Wage Slavery? The poor are poor because....

[Vazdania]

Well, I wouldn't say simply, but yes. Preferably in the 9-10 dollar range, considering that's the "living wage"

I would put US$ 20 as the minimum wage with one preferably higher.

You've got to be kidding.

[Bythibus]

Well, I wouldn't say simply, but yes. Preferably in the 9-10 dollar range, considering that's the "living wage"

I would put US$ 20 as the minimum wage with one preferably higher.

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

[Ardoki]

I would put US$ 20 as the minimum wage with one preferably higher.

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

No it wouldn't. It would mean there are more people with more money, those people would spend the extra money they have thus stimulating the economy.

[Vazdania]

I would put US$ 20 as the minimum wage with one preferably higher.

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

Minimum wage is a violation of the right to freely contract, moreover, its a authoritarian, and keeps wages artificially low.

[Vazdania]

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

No it wouldn't. It would mean there are more people with more money, those people would spend the extra money they have thus stimulating the economy.

Oh yes, let's destroy small business in the process.

[Geilinor]

I'm not talking about globalization, I'm talking about the real, lasting scars from colonialism and how the third world was still set back hard by the rape.

You're not showing me trends or evidence.

I never said the third world was ravaged by capitalism. The old colonial powers switched to capitalism post-rape and capitalism has been a tool which, while helpful in letting poorer countries become somewhat less poor, was also instrumental in keeping them down. Capitalism isn't a magic tool that brings money in stride, the only reason countries do better than others is resources.

I know, but you're obviously trying to trigger ideas with your words, and I think you're being dishonest with your terminology.

I dunno, I'm experiencing a distinct lack of source in your supposedly "fact-based" "argument".

Oh my god stop throwing around “second world” and “third world” as these terms referring to income grades. That's not what those mean.

First World = US-aligned nations
Second World = Warsaw Pact-aligned nations
Third World = Non-Aligned Movement

Majority world and minority world refer to poorer countries and wealthier countries, respectively.

Continue.

Incorrect. You're using Cold War definitions. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_World

After the fall of the Soviet Union and the end of the Cold War, the meaning "First World" took on a new meaning applicable to the times, coming to be largely synonymous with developed countries or highly developed countries (depending on which definition is intended)

[Ardoki]

No it wouldn't. It would mean there are more people with more money, those people would spend the extra money they have thus stimulating the economy.

Oh yes, let's destroy small business in the process.

All businesses should be owned by society while run by the workers.

[Vazdania]

Oh yes, let's destroy small business in the process.

All businesses should be owned by society while run by the workers.

That is disgusting. Keep your dirty paws off of others property. That is greedy and is nothing more than a wish to take other's property away from them.

[Geilinor]

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

Minimum wage is a violation of the right to freely contract, moreover, its a authoritarian, and keeps wages artificially low.

How does the minimum wage keep wages artificially low? Employers can pay more if they wish.

[Geilinor]

All businesses should be owned by society while run by the workers.

That is disgusting. Keep your dirty paws off of others property. That is greedy and is nothing more than a wish to take other's property away from them.

"Should" could simply be a long-term ideal and not involve taking property.

[Vazdania]

Minimum wage is a violation of the right to freely contract, moreover, its a authoritarian, and keeps wages artificially low.

How does the minimum wage keep wages artificially low? Employers can pay more if they wish.

Indeed, however, because there is little to no negation between employer and employee on the subject of initial wages, and the Employer can defer the employees wage immediately to the lowest possible, it keeps wages low.

In other words, companies will start employees off at a low wage, with no negotiation, and this is the state's fault.

[Vazdania]

That is disgusting. Keep your dirty paws off of others property. That is greedy and is nothing more than a wish to take other's property away from them.

"Should" could simply be a long-term ideal and not involve taking property.

It's still a disgusting concept regardless if this is a long term goal or not. Workers shouldn't own business.

[Bythibus]

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

Minimum wage is a violation of the right to freely contract, moreover, its a authoritarian, and keeps wages artificially low.

Mhm, whatever you say bud.

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

No it wouldn't. It would mean there are more people with more money, those people would spend the extra money they have thus stimulating the economy.

You realize there is an upper limit to what an economy can handle in the way of cash influx, right? Too much too fast is a very, very negative thing.

And the purpose of minimum wage is not to allow us to buy what we want, it's to ensure we can survive on our income.

[Ardoki]

How does the minimum wage keep wages artificially low? Employers can pay more if they wish.

Indeed, however, because there is little to no negation between employer and employee on the subject of initial wages, and the Employer can defer the employees wage immediately to the lowest possible, it keeps wages low.

In other words, companies will start employees off at a low wage, with no negotiation, and this is the state's fault.

No, if there was no minimum wage people would be payed a lot less because the business can pay them as little as they like.
What is to stop employees demanding wages higher than the minimum wage? Nothing but the businesses which are greedy and shall be taken over by the workers.

[Baader-Meinhof Gruppe]

The poor are poor for a variety of factors. Part of it is income inequality. The whole part about them being the highest they've ever been in America comes to mind. You see the problem with capitalism is that eventually the rich run out of other people's money to spend...that's starting to happen right now. The whole basis of capitalism relies on consumers and the ultra-rich have done everything they can to sabotage and harm the consumers due to their love of stealing money from people who actually work. It'll all come crashing down in a few years and the ultra-rich will most likely face some horrible fates, but hey they brought it upon themselves so who cares about them?

[Ardoki]

No it wouldn't. It would mean there are more people with more money, those people would spend the extra money they have thus stimulating the economy.

You realize there is an upper limit to what an economy can handle in the way of cash influx, right? Too much too fast is a very, very negative thing.

And the purpose of minimum wage is not to allow us to buy what we want, it's to ensure we can survive on our income.

That is why we capitalism is bad and should be replaced with a more stable economic system.

[Vazdania]

Indeed, however, because there is little to no negation between employer and employee on the subject of initial wages, and the Employer can defer the employees wage immediately to the lowest possible, it keeps wages low.

In other words, companies will start employees off at a low wage, with no negotiation, and this is the state's fault.

No, if there was no minimum wage people would be payed a lot less because the business can pay them as little as they like.
What is to stop employees demanding wages higher than the minimum wage? Nothing but the businesses which are greedy and shall be taken over by the workers.

Bullshit. That would result in massive strikes, It's utterly imperative for companies to pay employees a living wage. Employees, with the right to unionize, improve their situation much better without intervention by the state.
Nothing, that is the function of the union, businesses are necessarily greedy? That is there function, an employee owned company is also greedy. Business shouldn't be employee owned.

[Geilinor]

How does the minimum wage keep wages artificially low? Employers can pay more if they wish.

Indeed, however, because there is little to no negation between employer and employee on the subject of initial wages, and the Employer can defer the employees wage immediately to the lowest possible, it keeps wages low.

In other words, companies will start employees off at a low wage, with no negotiation, and this is the state's fault.

What's the lowest level possible without a minimum wage? A few dollars an hour?

[Viritica]

Well, I wouldn't say simply, but yes. Preferably in the 9-10 dollar range, considering that's the "living wage"

I would put US$ 20 as the minimum wage with one preferably higher.

Right now it's about 7 dollars. Why would you want it to skyrocket to 20 dollars? That is ludicrous and employers couldn't afford it.

[Vazdania]

You realize there is an upper limit to what an economy can handle in the way of cash influx, right? Too much too fast is a very, very negative thing.

And the purpose of minimum wage is not to allow us to buy what we want, it's to ensure we can survive on our income.

That is why we capitalism is bad and should be replaced with a more stable economic system.

Capitalism is good, and is the only reliable economic system, socialism and communism are ineffectual and are in no way practical, they are pipe dream (which are much more of a pipe nightmare if you think about it) that should be buried before they get a chance to rear their ugly heads.

[Baader-Meinhof Gruppe]

I would put US$ 20 as the minimum wage with one preferably higher.

Right now it's about 7 dollars. Why would you want it to skyrocket to 20 dollars? That is ludicrous and employers couldn't afford it[.

Source?

[Viritica]

Lord heavens no. Minimum wage should always remain at or right above the livable wage. Excessive minimum wage would be detrimental to the economy.

Minimum wage is a violation of the right to freely contract, moreover, its a authoritarian, and keeps wages artificially low.

Minimum wage keeps people from starving to death.

[Ardoki]

That is why we capitalism is bad and should be replaced with a more stable economic system.

Capitalism is good, and is the only reliable economic system, socialism and communism are ineffectual and are in no way practical, they are pipe dream (which are much more of a pipe nightmare if you think about it) that should be buried before they get a chance to rear their ugly heads.

Communism isn't an economic system.

[Geilinor]

No, if there was no minimum wage people would be payed a lot less because the business can pay them as little as they like.
What is to stop employees demanding wages higher than the minimum wage? Nothing but the businesses which are greedy and shall be taken over by the workers.

Bullshit. That would result in massive strikes, It's utterly imperative for companies to pay employees a living wage. Employees, with the right to unionize, improve their situation much better without intervention by the state.
Nothing, that is the function of the union, businesses are necessarily greedy? That is there function, an employee owned company is also greedy. Business shouldn't be employee owned.

Employee owned businesses can succeed just like any other business. There are many large and successful businesses run in such a way. https://www.google.com/search?client=opera&q=employee-owned+businesses&sourceid=opera&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&channel=suggest
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_employee-owned_companies

[Vazdania]

Indeed, however, because there is little to no negation between employer and employee on the subject of initial wages, and the Employer can defer the employees wage immediately to the lowest possible, it keeps wages low.

In other words, companies will start employees off at a low wage, with no negotiation, and this is the state's fault.

What's the lowest level possible without a minimum wage? A few dollars an hour?

If workers are allowed to Unionize, and the state keeps its ugly hand out of the situation, employees are paid better than in places with a minimum wage...for example, Sweden, Norway, and Finland.