Re: Anti-Chinese riots in Vietnam
Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 8:53 am
-Edit reason: Old opinion, of which I do not share anymore
Because sometimes even national leaders just want to hang out
https://forum.nationstates.net/
The Scientific States wrote:Imperial Nilfgaard wrote:Riots and Violence against Chinese citizens is spiraling in Vietnam. Reports of factories being burned and ethnic Chinese businessmen fleeing is the unfortunate byproduct of this situation.
20 people have been killed thus far in the past day.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/m ... in-vietnam
It is sad to see such hostility against the People's Republic of China. I feel like the West is purposefully trying to stoke tension in the region by pitting China's neighbors against Beijing in a thinly veiled containment policy.
"Pivot to Asia" as they like to call it.
Obama's Sino-phobic Asia tour last month as a good example of this policy.
Vietnam must immediately work to contain this nationalist outburst, or bad things may come.
That's very sad, and I hope the situation gets better. However, blaming this on the west is silly.
Ostroeuropa wrote:The New Lowlands wrote:You know, they first started saying stuff like what I italicized prior to the First World War, IIRC. But I digress; you're not interested in the military factors, and that's fair enough.
In that case, I should point out that the GDP of the U.S. and E.U. combined is approximately $32,264,000,000,000, while the GDP of China and Russia combined is $ 10,242,000,000,000. This is not accounting for other trade partners (e.g. Canada, Turkey) who in a hypothetical trade war would most likely align themselves in the Wests' favour. Our economic might is roughly three times that of our hypothetical adversaries.
This entirely ignores that we are reliant on them for our economy to work.
They are not necessarily reliant on us.
Imperial Nilfgaard wrote:The Scientific States wrote:
That's very sad, and I hope the situation gets better. However, blaming this on the west is silly.
Its not silly when last month, Obama toured Asia and singed defense contracts with China's neighbors Japan and Philippines in what was clearly an attempt to pin China in.
The Isles of New Babylon wrote:When I was in China last year I read an English language Chinese newspaper with the headline and lead story about how the Phillipines were wrong to be disputing territory with China and denouncing pro-Phillipines demonstrations in Manila.
Ostroeuropa wrote:The New Lowlands wrote:
If there's any lack of strength, it's purely imaginary. How the heck do you figure that it's in the West's interest to be seen as encouraging China?
It isn't purely imaginary. We're in a bit of a pickle economically right now, and we can't even deal with Russia invading Ukraine.
Do you honestly think we'll give a shit about China invading Vietnam?
We need to keep China our ally. If China begins to shift out of it's neutrality into a pact with the Russians, we're fucked. It'll be a new cold war, and we may lose.
Imperial Nilfgaard wrote:The Scientific States wrote:
That's very sad, and I hope the situation gets better. However, blaming this on the west is silly.
Its not silly when last month, Obama toured Asia and singed defense contracts with China's neighbors Japan and Philippines in what was clearly an attempt to pin China in.
Costa Fierro wrote:Tuthina wrote:Mostly political as far as I know. Many overseas Chinese are refugees fleeing PRC, so mainlanders in general are not exactly hold with high regards as a result.
Not migrants? Hell, people where I live (which is NZ) are claiming that the Chinese are behind recent property bubbles and all sorts of things. There's calls from the left wing for tougher immigration.
Pope Joan wrote:Deep dislike of the Chinese is nothing new in Vietnam. it was comical to hear our leaders preach about the domino effect, and of how if Vietnam "fell" to communist control then the whole area would immediately come under the sway of China. Ho was educated in France and influenced by Lenin. Neither he nor, as far as I can tell, any of his compatriots had any affection for China.
"Liberation from China
In the early 10th century the Tang dynasty in China collapsed. The Vietnamese seized the initiative and launched a long overdue revolt against Chinese rule in Vietnam. In 938 AD popular patriot Ngo Quyen finally vanquished the Chinese armies at a battle on the Bach Dang River, ending 1000 years of Chinese rule. However, it was not the last time the Vietnamese would tussle with their mighty northern neighbour.
From the 11th to 13th centuries, Vietnamese independence was consolidated under the enlightened emperors of the Ly dynasty, founded by Ly Thai To. During the Ly dynasty, many enemies launched attacks on Vietnam, among them the Chinese, the Khmer and the Cham but all were repelled. Meanwhile, the Vietnamese continued their expansion southwards and slowly but surely began to consolidate control of the Cham kingdom.
Mongol warrior Kublai Khan completed his conquest of China in the mid-13th century. For his next trick, he planned to attack Champa and demanded the right to cross Vietnamese territory. The Vietnamese refused, but the Mongol hordes – all 500, 000 of them – pushed ahead, seemingly invulnerable. However, they met their match in the legendary general Tran Hung Dao; he defeated them in the battle of Bach Dang River, one of the most celebrated scalps among many the Vietnamese have taken.
China bites back
The Chinese seized control of Vietnam again in the early 15th century, carting off the national archives and some of the country’s intellectuals to China – an irreparable loss to Vietnamese civilisation. The Chinese controlled much of the country from 1407, imposing a regime of heavy taxation and slave labour. The poet Nguyen Trai (1380–1442) wrote of this period:
Were the water of the Eastern Sea to be exhausted, the stain of their ignominy could not be washed away; all the bamboo of the Southern Mountains would not suffice to provide the paper for recording all their crimes.
Le Loi enters the scene
In 1418 wealthy philanthropist Le Loi sparked the Lam Son Uprising, travelling the countryside to rally the people against the Chinese. Upon victory in 1428, Le Loi declared himself Emperor Le Thai To, the first in the long line of the Le dynasty. To this day, Le Loi is riding high in the Top Ten of the country’s all-time national heroes.
Following Le Loi’s victory over the Chinese, Nguyen Trai, a scholar and Le Loi’s companion in arms, wrote his infamous Great Proclamation (Binh Ngo Dai Cao). Guaranteed to fan the flames of nationalism almost six centuries later, it articulated Vietnam’s fierce spirit of independence:
Our people long ago established Vietnam as an independent nation with its own civilisation. We have our own mountains and our own rivers, our own customs and traditions, and these are different from those of the foreign country to the north…We have sometimes been weak and sometimes powerful, but at no time have we suffered from a lack of heroes."
http://www.lonelyplanet.com/vietnam/history#72281
1398, under pressure from Hồ Quý Ly, Thuận Tông, had to cede the throne to his three-year-old son Trần An, now Trần Thiếu Đế, and held the title Retired Emperor at the age of only 20.[64] Only one year after his resignation, Thuận Tông was killed on the orders of Hồ Quý Ly.[65] Hồ Quý Ly also authorised the execution of over 370 persons who opposed his dominance in the royal court, including several prominent mandarins and the Emperor's relatives together with their families, such as Trần Khát Chân
Vietnam was a significant source of difficulties during Yongle's reign. In 1406, The Yongle Emperor responded to several formal petitions from members of the (now deposed) Tran Dynasty, however on arrival to Vietnam, both the Tran prince and the accompanying Chinese ambassador were ambushed and killed. In response to this insult the Yongle Emperor sent a huge army of 500,000 south to conquer Vietnam. As the royal family were all executed by the Ho monarchs Vietnam was integrated as a province of China, just as it had been up until 939.
Imperial Nilfgaard wrote:The Scientific States wrote:That's very sad, and I hope the situation gets better. However, blaming this on the west is silly.
Its not silly when last month, Obama toured Asia and singed defense contracts with China's neighbors Japan and Philippines in what was clearly an attempt to pin China in.
Imperial Nilfgaard wrote:Riots and Violence against Chinese citizens is spiraling in Vietnam. Reports of factories being burned and ethnic Chinese businessmen fleeing is the unfortunate byproduct of this situation.
20 people have been killed thus far in the past day.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/m ... in-vietnam
It is sad to see such hostility against the People's Republic of China. I feel like the West is purposefully trying to stoke tension in the region by pitting China's neighbors against Beijing in a thinly veiled containment policy.
"Pivot to Asia" as they like to call it.
Obama's Sino-phobic Asia tour last month as a good example of this policy.
Vietnam must immediately work to contain this nationalist outburst, or bad things may come.
Geilinor wrote:China and Vietnam have been fighting for over 2000 years. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China%E2%80%93Vietnam_relations But no, everything is NATO's fault.
Blazedtown wrote:Geilinor wrote:China and Vietnam have been fighting for over 2000 years. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China%E2%80%93Vietnam_relations But no, everything is NATO's fault.
Wikipedia is American propaganda. America is behind every conflict the Chinese have had with Vietnam.
Imperial Nilfgaard wrote:Riots and Violence against Chinese citizens is spiraling in Vietnam. Reports of factories being burned and ethnic Chinese businessmen fleeing is the unfortunate byproduct of this situation.
20 people have been killed thus far in the past day.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/m ... in-vietnam
It is sad to see such hostility against the People's Republic of China. I feel like the West is purposefully trying to stoke tension in the region by pitting China's neighbors against Beijing in a thinly veiled containment policy.
"Pivot to Asia" as they like to call it.
Obama's Sino-phobic Asia tour last month as a good example of this policy.
Vietnam must immediately work to contain this nationalist outburst, or bad things may come.
Oaledonia wrote:Sino-phobic.
That's a new one.