No dates? Shoot a bunch of people. Santa Barbara Drive By.

[Imperial Nilfgaard]

What I do not understand is why getting laid is so important to drive a man to insanity. I mean seriously. How messed up can you be when that is the worst of your problems?!

It is that that he thinks that he is not normal because of never kissed a girl and start to consider himself a freak. Maybe to people outside it seems that funny but not to the people who really suffer.

What I do not understand is that he is not that ugly (although I am straist male) so there is some other reason why he is rejected by girls in first place.

He was mentally disturbed. Looks don't matter if your crazy, most women will reject you either way. The opposite doesn't apply tho; hot crazy girls still get laid if they want.

[Occupied Deutschland]

Yes, they can.

The person who violently murdered other people for no rational reason here was evil. He may have had mental issues or obsessions which inspired such action (which isn't limited to actual mental dysfunctions or disease, contrary to some categorization), but the act is still evil and he is still evil for having carried it out.

The person may have not had awareness of the fact that what he was doing was bad; It's difficult to describe someone as evil if they are irrational.

Indeed, I clarified that a bit later in an edit.

I don't think this guy was mentally incompetent so much as irrational though (not trying to be snarky with the difference, merely using them in a more 'formal' manner. He may have been incapable of understanding his actions because of his mental problems, however it seems just as likely at this point he was too hardline in his own thinking and did what he did fully aware of its effects and status).

[Blakk Metal]

Or, rather, will we find that this is proof positive that douchebags drive BMWs?

BMWs are from the same German province that the Nazi party was from. Of course they're for douchebags.

[Infected Mushroom]

Shootings like this are why guns must be banned in the States. It's unfortunate there isn't the political momentum.

[Pantokratos]

Based on the targeting and hatred of women, I think there may be a Freudian explaination for this murderous insanity.

What was Elliot's relationship with his parents like?

Yeah, he was attracted to his mom and was jealous on his father.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Based on the targeting and hatred of women, I think there may be a Freudian explaination for this murderous insanity.

What was Elliot's relationship with his parents like?

Freudian psychology?

Hey, as long as we're using outmoded approaches to insanity, I'll say that it was demonic possession, and that he was in obvious need of an exorcism. The best bet is to look for the witch who caused this to happen.

[Galter Gulcher]

Watch the rest of his youtube videos, hes a creep. Like in one, hes driving his car at high speeds while showing off his dance moves or telling the camera about how "awesome" he is, while videotaping it. Its like god damn dude, keep your eyes on the road, your going to kill someone. Oh wait.

But then theres also alot of videos were he is just bitching in some weird monotone voice, no wonder he couldn't get any chicks, he seems like a total weirdo. To back it up, he videotapes himself stalking couples from afar, saying that "its not fair!"

[The Serbian Empire]

Or, rather, will we find that this is proof positive that douchebags drive BMWs?

BMWs are from the same German province that the Nazi party was from. Of course they're for douchebags.

Is this the Hitler ate Sugar argument? If so, then I did Nazi see that coming.

[Cannot think of a name]

Watch the rest of his youtube videos, hes a creep.

I'm not sure I need the rest of the video to come to that conclusion.

[Galter Gulcher]

Watch the rest of his youtube videos, hes a creep.

I'm not sure I need the rest of the video to come to that conclusion.

Your right, you dont. But what I am saying is that his videos get really, really creepy, so much more then his last one.

[Pantokratos]

Watch the rest of his youtube videos, hes a creep. Like in one, hes driving his car at high speeds while showing off his dance moves or telling the camera about how "awesome" he is, while videotaping it. Its like god damn dude, keep your eyes on the road, your going to kill someone. Oh wait.

But then theres also alot of videos were he is just bitching in some weird monotone voice, no wonder he couldn't get any chicks, he seems like a total weirdo. To back it up, he videotapes himself stalking couples from afar, saying that "its not fair!"

Do zou have links for his other videos?

[Tule]

The problem with these kind of statements, like the one you just made, is that they associate mental illness with violent acts and further the stigmatization of the mentally ill. They do more harm than good.

Encouraging the mentally ill to seek help is a good thing, people with mental health problems can dramatically improve their situation immensely by doing that.

But discussing mental health problems in association with violence is extremely dangerous because it can make mentally ill people afraid of seeking help and thus raise their risk of poor living standards and suicide.

Mental illness is incredibly common and mass murderers are not. Associating the two is absurd.
The Navy Yard shooter last year had Schizophrenia, as did three million other Americans that year who did not go on a killing spree.
Autism is about equally prevalent.

This is like the whole Muslim terrorist argument, most Terrorists are Muslims, but the vast vast majority of Muslims are terrorists. Regardless of weather you take the above statement as a fact, either way that's the lines this argument boils down to. But either way, there does seem to be an unhealthy correlation with mass shooters having neglected mental conditions, including (but not solely composed of) Autism and Schizophrenia. This is not an insult to all people with these conditions, it simply shows that if left alone, neglected, and if you mix that state of mind with certain negative surroundings, bad things can happen. We shouldn't be scared to discuss the correlation with mass murderers and mental illness, instead we should highlight the issue and think of ways to solve situations of mental neglect so we can prevent these situations.

Personally I'd rather receive help than not. (And yes. I realise he was receiving treatment for Autism, but something clearly went wrong here).

Mass shootings are far too uncommon to be accurately correlated with anything, they are statistical anomalies. There are simply not enough data points to establish a concrete relationship with anything.
We can find a shit ton of things these guys have in common with millions of people.
Has it occurred to you that maybe these guys go on killing sprees because they are men? Strange how autistic and Schizophrenic women never do these things isn't it? But whatever weak relationship we may find they are unsatisfactory as explanations because there are simply far too many people affected by the same variable that don't do these things.

The only statistic that matters is whether or not mental illness is correlated with violent behavior in general. The answer is no.

You also completely ignored the fact that discussing mental illness as a cause of mass shootings will endanger people far more than than it saves people. There already have been studies on this, like the one I posted earlier. The general public overestimates the risk posed my the mentally ill by a huge margin. Mentally ill people themselves report that negative media depictions of mental illness makes them feel more alienated. If we actually stopped worrying about violence committed by the mentally ill we would save far more people than if we kept bringing this issue up.

Mass shootings kill between 50-100 people per year in the US, a tiny amount. Even the slightest increase in perceived stigma among the tens of millions of mentally ill people in the US could kill many times more people than that.

[The Scientific States]

That's absolutely terrible.

[Galter Gulcher]

Watch the rest of his youtube videos, hes a creep. Like in one, hes driving his car at high speeds while showing off his dance moves or telling the camera about how "awesome" he is, while videotaping it. Its like god damn dude, keep your eyes on the road, your going to kill someone. Oh wait.

But then theres also alot of videos were he is just bitching in some weird monotone voice, no wonder he couldn't get any chicks, he seems like a total weirdo. To back it up, he videotapes himself stalking couples from afar, saying that "its not fair!"

Do zou have links for his other videos?

http://www.youtube.com/user/ElliotRodger/videos

[Dejanic]

There's another angle you could look at this. I mean, it's a bit odd that a realitvely handsome guy who wasn't upfrontly rude to women, and who had a decent amount of money behind him and a nice car, aswell as a solid education, couldn't of atleast picked up one woman by the age of 22, atleast for some meaningless casual sex, right?

I have no evidence to suggest this, but there's a possibility he was actually sexually torn ((as in, he wasn't actually sexual attracted to women)) because I've watched a few of his videos now and he doesn't really give the impression off of someone who ever approached women and tried to flirt or talk with them at all. Much more so a social isolationist, who isolated himself by choice and then blamed the world for his own actions.

[Starkmoor]

What I do not understand is why getting laid is so important to drive a man to insanity. I mean seriously. How messed up can you be when that is the worst of your problems?!

Same here. I am trying to understand that myself.

Also, this guy is one state over from Nevada where prostitution is legal. I mean, if he can afford a BMW and he's that obsessed with getting laid as soon as possible, it seems like a few hours on the interstate would be a better solution than gunning down random people.

[Dejanic]

What I do not understand is why getting laid is so important to drive a man to insanity. I mean seriously. How messed up can you be when that is the worst of your problems?!

Same here. I am trying to understand that myself.

Also, this guy is one state over from Nevada where prostitution is legal. I mean, if he can afford a BMW and he's that obsessed with getting laid as soon as possible, it seems like a few hours on the interstate would be a better solution than gunning down random people.

That's actually a good point that backs up my random theory above, the guy had the money, transport, distance, and supposedly will to simply pay for sex, so why didn't he? There's something deeper going on here. (No pun intended).

[Pantokratos]

There's another angle you could look at this. I mean, it's a bit odd that a realitvely handsome guy who wasn't upfrontly rude to women, and who had a decent amount of money behind him and a nice car, aswell as a solid education, couldn't of atleast picked up one woman by the age of 22, atleast for some meaningless casual sex, right?

I have no evidence to suggest this, but there's a possibility he was actually sexually torn ((as in, he wasn't actually sexual attracted to women)) because I've watched a few of his videos now and he doesn't really give the impression off of someone who ever approached women and tried to flirt or talk with them at all. Much more so a social isolationist, who isolated himself by choice and then blamed the world for his own actions.

Possible. I used to know a guy which you just described. The has always though that girls does not like him because they do not apprche him. After explaining him some stuff he got normal again.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Same here. I am trying to understand that myself.

Also, this guy is one state over from Nevada where prostitution is legal. I mean, if he can afford a BMW and he's that obsessed with getting laid as soon as possible, it seems like a few hours on the interstate would be a better solution than gunning down random people.

That's actually a good point that backs up my random theory above, the guy had the money, transport, distance, and supposedly will to simply pay for sex, so why didn't he? There's something deeper going on here. (No pun intended).

There's not enough evidence for a diagnosis of any sort, but he seems to have wrapped up a significant amount of his identity in the opinions of others. Paying for sex doesn't really make up for that. He craved actual affection, not simple orgasm.

[Farnhamia]

That's actually a good point that backs up my random theory above, the guy had the money, transport, distance, and supposedly will to simply pay for sex, so why didn't he? There's something deeper going on here. (No pun intended).

There's not enough evidence for a diagnosis of any sort, but he seems to have wrapped up a significant amount of his identity in the opinions of others. Paying for sex doesn't really make up for that. He craved actual affection, not simple orgasm.

I agree. If you look at the transcript of the video linked in the OP, he convinced himself that while he was the true alpha male, the perfect gentleman, he was forced to endure years of loneliness while girls gave their affection and bodies to losers. He was forced, they gave themselves away. None of this is his fault. I shouldn't be surprised, I suppose, but how could the police interview him after looking at his videos at his parents' request, and come away thinking he was a "perfectly polite, kind and wonderful human." And why wouldn't his parents try to get him help? Granted he was over 21 but if they were frightened enough to call in the police, surely they could have taken steps to have him committed.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

There's not enough evidence for a diagnosis of any sort, but he seems to have wrapped up a significant amount of his identity in the opinions of others. Paying for sex doesn't really make up for that. He craved actual affection, not simple orgasm.

I agree. If you look at the transcript of the video linked in the OP, he convinced himself that while he was the true alpha male, the perfect gentleman, he was forced to endure years of loneliness while girls gave their affection and bodies to losers. He was forced, they gave themselves away. None of this is his fault. I shouldn't be surprised, I suppose, but how could the police interview him after looking at his videos at his parents' request, and come away thinking he was a "perfectly polite, kind and wonderful human." And why wouldn't his parents try to get him help? Granted he was over 21 but if they were frightened enough to call in the police, surely they could have taken steps to have him committed.

It's "Nice Guy Syndrome" taken to horrifying lengths.

In order to have him committed, they would have had to have evidence that he posed an immediate danger to himself or others. I'm not sure if they were taking those steps in light of the video or not, and I'd have to wait for further information to come out in order to judge their complicity through negligence in this, if any.

[Lordieth]

That's actually a good point that backs up my random theory above, the guy had the money, transport, distance, and supposedly will to simply pay for sex, so why didn't he? There's something deeper going on here. (No pun intended).

There's not enough evidence for a diagnosis of any sort, but he seems to have wrapped up a significant amount of his identity in the opinions of others. Paying for sex doesn't really make up for that. He craved actual affection, not simple orgasm.

I agree. He was clearly obsessive over the fact that girls did not find him attractive, and I think beneath the surface, what twisted him up inside was probably that for many years he actually made what he believed to be his best efforts to attract the opposite sex, and was clearly frustrated by the fact that nothing he did had any effect.

As I said previously, his emotional immaturity and inability to look past his own narcissism were his enemies. Nobody else.

[Farnhamia]

I agree. If you look at the transcript of the video linked in the OP, he convinced himself that while he was the true alpha male, the perfect gentleman, he was forced to endure years of loneliness while girls gave their affection and bodies to losers. He was forced, they gave themselves away. None of this is his fault. I shouldn't be surprised, I suppose, but how could the police interview him after looking at his videos at his parents' request, and come away thinking he was a "perfectly polite, kind and wonderful human." And why wouldn't his parents try to get him help? Granted he was over 21 but if they were frightened enough to call in the police, surely they could have taken steps to have him committed.

It's "Nice Guy Syndrome" taken to horrifying lengths.

In order to have him committed, they would have had to have evidence that he posed an immediate danger to himself or others. I'm not sure if they were taking those steps in light of the video or not, and I'd have to wait for further information to come out in order to judge their complicity through negligence in this, if any.

According to the parents' lawyer ...

...Alan Shifman, told reporters gathered outside the home of Mr. Rodger’s father that Mr. Rodger’s parents had called the police about a month ago to express their concerns over his YouTube videos “regarding suicide and the killing of people.” He said that police officers had interviewed Mr. Rodger, but concluded that he posed no danger. The lawyer said they had found him to be a “perfectly polite, kind and wonderful human.”

A month ago they were concerned about his videos talking about suicide and killing people. It's absurd. And he probably got the gun legally or took it from his parents' house. I read your post over in the gun control thread and I feel the same way, blood for the gun god. A certain number of Americans have to die every year to fertilize that tree of liberty.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

It's "Nice Guy Syndrome" taken to horrifying lengths.

In order to have him committed, they would have had to have evidence that he posed an immediate danger to himself or others. I'm not sure if they were taking those steps in light of the video or not, and I'd have to wait for further information to come out in order to judge their complicity through negligence in this, if any.

According to the parents' lawyer ...

...Alan Shifman, told reporters gathered outside the home of Mr. Rodger’s father that Mr. Rodger’s parents had called the police about a month ago to express their concerns over his YouTube videos “regarding suicide and the killing of people.” He said that police officers had interviewed Mr. Rodger, but concluded that he posed no danger. The lawyer said they had found him to be a “perfectly polite, kind and wonderful human.”

A month ago they were concerned about his videos talking about suicide and killing people. It's absurd. And he probably got the gun legally or took it from his parents' house. I read your post over in the gun control thread and I feel the same way, blood for the gun god. A certain number of Americans have to die every year to fertilize that tree of liberty.

So it sounds like the parents did what they were supposed to, and the police dropped the ball. That's doubly troubling, and shows why "We need to focus on mental health, not gun control!" isn't a sufficient response.

[Farnhamia]

According to the parents' lawyer ...

A month ago they were concerned about his videos talking about suicide and killing people. It's absurd. And he probably got the gun legally or took it from his parents' house. I read your post over in the gun control thread and I feel the same way, blood for the gun god. A certain number of Americans have to die every year to fertilize that tree of liberty.

So it sounds like the parents did what they were supposed to, and the police dropped the ball. That's doubly troubling, and shows why "We need to focus on mental health, not gun control!" isn't a sufficient response.

We need to focus on both. The easy availability of guns combined with a perception of mental illness as shameful and something not to be talked about ensures a continued body count.