the majority is at least slightly misleading and inaccurate.

[Tahar Joblis]

Not necessarily, plenty of people who dislike older notions of manhood nonetheless make insults about guys who are virgins. Clearly there's more to it than that.

I would say that's because they "dislike older notions of manhood" only in a very limited sense. They want to change the parts that bother them, but want all the other things to stay the same.

[Llamalandia]

Umm wtf, what country do you live in Somalia? I mean I believe the vast majority of americans live in fairly safe and polite neighborhoods. Heck even the least well off in american society are orders of magnitude safer than say the riches Iraqis (excluding say perhaps innercity Chicago)

You see this graph?


This is you if you were a plane.

Umm why show a graph of a line when presumably you could have just graphed the plane that you seem to be suggesting I am. Btw I don't really get it.

[Navarroia]

Seriously what a deprived asshole.

You really, really can't get much lower on the moral scale then, "WELL FUK U IF UR NOT GUNA FUK ME POP POP"

It’s a huge problem with society when people who can’t get what they desire lash out. It’s also a bigger problem with lunatics like the cowardly shooter.

[Llamalandia]

Seriously what a deprived asshole.

You really, really can't get much lower on the moral scale then, "WELL FUK U IF UR NOT GUNA FUK ME POP POP"

Sure you can, ever here of say genocide. Or ritualistic cult mass murder/suicide pacts? There's a ways to go on the way to the absolute bottom of the metaphorical well that is human depravity.

[Condunum]

Do you live under a rock? I watched a man get carted into an ambulance for a stabbing a few weeks ago. Believe it or not but America has a fucking gnarly crime problem and ignoring it will not make the problem go away, it will only make it worse.

Perhaps, still violent crime tends to only affect a fairly small minority of americans every year. Especially when one considers are specific makeup, history, and the fact that americans are largely on average pretty well armed it's actually rather amazing we don't have a more intense and more prevalent violent crime problem. Not to minimze the impact on victims, but I think saying that it's a problem affecting the majority is at least slightly misleading and inaccurate.

Holy fuck just never, ever speak on this topic again. That's the most embarrassing thing I've read and I didn't even write it. For the sake of yourself, just pack up and leave.

[Ordinary People]

Complaining about being turned down is totally the same as shooting them.

Meh, sometimes people don't listen and more forceful means are necessary, not that I'm saying they were necessarily appropriate in this instance.

I'm sorry... is it just me (lol, no, it isn't), or are you seriously suggesting that something such as rape (be it male-on-female or female-on-male) is... necessary?

Just wanted to clear that up.

[Cannot think of a name]

It's interesting to see this after several posters made statements along the lines of "if it was a problem where men lash out violently when they felt entitled to sex we'd see more of this" and then not even a day later, we see more of that.

I actually was contemplating my own comment (look, someone has to) and decided to see if my google fu was up to looking into it. Here's what I found:

A shockingly similar shooting at an aerobics class in 2009
A 16 year old kid getting stabby in Conneticut after getting turned down for a last minute prom date.
Of course the Texas shooting the prostitute thing that NSG covered when it happened, actually. (seriously, that came up in a google search for shootings of this nature)
This Baton Rouge teen who got shot for refusing sex.
Australian lady, shot in the crotch for refusing oral sex.
Pregnant woman shot for refusing sex.

At this point I stopped looking. There's no real database for this, these came from fiddling with google search terms.

[Ordinary People]

You really, really can't get much lower on the moral scale then, "WELL FUK U IF UR NOT GUNA FUK ME POP POP"

Sure you can, ever here of say genocide. Or ritualistic cult mass murder/suicide pacts? There's a ways to go on the way to the absolute bottom of the metaphorical well that is human depravity.

It might not be the bottom, but you can sure see it from here.

[Dakini]

It's interesting to see this after several posters made statements along the lines of "if it was a problem where men lash out violently when they felt entitled to sex we'd see more of this" and then not even a day later, we see more of that.

I actually was contemplating my own comment (look, someone has to) and decided to see if my google fu was up to looking into it. Here's what I found:

A shockingly similar shooting at an aerobics class in 2009
A 16 year old kid getting stabby in Conneticut after getting turned down for a last minute prom date.
Of course the Texas shooting the prostitute thing that NSG covered when it happened, actually. (seriously, that came up in a google search for shootings of this nature)
This Baton Rouge teen who got shot for refusing sex.
Australian lady, shot in the crotch for refusing oral sex.
Pregnant woman shot for refusing sex.

At this point I stopped looking. There's no real database for this, these came from fiddling with google search terms.

You could probably throw in a lot of the women who are murdered when they attempt to leave abuses partners. It's not the exact same thing, but I suspect the motivations are similar.

[Cannot think of a name]

I actually was contemplating my own comment (look, someone has to) and decided to see if my google fu was up to looking into it. Here's what I found:

A shockingly similar shooting at an aerobics class in 2009
A 16 year old kid getting stabby in Conneticut after getting turned down for a last minute prom date.
Of course the Texas shooting the prostitute thing that NSG covered when it happened, actually. (seriously, that came up in a google search for shootings of this nature)
This Baton Rouge teen who got shot for refusing sex.
Australian lady, shot in the crotch for refusing oral sex.
Pregnant woman shot for refusing sex.

At this point I stopped looking. There's no real database for this, these came from fiddling with google search terms.

You could probably throw in a lot of the women who are murdered when they attempt to leave abuses partners. It's not the exact same thing, but I suspect the motivations are similar.

I'm trying to limit myself to one super depressing google search a day.

[Dakini]

You could probably throw in a lot of the women who are murdered when they attempt to leave abuses partners. It's not the exact same thing, but I suspect the motivations are similar.

I'm trying to limit myself to one super depressing google search a day.

Fair enough. The articles you found are super depressing enough.

[Tahar Joblis]

Pretty much. What's the point? Murderers have been murdering from the beginning of time. We do what we can to police it. We can't stop it completely though. It happened. It's sad, but it happened and there's nothing you or I can do. The dead are dead. The rest just do what they can to keep going.

*sighs again* I'm gonna be doing that a lot in this thread I think.

Look, I get that you probably live in a relatively safe neighborhood, but most of us don't and many of us would like it if we make a concerted effort to actually make sure communities don't go to shit. If you're going to suggest that we should stop, look at the dead, and then pick the fuck back up without at least attempting to understand and solve the underlying issues which are so very obviously our problem, then you can shove it buddy.

Meanwhile, in the real world, violent crime rates in the US have fallen dramatically over the course of the last three decades.

Crimes are more visible, news is more sensationalized, population densities are higher, and you probably hear more stories about murders than you did thirty years ago.

In 1991, there were 758.1 violent crimes reported per year per 100,000 inhabitants, including 9.8 murders per 100,000 per annum; against a background rate of 5,139.7 reported crimes per 100,000 inhabitants per annum. This is a local peak value that has never been exceeded since then, and the year-on-year figures have never since then shown a statistically significant year-on-year increase.

In 2012, for example, these rates were down to 4.7 homicides per year per 100,000, with 386.9 total violent crimes per 100,000 per annum; against a background total crime rate of 3,246.1 per 100,000 per annum.

The decline has been so steep that the raw numbers of reported violent crimes is actually lower than it was in 1991, in spite of the country having gone from 250 million to 310 million people. The homicide rate is at about a fifty year low, and violent crime overall is at about a forty year low. Let's not pretend America has an exceptional problem that's getting worse.

[Llamalandia]

Perhaps, still violent crime tends to only affect a fairly small minority of americans every year. Especially when one considers are specific makeup, history, and the fact that americans are largely on average pretty well armed it's actually rather amazing we don't have a more intense and more prevalent violent crime problem. Not to minimze the impact on victims, but I think saying that it's a problem affecting the majority is at least slightly misleading and inaccurate.

Holy fuck just never, ever speak on this topic again. That's the most embarrassing thing I've read and I didn't even write it. For the sake of yourself, just pack up and leave.

Umm i categorically refuse for no other reason than free speech. What specifically do you take issue with though. I mean I know where going a bit off topic but it;s not that far off is it?

I mean, I feel sorry that you had to witness a stabbing victim being transported by ambulance, but really how does a single anecdotal expierience mean and my response to it as such warrant telling me to

For the sake of yourself, just pack up and leave.

I mean, if you have some specific concerns you'd like to address feel free I'm open to meaningful and honest dialogue.