Would you date a (post-op) transgender person?

[Dyakovo]

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but sometimes the serious problem people have upon finding out that someone is trans* doesn't mean angrily refusing to date them, it means battering them, raping them, murdering them, or some combination of the above. Bit much to expect people to tell you this before getting to know you.

---

Maybe you got engaged without dating her, we don't know.

I don't really care in all honesty, if I find out I have been tricked I will consider it nothing different than fighting another guy.

A woman claiming to be a woman is trickery?

[Britannic Realms]

It depends on the situation and how I feel at the time. I would probably be more upset that they didn't tell me from the start.

[Colorlovia]

I'm panromantic pansexual. Gender really doesn't matter in attraction to me at all. Hell yes, I would.

[Arkinesia]

I dunno. Probably not. But maybe. I have to admit, I'd be going in with the presupposition that they're hopelessly immature.

[Ifreann]

Wouldn't you? Why on Earth not?

Identification purposes. Also because I'm less concerned with what people want, and more concerned with what's actually true.

But refusing to call someone a different name is not at all the same as refusing to recognize gender identities.

They both strike me as remarkably rude, but I suppose that follows from not caring about people's feelings.

Not really. If we accept that people have some "true" gender identity separate from how they think about themselves in the same way that people have a legal name that could be different from what they prefer to be called, then it follows that if you refuse to acknowledge anything but a person's "true" gender identity you would refuse to acknowledge anything but a person's legal name.

I don't regonize gender identity at all. It'd be as if I didn't recognize people giving themselves names at all.

But again, this is a false equivalency on your part. Names and gender identities are not good comparisons.

The comparison is serving my purposes just fine.

---

Maybe you aren't aware of this, but sometimes the serious problem people have upon finding out that someone is trans* doesn't mean angrily refusing to date them, it means battering them, raping them, murdering them, or some combination of the above. Bit much to expect people to tell you this before getting to know you.

---

Maybe you got engaged without dating her, we don't know.

I don't really care in all honesty, if I find out I have been tricked I will consider it nothing different than fighting another guy.

Fucking hell, do you even hear yourself right now? You are saying that you would attack someone for not sharing a secret with you before they know if you'll attack them because of it. How the fuck do you think any part of that is acceptable? Do you even understand that assault and battery are crimes?

[Aurora Novus]

The comparison is serving my purposes just fine.

The purpose a false equivalency serves is no good purpose. I suppose that means you have no actual point against what I've been saying in this thread.

I don't recognize gender identities, in anyone. Trans or not. Names are not the same as gender identities, and the question you asked me doesn't even deal with my stance on the issue. It would be appropriate if I recognized gender identities, but was refusing to recognize a specific one. But I don't recognize them to begin with. Your question has literally nothing to do with my stance on this issue.

[Calimera II]

No. Never.

[Mefpan]

I...you know what, I've accepted that my sexual preferences are screwed up beyond repair (>implying they're broken). No, I do not believe I care much about what exactly's between your legs. What I do seem to care about is a feminine appearance/behavior, preferably with a tendency towards taking the lead in a relationship.
Pre-op, post-op, dressing and behaving or born as woman, I don't think I can bring myself to care much. Hell, I'm the kind of guy who'd date a sufficiently sophisticated A.I.,

But nothing like that's ever going to happen because I never leave the house.

(Note: Replace all instaces of 'date' with 'awkwardly share a room with sitting in opposite corners not saying anything'.)

[Dyakovo]

I dunno. Probably not. But maybe. I have to admit, I'd be going in with the presupposition that they're hopelessly immature.

Why?

[Bralia]

This heterosexual male is completely fine with it. If it looks like a woman and has all the requisite parts, I'd have no trouble being attracted to the person in the slightest. Heck, I'd be thrilled to date a woman (of any beginning) where there's no chance of accidents when it comes to children. I probably wouldn't even mind if the knowledge of being a trans-person was withheld from me for a long time. I'd surely be surprised as all hell, but I certainly understand why a trans-person would want to wait until she could trust me first.

[Gezi Park]

No, thanks. No offense though.

[Ifreann]

The comparison is serving my purposes just fine.

The purpose a false equivalency serves is no good purpose.

It is just adorable that you think that.

I suppose that means you have no actual point against what I've been saying in this thread.

My point is that you are saying you would single out trans people to be rude and insulting to for no good reason, and that that's not a very nice thing to do. You shouldn't do it.

I don't recognize gender identities, in anyone. Trans or not. Names are not the same as gender identities, and the question you asked me doesn't even deal with my stance on the issue. It would be appropriate if I recognized gender identities, but was refusing to recognize a specific one. But I don't recognize them to begin with. Your question has literally nothing to do with my stance on this issue.

It does, but you're failing to understand it. If someone tells you they're a man or a woman or something else or that their name is James and you tell them that they're wrong and that they're really a woman or a man or whatever, that's a shitty thing to do, regardless of what you do or don't recognise.

[Ifreann]

I dunno. Probably not. But maybe. I have to admit, I'd be going in with the presupposition that they're hopelessly immature.

Why?

Presumably because "I do not believe in a gender binary for adults. I believe that mature adults are genderless beings."

[Liriena]

I'm bi and I'd date a transgender person regardless of whether they have gone through gender confirmation surgery or not, if I found them attractive.

[Othelos]

Why the fuck not? If I like you or I'm attracted to you, why would I care?

[Len Hyet]

Nope. No hate toward transgenders, but I wouldn't be able to see her in the same light afterward and to be entirely honest it would gross me out. Can't help it, but it would.

[Aurora Novus]

It is just adorable that you think that.

It's adorable that I hold to fundamental principles of logic? Alright, if that's how you swing.

My point is that you are saying you would single out trans people to be rude and insulting to for no good reason, and that that's not a very nice thing to do. You shouldn't do it.

Except your point doesn't illustrate that at all. You'd recognize that if you weren't so bent on being intellectually dishonest.

It does, but you're failing to understand it. If someone tells you they're a man or a woman or something else or that their name is James and you tell them that they're wrong and that they're really a woman or a man or whatever, that's a shitty thing to do, regardless of what you do or don't recognise.

I'm not failing to underatand anything, you're refusing to recognise you've put forth a shitty, intellectually dishonest analogy. If I don't recognize gender identity as being a thing, why would I refer to people based upon their gender identitiy? Because it makes them feel good? Sorry, no. I don't pretend something is real just because doing so makes people feel good. I wouldn't be an Atheist if that weren't the case. It's not "shitty" to live that way, rather, it's delusional to live any other way. Putting petty, irrational feelings before reality and truth is stupid.

[Dumb Ideologies]

I've never dated someone who wasn't somewhere on the trans spectrum. It's not that I think cis people are disgusting, I just feel like a cis person wouldn't "get" me and that we'd talk past each other a lot.

[Eastern Equestria]

I respect their choice, but as a Catholic, I simply can't.

Of course you can.

---

There's nothing unnatural about the birth of a trans* person.

I hear they grow on trees.

You kill me, Ifreann, you really do.

[Ifreann]

It is just adorable that you think that.

It's adorable that I hold to fundamental principles of logic? Alright, if that's how you swing.

It's adorable that you think that's a fundamental principle of logic. Good or bad purposes are beyond the scope of logic.

My point is that you are saying you would single out trans people to be rude and insulting to for no good reason, and that that's not a very nice thing to do. You shouldn't do it.

Except your point doesn't illustrate that at all. You'd recognize that if you weren't so bent on being intellectually dishonest.

Except my comparison does illustrate that. You'd recognise that if you weren't so bent on being a psuedo-Vulcan who rejects feelings in favour of logic.

It does, but you're failing to understand it. If someone tells you they're a man or a woman or something else or that their name is James and you tell them that they're wrong and that they're really a woman or a man or whatever, that's a shitty thing to do, regardless of what you do or don't recognise.

I'm not failing to underatand anything, you're refusing to recognise you've put forth a shitty, intellectually dishonest analogy. If I don't recognize gender identity as being a thing, why would I refer to people based upon their gender identitiy? Because it makes them feel good?

Did your parents not teach you not to hurt other people's feelings?

Sorry, no. I don't pretend something is real just because doing so makes people feel good. I wouldn't be an Atheist if that weren't the case. It's not "shitty" to live that way, rather, it's delusional to live any other way. Putting petty, irrational feelings before reality and truth is stupid.

And yet here you are, putting your own petty, irrational feelings before the reality and truth of other people's feelings. Funny that.

---

I've never dated someone who wasn't somewhere on the trans spectrum. It's not that I think cis people are disgusting...

I always knew you loved me.

[Aurora Novus]

It's adorable that you think that's a fundamental principle of logic. Good or bad purposes are beyond the scope of logic.

"Bad" being used not in a moral sense here, but in a "flawed logic" sense. Using a logical fallacy to try and make a point leads to a fallacious point, or in otherwords, a bad point.

Except my comparison does illustrate that. You'd recognise that if you weren't so bent on being a psuedo-Vulcan who rejects feelings in favour of logic.

I don't "reject" feelings, I simply would say that feelings do not supercede reality.

Did your parents not teach you not to hurt other people's feelings?

There are times when it is appropriate to hurt other's feelings, namely, when it comes to discussions of reality. Emotions do not determine truth, outside of the truth of what you feel. If reality makes you feel bad, grow up and learn to deal with it. Pretending that your feelings should somehow supercede truth is childish.

It's also appropriate to hurt other's feelings when it comes to discussions of morality, and the direction society should take. I'm sure murderer's and rapist's feelings are hurt when they aren't allowed to murder and rape, and are thrown in prison for doing so.

And yet here you are, putting your own petty, irrational feelings before the reality and truth of other people's feelings. Funny that.

This is not a matter of my own petty, irrational feelings. And the reality of a false belief does not make what that belief claims, real. What people believe to be true, and what is true, are not intriniscally the same thing.

I'm not putting forth my own petty, irrational feelings. I'm putting forth reality. Or at least, my claims about reality. Which you have not bothered to contest.

I ask you again, why on earth should I pretend a false belief is true if it is, indeed, a false belief? Why should anyone? If it's not true, it's not true. Irrespective of whether or not it makes you feel good.

[The Scientific States]

Sure. I see no reason not to. But, I understand that a straight person or gay person may not be comfortable with that, and I respect that.

[Olthar]

I would totally date trans women. It'd be a bit hypocritical of me not to.

[Ifreann]

I would totally date trans women. It'd be a bit hypocritical of me not to.

You're kinda allowed to be hypocritical about who you date, though. Like, if trans women didn't give you the relevant warm, fuzzy feels* then not dating them wouldn't be wrong.





*Your feels may be neither warm nor fuzzy. Feels may or may not occur in the pants area. Feels are not for everyone. Consult your doctor before having feels.

[Herskerstad]

Straight and no, simple as that.