Black People Are Racist Too!

[Buddha Punk Robot Monks]

It really gives me hope for the level of critical engagement on NS when all the responses to my post explaining what racial theorists think of this question is a variation of "bullshit".

When you say "black people can't be racist", there is no other response needed. It's bullshit.

A good debater would take the time to see how I arrived at that conclusion and criticize those reasons, not jut blatantly disregard the conclusion because one does not agree with it.

[Dyakovo]

In my opinion, humans are inherently xenophobic. Deep down we fear what we do not know or aren't used to. If you grow up in an environment around people of one particular race and a big minority of the rest, your behavior towards people of a different race can be construed as racist. I'd call this our "neutral" setting, which changes through experience for better or worse.

Positive experiences will gradually rid people of this kind of "neutral racism" or xenophobia, but negative experiences will only make it worse. Of course, ideologies passed on from other people can also become an influence.

But how can people in America have positive experiences with people of other races if most of our neighborhoods and schools are still de facto segregated?

Go outside your neighborhood.

[Neutraligon]

Here's the article that HuffPo link was leading to. I actually meant to link it instead, but got caught up in tab confusion. I believe that it puts the first link into perspective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html

Whatever the reasons may be for parents giving their children these names, it is undeniable that they are associated with black people, and that people are putting aside resumes because of the "black sounding" names. To turn the question around, if you're running a business, wouldn't you want to hire the best person regardless of race, and therefore invite as many qualified applicants to interview as possible regardless of their names?

Thank you.

Hm, you're actually quite pleasant.

Now, I know judges should not be prejudiced and I know biased attitudes exist. However, you have to realize a lot of blacks tend to live crowded together in poor neighborhoods, many of which I've already mentioned. Poor neighborhoods tend to lead to more crime. I'm not trying to justify any biased attitudes against blacks, I'd just like you to understand why they exist.

As for the names, I certainly would try and consider all the applicants and hire whoever is the best qualified. I'm simply saying a parent should not try and give their children any possible disadvantages in life, and having silly names can be a bit of a disadvantage.

Why should a name affect the hiring practice. For that matter, isn't it interesting what names you (general you) find silly.

[Senyosu]

Not automatically, no. Although the possibility does exist.

Racist against your own race? Seems pretty unlikely, especially if it was unintentional.

I look at it like this. I insult my mother. However, anyone else who insults my mother is wishing for a swift and painful death.

A bit extreme, but that is the premise on the myth of being racist to one's own race.

[Ixzara]

Thank you.

Hm, you're actually quite pleasant.

Now, I know judges should not be prejudiced and I know biased attitudes exist. However, you have to realize a lot of blacks tend to live crowded together in poor neighborhoods, many of which I've already mentioned. Poor neighborhoods tend to lead to more crime. I'm not trying to justify any biased attitudes against blacks, I'd just like you to understand why they exist.

As for the names, I certainly would try and consider all the applicants and hire whoever is the best qualified. I'm simply saying a parent should not try and give their children any possible disadvantages in life, and having silly names can be a bit of a disadvantage.

Why should a name affect the hiring practice. For that matter, isn't it interesting what names you (general you) find silly.

I actually think using that as a basis is actually illegal.

[Draica]

Is Christian a silly name for a black person?

[Vettrera]

Here's the article that HuffPo link was leading to. I actually meant to link it instead, but got caught up in tab confusion. I believe that it puts the first link into perspective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html

Whatever the reasons may be for parents giving their children these names, it is undeniable that they are associated with black people, and that people are putting aside resumes because of the "black sounding" names. To turn the question around, if you're running a business, wouldn't you want to hire the best person regardless of race, and therefore invite as many qualified applicants to interview as possible regardless of their names?

Thank you.

Hm, you're actually quite pleasant.

Now, I know judges should not be prejudiced and I know biased attitudes exist. However, you have to realize a lot of blacks tend to live crowded together in poor neighborhoods, many of which I've already mentioned. Poor neighborhoods tend to lead to more crime. I'm not trying to justify any biased attitudes against blacks, I'd just like you to understand why they exist.

As for the names, I certainly would try and consider all the applicants and hire whoever is the best qualified. I'm simply saying a parent should not try and give their children any possible disadvantages in life, and having silly names can be a bit of a disadvantage.

Though all of this seems like common sense, you also have to think that they're conforming to society based on these names, and therefore either don't know better, or don't expect their child to succeed. Most of the time low ranked will breed low ranked, though some (like my parents) will make it out. Hell, even in the suburbs I get called out for "acting white". People conform to stereotypes, and that's on of the biggest issues.

I'm on a phone, so this may not be 100% coherent

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Here's the article that HuffPo link was leading to. I actually meant to link it instead, but got caught up in tab confusion. I believe that it puts the first link into perspective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html

Whatever the reasons may be for parents giving their children these names, it is undeniable that they are associated with black people, and that people are putting aside resumes because of the "black sounding" names. To turn the question around, if you're running a business, wouldn't you want to hire the best person regardless of race, and therefore invite as many qualified applicants to interview as possible regardless of their names?

Thank you.

Hm, you're actually quite pleasant.

Now, I know judges should not be prejudiced and I know biased attitudes exist. However, you have to realize a lot of blacks tend to live crowded together in poor neighborhoods, many of which I've already mentioned. Poor neighborhoods tend to lead to more crime. I'm not trying to justify any biased attitudes against blacks, I'd just like you to understand why they exist.

As for the names, I certainly would try and consider all the applicants and hire whoever is the best qualified. I'm simply saying a parent should not try and give their children any possible disadvantages in life, and having silly names can be a bit of a disadvantage.

Don't spread the pleasant thing around. I have a surly reputation to protect.

I get why these attitudes exist. I'm simply saying that continuing these attitudes tends to perpetuate the problem. As I'm not in a realistic position to tell black people what they should be doing in order to address their issues, what I can do is attempt to address it among my fellow white people. As far as the names go, you may have a point, but it's also up to the bosses and managers out there to look past relatively recent cultural naming trends in order to actually hire the most qualified applicants. Here's a reasonably balanced and interesting article on the subject of "invented" names in the black community.

[The Genoese Cromanatum]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

[Dyakovo]

Why should a name affect the hiring practice. For that matter, isn't it interesting what names you (general you) find silly.

I actually think using that as a basis is actually illegal.

Which doesn't stop it from happening.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

Right, that hasn't actually been said by anyone in this thread. Please stick to arguments actually being made, and not strawmen.

[Guadalupador]

Is Christian a silly name for a black person?

Um, no? Why do you ask?

[Dyakovo]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

Nice strawman, you build it yourself?

[Spartan Philidelphia]

But how can people in America have positive experiences with people of other races if most of our neighborhoods and schools are still de facto segregated?

Go outside your neighborhood.

The race problem is solved! It's so simple. Why haven't people been doing this earlier?

[The Black Forrest]

When you say "black people can't be racist", there is no other response needed. It's bullshit.

A good debater would take the time to see how I arrived at that conclusion and criticize those reasons, not jut blatantly disregard the conclusion because one does not agree with it.

Usually, you present the reasons for the conclusion.

But I will give you a chance, how is it black people can't be racist?

I have experienced it but do explain your reasons.

[Senyosu]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

Nice strawman, you build it yourself?

Shall I burn it?

[Dyakovo]

Is Christian a silly name for a black person?

Christian is a silly name for anyone.

[Draica]

Is Christian a silly name for a black person?

Um, no? Why do you ask?

Because this is becoming ridiculous. What if a white kid has an insane name? Is it different?

[Vettrera]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

This is pretty low quality sarcasm/humor, please try again later.

[Death Metal]

Racism is a social construction created by Europeans during the Era of Colonization to more effectively rule over their colored subjects. Therefore racism has always had an element of power to it. Without this power there is no racism. There can be bigotry and race prejudice, but not racism. Reverse racism is a concept created by people who don't understand how racism works structurally.

Not only is this factually incoherent (race had existed as a social construct well before then, the exact origins unclear, but the concept of seeing other people as not human or less human was not invented nor even unique to the European Colonists, see Egypt, Greece et al)... but you're just repeating the same begging the question fallacy.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

The strawman will attract a LOT of crows.

[The Genoese Cromanatum]

Nice strawman, you build it yourself?

Right, that hasn't actually been said by anyone in this thread. Please stick to arguments actually being made, and not strawmen.

You lot sure do love your buzzwords. Perhaps you can pull your thoughts from your own ego for a moment to notice that I was poking fun at the tumblr-crowd of misguided social justice warriors, hm?

Also, check your privilege.

[Ixzara]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

The strawman will attract a LOT of crows.

Goddamn it, I just washed my car.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Black people can't be racist, silly goy. Only the white man can be racist, after all, he /is/ responsible for everything bad in the world, don't you know?

The strawman will attract a LOT of crows.

"But why would it attract crows?"

"Caws!"

[Buddha Punk Robot Monks]

Methinks you only see these particular logical fallacies in the source because you disagree with the basic premise.

Racism is a social construction created by Europeans during the Era of Colonization to more effectively rule over their colored subjects. Therefore racism has always had an element of power to it. Without this power there is no racism. There can be bigotry and race prejudice, but not racism. Reverse racism is a concept created by people who don't understand how racism works structurally.

Other groups that have structural power over certain groups based on race or ethnicity, for example the Han Chinese over the Tibetans, could also be described as racists or, at least, ethnicists, depending on what your definition of "race" is.

This only makes sense if you redefine racism to include power as part of it's definition. For those of us who don't, you're just being a weasel.

Why should racism include some notion of power in it's deifnition? What benefit does it serve, other than allowing for minorities to be freed from any form of criticisim with the label? That isn't how people popularly understand the term now, so what benefit is there to a change in terminology?

The benefit is more descriptive because power is how racism manifests itself in the world. The category of race itself, the label attached to people, is an instrument of power that allows us to categorize people and give/ withold certain benefits from them because of their membership in that category. Using a prejudice plus power definition also allows us to see that the primary problem when it comes to racism is not peoples' individual opinions about people of other races but how racism is institutionalized in the very fabric of our society, in our schools, courts, churches, neighborhoods, government institutions, etc.