Do you consider the Confederate flag to be racist

[Yumyumsuppertime]

It tends to get brought up as a point of comparison.

And in both cases, the rebellion itself was illegal.

Yes.

"If this be treason, make the most of it." -Patrick Henry

[Dyakovo]

And in both cases, the rebellion itself was illegal.

Yes.

"If this be treason, make the most of it." -Patrick Henry

What some people don't seem to understand, is it isn't the rebels' opinion on the validity of their rebellion that gives it legitimacy (of course, they think it is legitimate), it is whether or not it is ultimately successful.

[Mormak]

Yes.

"If this be treason, make the most of it." -Patrick Henry

What some people don't seem to understand, is it isn't the rebels' opinion on the validity of their rebellion that gives it legitimacy (of course, they think it is legitimate), it is whether or not it is ultimately successful.

What some people don't seem to understand is that their opinion is their opinion and not absolute truth of the universe, reality and god.

[Tekania]

Right or wrong, the colonists disagreed...

Weren't we just here for the C.S.A?

There are two very key differences between the CSA and the 13 Colonies..... (1)The Independence of the 13 colonies was officially recognized by and supported by other independent states, and (2) The Independence of the 13 colonies was officially recognized by its former state.

[Mormak]

Weren't we just here for the C.S.A?

There are two very key differences between the CSA and the 13 Colonies..... (1)The Independence of the 13 colonies was officially recognized by and supported by other independent states, and (2) The Independence of the 13 colonies was officially recognized by its former state.

Very Key differences given that you had English nobility hiring ships to breach the blockade, and the French remaining viable trade partners the entire conflict for the C.S.A, to limited degrees. Not official declarations of support but given this is an "unstate" to folks here, this combined with it being treated as a state by the Union it self leads me to believe it was one.

Just a relatively short lived one, although not as shortlived as some.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

What some people don't seem to understand, is it isn't the rebels' opinion on the validity of their rebellion that gives it legitimacy (of course, they think it is legitimate), it is whether or not it is ultimately successful.

What some people don't seem to understand is that their opinion is their opinion and not absolute truth of the universe, reality and god.

In other words:

"Well, yeah, that's just, like, your opinion, man." -The Dude, The Big Lebowski, screenplay by Joel and Ethan Coen.

[Tekania]

There are two very key differences between the CSA and the 13 Colonies..... (1)The Independence of the 13 colonies was officially recognized by and supported by other independent states, and (2) The Independence of the 13 colonies was officially recognized by its former state.

Very Key differences given that you had English nobility hiring ships to breach the blockade, and the French remaining viable trade partners the entire conflict for the C.S.A, to limited degrees. Not official declarations of support but given this is an "unstate" to folks here, this combined with it being treated as a state by the Union it self leads me to believe it was one.

Just a relatively short lived one, although not as shortlived as some.

The Union treated it as a rebellious militia, not a state. And while France traded because they needed cotton, they refused to receive any Confederate representatives while maintaining reception of Union ones. And neither did Britain.... so no, no state. A legal nullity.... a non-state entity with no real authority.

[Augarundus]

Why don't you ask the Confederate flag what his opinions of Jews and blacks are?

[The Black Forrest]

The flag itself?

No.

The people waving it around.

Tend to be.

[Nazi Flower Power]

I would argue theres "wrong" opinions. I could have the opinion that the sky is always red, but I'll be wrong.

The may also fit the criteria, but they weren't recognized. They were treasonous, slaving, impatient, and treacherous.

The sky is always red on Mars

Since when?

[The Black Forrest]

The sky is always red on Mars

Since when?

The TV showed us that!

[Prevnina]

Why don't you ask the Confederate flag what his opinions of Jews and blacks are?

Judah P. Benjamin was the Confederate Secretary of State, and there were thousands of Jews in the Confederate army, though I've got to give you the blacks...

[Nazi Flower Power]

No, I do not. It is a symbol that represents the South, and should be treated as such. The Southerners should be proud to hoist the Confederate flag, not be looked down on for it.

It represents a particular period of Southern history, and it is not something the South should be proud of.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Why don't you ask the Confederate flag what his opinions of Jews and blacks are?

Judah P. Benjamin was the Confederate Secretary of State, and there were thousands of Jews in the Confederate army, though I've got to give you the blacks...

At least you aren't trying to sell them.

[Augarundus]

Why don't you ask the Confederate flag what his opinions of Jews and blacks are?

Judah P. Benjamin was the Confederate Secretary of State, and there were thousands of Jews in the Confederate army, though I've got to give you the blacks...

I'm pretty sure there were black soldiers fighting for the Confederacy too. was just making a joke

[Nazi Flower Power]

The entire country of the United States (not just the South) is traitorous. They did rebel against Britain during their Revolution. They hated the taxes and whatnot, but if the colonies belong to us, we have that right.

I do not have a problem with the general concept of states seceding from the Union. The problem with the Confederacy is their reasons for seceding and the way they went about it.

[Prevnina]

Judah P. Benjamin was the Confederate Secretary of State, and there were thousands of Jews in the Confederate army, though I've got to give you the blacks...

I'm pretty sure there were black soldiers fighting for the Confederacy too. was just making a joke

I know, was just trying to point out that the Confederate flag would probably have the same opinions it did in 1861, not those of the people who carry it today.

At least you aren't trying to sell them.

Around here? I may be an idiot, but I'm not stupid

[Nazi Flower Power]

Why don't you ask the Confederate flag what his opinions of Jews and blacks are?

I don't speak Flaggish. Can you ask him and tell us what he says?

[Nazi Flower Power]

Judah P. Benjamin was the Confederate Secretary of State, and there were thousands of Jews in the Confederate army, though I've got to give you the blacks...

I'm pretty sure there were black soldiers fighting for the Confederacy too.

In numbers too small to be significant. The Union had far more black troops, even though the South had more blacks, and every contemporary account I have ever seen written by any Union soldier agrees that the majority of Southern blacks welcomed them as liberators. If you look at the numbers of who lived where and who fought for which side, and if you read contemporary accounts, it is obvious that the general public opinion among blacks was strongly pro-Union. Even racist jerks like Sherman were popular with blacks if they kicked enough Confederate butt.

[Tekania]

Why don't you ask the Confederate flag what his opinions of Jews and blacks are?

I don't speak Flaggish. Can you ask him and tell us what he says?

I do, I asked the flag its opinion and it said flap, flap, rustle, rustle, swish, flap, rustle.... which loosely translated is "FUCKING CHRIST PEOPLE, STOP WAVING ME AROUND! War has been over for almost 150 years!!!! Don't you people have a fucking LIFE?!"

[Nazi Flower Power]

I don't speak Flaggish. Can you ask him and tell us what he says?

I do, I asked the flag its opinion and it said flap, flap, rustle, rustle, swish, flap, rustle.... which loosely translated is "FUCKING CHRIST PEOPLE, STOP WAVING ME AROUND! War has been over for almost 150 years!!!! Don't you people have a fucking LIFE?!"

Whaddaya know... I guess he is not such a bad flag after all.

[Marxist Monaco]

No, it is always racist, even if it's not intended to be. The CSA was a nation that fought for the perpetuation of the bondage of African Americans. And their banner represents that and everything the nation stood for.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

I do, I asked the flag its opinion and it said flap, flap, rustle, rustle, swish, flap, rustle.... which loosely translated is "FUCKING CHRIST PEOPLE, STOP WAVING ME AROUND! War has been over for almost 150 years!!!! Don't you people have a fucking LIFE?!"

Whaddaya know... I guess he is not such a bad flag after all.

I wonder what the Nazi flag is saying.

Flap, rustle, rustle, flap, Roman salute.

Translates roughly to,"I am slightly off-kilter, please straighten me so I can stop goose-stepping."

[Mormak]

Since when?

The TV showed us that!

EXACTLY!

[Tel]

Given what it stood for, yeah.

It shouldn't have the same protections as the American flag does. It's a piece of cloth that represents an outdated, bigoted bureaucracy that fought an incredibly bloody war for the right to enslave human beings.

A public institution should be prevented from flying it. A private home? Go ahead, but everyone within a few hundred meters will know that you're a worthless hick.