Louisiana's state book to be the bible?

[Gauthier]

Lousiana, the state where convicts can legally own firearms and now the Republicans are trying to backdoor abolish the Separation of Church and State along with abortion.

What would really take the piss out of this campaign was if a bunch of Louisiana Muslims organized a campaign to make the Qu'ran the state book instead.

[Ermarian]

http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/04/louisiana_bible_official_state.html

Legislation that would make the Holy Bible the official state book of Louisiana cleared the House Committee on Municipal, Parochial and Cultural Affairs with a vote of 8-5 Thursday afternoon. It will now head to the full House of Representatives for consideration.

Rep. Thomas Carmody, R-Shreveport, originally filed a bill to declare a specific copy of the Bible, found in the Louisiana State Museum system, the official state book. But by the time he presented the proposal to the committee, he changed language in his legislation to make the generic King James version of the Bible, a text used worldwide, the official state book.

Carmody said his intention was not to mingle religion with government functions. "This is not about establishing an official religion," he said.

Still, Legislators became concerned that the proposal wasn't broad enough and did not reflect the breadth of Bibles used by religious communities. In particular, some lawmakers worried that singling out the King James version of the Bible would not properly reflect the culture of Louisiana. The Catholic Church, for example, does not use the King James text.

"Let's make this more inclusive of other Christian faiths, more than just the ones that use the King James version," said Rep. Stephen Ortego, D-Carencro.

A few committee members fought the bill vehemently, saying the legislation was likely to upset some citizens who are not Christian and open the state up to legal challenges.

"I am so bothered by this bill that I just called my pastor. My pastor just said that he thinks we are going to have a legal problem," said Rep. Wesley Bishop, D-New Orleans, who voted against the legislation.

Rep. Ebony Woodruff, D-Harvey, tried to amend the bill to declare "all books of faith" the official state books of Louisiana, but the proposal failed 5-8. When asked if he would be open to making "all books of faith" a group of official state books, Carmody was fairly adamant in his opposition.

"I would certainly be against that amendment," he said.

The American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana already has concerns about the bill. "[The official state book] ought to be one that relates to the history of Louisiana and not one that is going to discriminate against a large number of Louisianans," said Majorie Esman, executive director of the organization. Esman declined to say whether the ACLU would fight the Holy Bible designation in court if it became law.

Michael Weil, who heads up the Jewish Federation of Greater New Orleans, said his organization -- which is cultural and not religious in nature -- hasn't take a stance on the bill. But the legislation gives him some personal pause.

"I think the state should consider a text that is not religious," he said.

HOW COMMITTEE MEMBERS VOTED:

Those who voted in favor of declaring the Holy Bible Louisiana's official state book: Reps. Taylor Barras, R-New Iberia; Johnny Berthelot, R-Gonzales; Robert Billiot, D-Westwego; Terry Brown, I-Colfax; Mike Danahay, D-Sulphur; Dalton Honore, D-Baton Rouge; Stephen Ortego, D-Carencro; Tom Willmott, R-Kenner

Those who voted against declaring the Holy Bible Louisiana's official state book: Bishop, Woodruff and Reps. Jared Brossett, D-New Orleans; Austin Badon, D-New Orleans; Barbara Norton, D-Shreveport

The Legislation: http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/ViewDocument.aspx?d=877881&n=HB503%20Original

I see this as clear contradiction to the first amendment of the United States constitution. I don't see this going down too well legally for Louisiana if it ends up passing and becoming law.

What say you guys?

Holy crap. This isn't just a violation of the first amendment, this is like a parody of a first amendment violation. It's like a strawman or slippery slope example you'd use if you were arguing about first amendment violations. To paraphrase xkcd, it's like an example you'd make up if you had to illustrate for a child why the first amendment is necessary.

[Confederate Ramenia]

This doesn't mean the bible will become law, it means the bible will be the state book. The state book is chosen to best represent the literary culture of a state. If they love the bible, it's a great state book.

[Greed and Death]

http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/04/louisiana_bible_official_state.html

Legislation that would make the Holy Bible the official state book of Louisiana cleared the House Committee on Municipal, Parochial and Cultural Affairs with a vote of 8-5 Thursday afternoon. It will now head to the full House of Representatives for consideration.

Rep. Thomas Carmody, R-Shreveport, originally filed a bill to declare a specific copy of the Bible, found in the Louisiana State Museum system, the official state book. But by the time he presented the proposal to the committee, he changed language in his legislation to make the generic King James version of the Bible, a text used worldwide, the official state book.

Carmody said his intention was not to mingle religion with government functions. "This is not about establishing an official religion," he said.

Still, Legislators became concerned that the proposal wasn't broad enough and did not reflect the breadth of Bibles used by religious communities. In particular, some lawmakers worried that singling out the King James version of the Bible would not properly reflect the culture of Louisiana. The Catholic Church, for example, does not use the King James text.

"Let's make this more inclusive of other Christian faiths, more than just the ones that use the King James version," said Rep. Stephen Ortego, D-Carencro.

A few committee members fought the bill vehemently, saying the legislation was likely to upset some citizens who are not Christian and open the state up to legal challenges.

"I am so bothered by this bill that I just called my pastor. My pastor just said that he thinks we are going to have a legal problem," said Rep. Wesley Bishop, D-New Orleans, who voted against the legislation.

Rep. Ebony Woodruff, D-Harvey, tried to amend the bill to declare "all books of faith" the official state books of Louisiana, but the proposal failed 5-8. When asked if he would be open to making "all books of faith" a group of official state books, Carmody was fairly adamant in his opposition.

"I would certainly be against that amendment," he said.

The American Civil Liberties Union of Louisiana already has concerns about the bill. "[The official state book] ought to be one that relates to the history of Louisiana and not one that is going to discriminate against a large number of Louisianans," said Majorie Esman, executive director of the organization. Esman declined to say whether the ACLU would fight the Holy Bible designation in court if it became law.

Michael Weil, who heads up the Jewish Federation of Greater New Orleans, said his organization -- which is cultural and not religious in nature -- hasn't take a stance on the bill. But the legislation gives him some personal pause.

"I think the state should consider a text that is not religious," he said.

HOW COMMITTEE MEMBERS VOTED:

Those who voted in favor of declaring the Holy Bible Louisiana's official state book: Reps. Taylor Barras, R-New Iberia; Johnny Berthelot, R-Gonzales; Robert Billiot, D-Westwego; Terry Brown, I-Colfax; Mike Danahay, D-Sulphur; Dalton Honore, D-Baton Rouge; Stephen Ortego, D-Carencro; Tom Willmott, R-Kenner

Those who voted against declaring the Holy Bible Louisiana's official state book: Bishop, Woodruff and Reps. Jared Brossett, D-New Orleans; Austin Badon, D-New Orleans; Barbara Norton, D-Shreveport

The Legislation: http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/ViewDocument.aspx?d=877881&n=HB503%20Original

I see this as clear contradiction to the first amendment of the United States constitution. I don't see this going down too well legally for Louisiana if it ends up passing and becoming law.

What say you guys?

Since they are using a historical bible one I do not think is in use by a religious sect it might be fine.

[Assorted Sucrose-Based Lifeforms]

I'm tired and I've been up too long, fundies are trying to kill the 1st amendment, I've just spent the last hour on coursework only to realise that I got one of the questions completely wrong only 15 minutes before the hand-in deadline.
It's the perfect storm.
The 'Ugh' Vortex consumeth all fucks.

[Quackquackhonk]

you'll never stop the apes from flinging their poo.

[The Two Jerseys]

Come on, if Louisiana is going to pick a state book it HAS to be All the King's Men. We all know that Willie Stark is supposed to be Huey Long.

As an aside, one of my teachers once told my class that she went to a restaurant in Louisiana during Lent and ordered chicken, and their response was, "No, you're having fish." That about says it all...

[Nord Amour]

Come on, if Louisiana is going to pick a state book it HAS to be All the King's Men. We all know that Willie Stark is supposed to be Huey Long.

As an aside, one of my teachers once told my class that she went to a restaurant in Louisiana during Lent and ordered chicken, and their response was, "No, you're having fish." That about says it all...

I would have left immediately. If they don't offer chicken, they may as well go out of business.

On the original topic:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/first_amendment

[The Rich Port]

I was going to mention how many great authors from Louisiana would not have their books become the official state book... But then I realized I don't know of any authors from Louisiana.

[The Scientific States]

No, just fuck no.

Louisiana, I am disappointed.

[Nord Amour]

No, just fuck no.

Louisiana, I am disappointed.

That is all that needs be said.

[Avenio]

No, just fuck no.

Louisiana, I am disappointed.

Really? You expected anything less from Louisiana? Quite the optimist, I see.

[The Scientific States]

No, just fuck no.

Louisiana, I am disappointed.

Really? You expected anything less from Louisiana? Quite the optimist, I see.

I'm not surprised, just disappointed. Very disappointed. *shakes head disapprovingly at Louisiana*

[Seno Zhou Varada]

Really state books?...

What's next state underwear brands? Couldn't you have done something that explains your state history?

Whatever...

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Really? You expected anything less from Louisiana? Quite the optimist, I see.

I'm not surprised, just disappointed. Very disappointed. *shakes head disapprovingly at Louisiana*

You could become part of the U.N with that attitude

[Othelos]

Another reason why I'm so glad that I live in the Northeast.

[AiliailiA]

I was going to mention how many great authors from Louisiana would not have their books become the official state book... But then I realized I don't know of any authors from Louisiana.

I don't either

*googles*

Um. Faith Hunter?

[The united states of Saints]

Really? You expected anything less from Louisiana? Quite the optimist, I see.

I'm not surprised, just disappointed. Very disappointed. *shakes head disapprovingly at Louisiana*

I'm a resident of Louisiana and sorry for disappointing you is there anyway we can make it up to you

[Gauthier]

Someone ought to lead a countercampaign to make the Qu'ran the Louisiana State Book.

[Ifreann]

http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/04/louisiana_bible_official_state.html



The Legislation: http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/ViewDocument.aspx?d=877881&n=HB503%20Original

I see this as clear contradiction to the first amendment of the United States constitution. I don't see this going down too well legally for Louisiana if it ends up passing and becoming law.

What say you guys?

Since they are using a historical bible one I do not think is in use by a religious sect it might be fine.

They're not. They're using the KJV Bible. The original idea was to use one, specific copy of the Bible from a Louisiana museum, but that's not the idea that was presented to the committee. See: The second sentence of the second paragraph of the source you just quoted.

[Grinning Dragon]

Louisiana, the state where convicts can legally own firearms and now the Republicans are trying to backdoor abolish the Separation of Church and State along with abortion.

What would really take the piss out of this campaign was if a bunch of Louisiana Muslims organized a campaign to make the Qu'ran the state book instead.

The separation of church and state phrase was from a letter Jefferson wrote. There isn't any mention in the Constitution of the phrase "separation of church and state"

Gentlemen

The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good as to express towards me, on behalf of the Danbury Baptist association, give me the highest satisfaction. my duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of the interests of my constituents, & in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more and more pleasing.

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.

I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem.

Th Jefferson
Jan. 1. 1802

I am neither for nor against the proposal here in Louisiana, many more important things to worry about than a state book, imo.

[Ifreann]

Louisiana, the state where convicts can legally own firearms and now the Republicans are trying to backdoor abolish the Separation of Church and State along with abortion.

What would really take the piss out of this campaign was if a bunch of Louisiana Muslims organized a campaign to make the Qu'ran the state book instead.

The separation of church and state phrase was from a letter Jefferson wrote. There isn't any mention in the Constitution of the phrase "separation of church and state"

Gentlemen

The affectionate sentiments of esteem and approbation which you are so good as to express towards me, on behalf of the Danbury Baptist association, give me the highest satisfaction. my duties dictate a faithful and zealous pursuit of the interests of my constituents, & in proportion as they are persuaded of my fidelity to those duties, the discharge of them becomes more and more pleasing.

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.

I reciprocate your kind prayers for the protection & blessing of the common father and creator of man, and tender you for yourselves & your religious association, assurances of my high respect & esteem.

Th Jefferson
Jan. 1. 1802

I am neither for nor against the proposal here in Louisiana, many more important things to worry about than a state book, imo.

You have the time to google that letter, quote it, and post it, but not to decide which side of this issue you come down on? Bollocks. You're purposefully trying to minimise and dismiss this issue, and thus can only be supporting the anti-constitution Christians who want the Bible to be Louisiana's state book.

[Cenetra]

The separation of church and state phrase was from a letter Jefferson wrote. There isn't any mention in the Constitution of the phrase "separation of church and state"

It doesn't matter if the exact phrasing is used, it's pretty obviously in there.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Making a religious text your "state book" pretty obviously violates the establishment clause.

[Zavea]

establishment clause

AHAHAHA, TAKE THAT, LOSERISIANA

[Geilinor]

http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/04/louisiana_bible_official_state.html



The Legislation: http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/ViewDocument.aspx?d=877881&n=HB503%20Original

I see this as clear contradiction to the first amendment of the United States constitution. I don't see this going down too well legally for Louisiana if it ends up passing and becoming law.

What say you guys?

Since they are using a historical bible one I do not think is in use by a religious sect it might be fine.

The King James Version is still used by some.