Black People Are Racist Too!

[Agritum]

My last name is difficult for people to get so I get what you're saying.

Me, I've been considering changing my name because it's too common.

Pull off an Ultimate Warrior and legally change your name to something like "Hellspawn" or "Ultraripper".

[Senyosu]

No. In fact, none would be even concerned with such. Unless your relative have a problem, but other than that, no. It does not make you a bigot. So cheer up, don't dwell on it, because white guilt I find is more annoying than white pride itself. Assuming you are white, that is.

I'm black.

No. In fact, none would be even concerned with such. Unless your relative have a problem, but other than that, no. It does not make you a bigot. So cheer up, don't dwell on it, because white guilt I find is more annoying than white pride itself. Assuming you are white, that is.

Its been established that he's black...

I'm illiterate, and I have to make it a habit of reading through threads. My apologies.

Regardless, no. Still not bigoted. More context is required.

[Viritica]

Your study is flawed. It doesn't take into account the defendant's criminal record in these cases.

If someone has a record the odds are they're going to receive a tougher sentence.

This is how the justice system works.

Next.

Too bad it actually does account for this. ALL studies concerning this made within the past 20 years do. In fact, if you ACTUALLY went to the source cited in the article, it even says this.

To address that difficulty social scientists have traditionally applied control variables to standard regression equations, a statistical method for identifying significant correlations between observed events. For instance, controlling for type of crime committed or for the defendant’s criminal history, researchers look to see whether the results of their equation still show racial disparity.

Sorry, but reality doesn't agree with your racist beliefs.

I read your source. It's actually rather good. It addresses the disparities in terms of blacks receiving harsher sentences.

However, let's note here that sentences =/= convictions. It fails to address the higher conviction rates among black males for crimes like murder and rape.

Oh, and I figured it was only a matter of time before you whipped out the race card. I almost forgot I was debating with a liberal on a thread about blacks.

[Saiwania]

In the end all, racism as the social construct really benefits those that created in the first place. Hence why white pride is inherently redundant and racist. The social construct created by the 'mighty whitey' if you may, is the building to be destroyed.

If Whites fell to just 1% or less in a country, I bet the people there would still find a way to blame Whitey for all of their problems.

[MERIZoC]

Too bad it actually does account for this. ALL studies concerning this made within the past 20 years do. In fact, if you ACTUALLY went to the source cited in the article, it even says this.



Sorry, but reality doesn't agree with your racist beliefs.

I read your source. It's actually rather good. It addresses the disparities in terms of blacks receiving harsher sentences.

However, let's note here that sentences =/= convictions. It fails to address the higher conviction rates among black males for crimes like murder and rape.

Oh, and I figured it was only a matter of time before you whipped out the race card. I almost forgot I was debating with a liberal on a thread about blacks.

Whipped out the race card? That's what the whole damn thread is about.

[Esternial]

Black people are racist.
White people are racist.

People are racist. Much surprise. Such shock.

Basically it. However, the very social construct that facilitates such human behavior is the real issue. Caused again, by the Western European sea-faring empires on their road to conquest and easy governance.

In my opinion, humans are inherently xenophobic. Deep down we fear what we do not know or aren't used to. If you grow up in an environment around people of one particular race and a big minority of the rest, your behavior towards people of a different race can be construed as racist. I'd call this our "neutral" setting, which changes through experience for better or worse.

Positive experiences will gradually rid people of this kind of "neutral racism" or xenophobia, but negative experiences will only make it worse. Of course, ideologies passed on from other people can also become an influence.

[Buddha Punk Robot Monks]

-snip-

Your source is guilty of: https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/begging-the-question and a whole lot of https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

They basically invent their own definition, and explain why they invented it.

Racism is bigotry based on race. That is all racism is. There are no other qualifiers.

Methinks you only see these particular logical fallacies in the source because you disagree with the basic premise.

Racism is a social construction created by Europeans during the Era of Colonization to more effectively rule over their colored subjects. Therefore racism has always had an element of power to it. Without this power there is no racism. There can be bigotry and race prejudice, but not racism. Reverse racism is a concept created by people who don't understand how racism works structurally.

Other groups that have structural power over certain groups based on race or ethnicity, for example the Han Chinese over the Tibetans, could also be described as racists or, at least, ethnicists, depending on what your definition of "race" is.

[Dyakovo]

Sir, I am glad to head that. Sir, please accept my humblest apology if I have offended in you in the slightest way, Sir.

Y'know, on the internet, you don't have to call people "sir", especially 1 or 2 times a sentence. To each his own though.

Sir, yes sir!

[Senyosu]

In the end all, racism as the social construct really benefits those that created in the first place. Hence why white pride is inherently redundant and racist. The social construct created by the 'mighty whitey' if you may, is the building to be destroyed.

If Whites fell to just 1% or less in a country, I bet the people there would still find a way to blame Whitey for all of their problems.

While I myself try to limit how many times I use the 'guilty by association card' others more radical and assertive than I are going to use such a card.

The key to solve such a problem is mutual understanding through dialogue and education. That, I fine, would not only eliminate the social construct, but the grudge of those who posess the colonial mentality and related ideologies as a result of Atlantic-Western European colonialism.

[Aurora Novus]

The definition of racism and the solution to racism are not inherently one and the same. So I differ a bit from that.

I believe that with proper education most things can be solved. However, as long as ignorance is prevalent, so will be racism and other forms of bigotry. And not everyone cares or bothers about being educated so it's not something as simple as "let's solve it!" since it's an ideology, and ideologies are much much harder to let go of than actions.

Pfft. Well, racism is something that cannot be eliminated. It is just the tool of it. The behaviour itself? Why bother. Too much effort. Might as well remove the tools that allow that behaviour to fornicate in all of it's horrid...ness.

Whatever your definition of racism is, the core of racism (and racial bigotry) is a displaced value on the importance of race. If you eliminate the value of race, you eliminate the core of racism, seriously crippling it from being a viable viewpoint for people within the world. True, you can never truly eliminate a belief from existence. There are still flat earthers after all. However, you can fatally wound an ideaology, and let time bleed it out. When you try to go about combatting racism by promoting other races however, you're not doing that.

The solution to racism isn't to play up the importance of other races. It's to downplay the importance of race as a whole. Destroy the value of race, and you destroy racism. Render race no more important than the colour of one's eye. That is how you slay racism. Not with "X Pride".

[Vettrera]

In the end all, racism as the social construct really benefits those that created in the first place. Hence why white pride is inherently redundant and racist. The social construct created by the 'mighty whitey' if you may, is the building to be destroyed.

If Whites fell to just 1% or less in a country, I bet the people there would still find a way to blame Whitey for all of their problems.

Same way people blame minorities for issues in America today? Racism is a two way street, and after spending months with you on the forums, I recognize that you have failed to understand that.

[Dyakovo]

Does it make me bigoted/racist that I barely have any friends of my own race?

Not automatically, no. Although the possibility does exist.

[Ixzara]

If Whites fell to just 1% or less in a country, I bet the people there would still find a way to blame Whitey for all of their problems.

Same way people blame minorities for issues in America today? Racism is a two way street, and after spending months with you on the forums, I recognize that you have failed to understand that.

They took err jerbs!!!

[Spartan Philidelphia]

Basically it. However, the very social construct that facilitates such human behavior is the real issue. Caused again, by the Western European sea-faring empires on their road to conquest and easy governance.

In my opinion, humans are inherently xenophobic. Deep down we fear what we do not know or aren't used to. If you grow up in an environment around people of one particular race and a big minority of the rest, your behavior towards people of a different race can be construed as racist. I'd call this our "neutral" setting, which changes through experience for better or worse.

Positive experiences will gradually rid people of this kind of "neutral racism" or xenophobia, but negative experiences will only make it worse. Of course, ideologies passed on from other people can also become an influence.

But how can people in America have positive experiences with people of other races if most of our neighborhoods and schools are still de facto segregated?

[Mavorpen]

However, let's note here that sentences =/= convictions. It fails to address the higher conviction rates among black males for crimes like murder and rape.

Yes it does. Do you SERIOUSLY not grasp what this says?

For instance, controlling for type of crime committed or for the defendant’s criminal history, researchers look to see whether the results of their equation still show racial disparity.

The "type of crime committed" IS addressing this. ALL of this is controlled for. These people aren't idiots.

[Senyosu]

Basically it. However, the very social construct that facilitates such human behavior is the real issue. Caused again, by the Western European sea-faring empires on their road to conquest and easy governance.

In my opinion, humans are inherently xenophobic. Deep down we fear what we do not know or aren't used to. If you grow up in an environment around people of one particular race and a big minority of the rest, your behavior towards people of a different race can be construed as racist. I'd call this our "neutral" setting, which changes through experience for better or worse.

Positive experiences will gradually rid people of this kind of "neutral racism" or xenophobia, but negative experiences will only make it worse. Of course, ideologies passed on from other people can also become an influence.

Exactly. Though behaviour is hard to change and sway. They key is to slowly remove the tools that allow this behaviour to rear it's ugly-ass head through education and mutual understanding between all.

[MERIZoC]

Does it make me bigoted/racist that I barely have any friends of my own race?

Not automatically, no. Although the possibility does exist.

Racist against your own race? Seems pretty unlikely, especially if it was unintentional.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

In the end all, racism as the social construct really benefits those that created in the first place. Hence why white pride is inherently redundant and racist. The social construct created by the 'mighty whitey' if you may, is the building to be destroyed.

If Whites fell to just 1% or less in a country, I bet the people there would still find a way to blame Whitey for all of their problems.

If whites managed to be in a majority status where they had access to every privilege that society had to offer, and power that they were managing to hold on to easily even in the face of shifting racial demographics, then I bet that there would still be some white people bitching and moaning about how easy black people had it in comparison to them, and about how the liberal media played to their fears and society handed them welfare checks at the drop of a hat despite none of that being the case.

Oh, wait...that's actually the case, and not some paranoid racist fantasy.

[Esternial]

In my opinion, humans are inherently xenophobic. Deep down we fear what we do not know or aren't used to. If you grow up in an environment around people of one particular race and a big minority of the rest, your behavior towards people of a different race can be construed as racist. I'd call this our "neutral" setting, which changes through experience for better or worse.

Positive experiences will gradually rid people of this kind of "neutral racism" or xenophobia, but negative experiences will only make it worse. Of course, ideologies passed on from other people can also become an influence.

But how can people in America have positive experiences with people of other races if most of our neighborhoods and schools are still de facto segregated?

That's obviously an issue.

[Aurora Novus]

Your source is guilty of: https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/begging-the-question and a whole lot of https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

They basically invent their own definition, and explain why they invented it.

Racism is bigotry based on race. That is all racism is. There are no other qualifiers.

Methinks you only see these particular logical fallacies in the source because you disagree with the basic premise.

Racism is a social construction created by Europeans during the Era of Colonization to more effectively rule over their colored subjects. Therefore racism has always had an element of power to it. Without this power there is no racism. There can be bigotry and race prejudice, but not racism. Reverse racism is a concept created by people who don't understand how racism works structurally.

Other groups that have structural power over certain groups based on race or ethnicity, for example the Han Chinese over the Tibetans, could also be described as racists or, at least, ethnicists, depending on what your definition of "race" is.

This only makes sense if you redefine racism to include power as part of it's definition. For those of us who don't, you're just being a weasel.

Why should racism include some notion of power in it's deifnition? What benefit does it serve, other than allowing for minorities to be freed from any form of criticisim with the label? That isn't how people popularly understand the term now, so what benefit is there to a change in terminology?

[Vettrera]

If Whites fell to just 1% or less in a country, I bet the people there would still find a way to blame Whitey for all of their problems.

If whites managed to be in a majority status where they had access to every privilege that society had to offer, and power that they were managing to hold on to easily even in the face of shifting racial demographics, then I bet that there would still be some white people bitching and moaning about how easy black people had it in comparison to them, and about how the liberal media played to their fears and society handed them welfare checks at the drop of a hat despite none of that being the case.

Oh, wait...that's actually the case, and not some paranoid racist fantasy.

I find Saiwania's hatred of the woe is me mentality comic, because he's been using that mentality for months when talking about white decline

[Neutraligon]

Nevermind

[Viritica]

I feel it's worth noting your first link basically talks about how both white and black males with criminal records are less likely to be hired for a job. While this certainly isn't a good thing, you must ask yourself... if you were a business owner who would you hire? Jimmy with the perfectly clean record or Bob, the convicted murderer?

Your second link is the HuffPo, a site with liberal bias. Sorry, but no.

I must ask you, do you even know what these "black sounding names are"? I do, they're ridiculous and made up names like Neaquan, Deaquan, Alquan, Waysia, Cashe, I could go on. They're names given to individuals who typically grow up in low-income crime ridden neighborhoods. If you want your child to have the best possible life they can... why would you make up such ridiculous names?

Blacks have a tendency to live in less well off neighborhoods. Less well off neighborhoods tend to have schools with poor funding. I do agree with you on that one, the educational system needs a complete reform.

Here's the article that HuffPo link was leading to. I actually meant to link it instead, but got caught up in tab confusion. I believe that it puts the first link into perspective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ ... story.html

Whatever the reasons may be for parents giving their children these names, it is undeniable that they are associated with black people, and that people are putting aside resumes because of the "black sounding" names. To turn the question around, if you're running a business, wouldn't you want to hire the best person regardless of race, and therefore invite as many qualified applicants to interview as possible regardless of their names?

Thank you.

Hm, you're actually quite pleasant.

Now, I know judges should not be prejudiced and I know biased attitudes exist. However, you have to realize a lot of blacks tend to live crowded together in poor neighborhoods, many of which I've already mentioned. Poor neighborhoods tend to lead to more crime. I'm not trying to justify any biased attitudes against blacks, I'd just like you to understand why they exist.

As for the names, I certainly would try and consider all the applicants and hire whoever is the best qualified. I'm simply saying a parent should not try and give their children any possible disadvantages in life, and having silly names can be a bit of a disadvantage.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

If whites managed to be in a majority status where they had access to every privilege that society had to offer, and power that they were managing to hold on to easily even in the face of shifting racial demographics, then I bet that there would still be some white people bitching and moaning about how easy black people had it in comparison to them, and about how the liberal media played to their fears and society handed them welfare checks at the drop of a hat despite none of that being the case.

Oh, wait...that's actually the case, and not some paranoid racist fantasy.

I find Saiwania's hatred of the woe is me mentality comic, because he's been using that mentality for months when talking about white decline

He's even asserting sole claim to the privilege of victimhood. It's insane.

[Senyosu]

The definition of racism and the solution to racism are not inherently one and the same. So I differ a bit from that.

I believe that with proper education most things can be solved. However, as long as ignorance is prevalent, so will be racism and other forms of bigotry. And not everyone cares or bothers about being educated so it's not something as simple as "let's solve it!" since it's an ideology, and ideologies are much much harder to let go of than actions.

Pfft. Well, racism is something that cannot be eliminated. It is just the tool of it. The behaviour itself? Why bother. Too much effort. Might as well remove the tools that allow that behaviour to fornicate in all of it's horrid...ness.

Whatever your definition of racism is, the core of racism (and racial bigotry) is a displaced value on the importance of race. IF you eliminate the value of race, you eliminate the core of racism, serously crippling it from being a viable viewpoint for people within the world. True, you can never truly eliminate a belief from existence. There are still flat earthers after all. However, you can fatally wound an ideaology, and let time bleed it out. When you try to go about combatting racism by promoting other races however, you're not doing that.

The solution to racism isn't to play up the importance of other races. It's to downplay the importance of race as a whole. Destroy the value of race, and you destroy racism. Render race no more important than the colour of one's eye. That is how you slay racism. Not with "X Pride".

I understand where you are coming from. But one does not simply take value and pride over a race. It is simply too drastic of a movement. It is best to take it slow and steady. Social attitudes take time to deestablish or reestablish. The very essence of pride in the end is retribution. Retribution against their oppressors. That is the very premise of any pride parade done by a minority.

And yes, I agree with you. It is just that the means to the end is not feasible. Education and mutual understanding appears to be a better route to deestablish the construct all together. The behaviour itself would 'self repress' and almost cease to exist. After all, 100% in human society is impossible.

Unless it was a test on mathematics or science.