Should Immigrants to the USA learn English?

[Nationes Pii Redivivi]

It is wise, but not a necessity.

In areas like that, it is a necessity. What do they plan to do? Live off the wilds, and live in the woods alone with themselves, not integrating?

No, it doesn't take much English to pick an item off the counter and bring it to the cashier, hand over the money, and then go home.

[The Scientific States]

Not at all. I don't see how you got that idea from my post. I'm all for legal immigration, and I'm all for not deporting illegals, but instead giving them a pathway to citizenship, if they wish(maybe a temporary visa until they get documented), but you're correct about open borders. Open borders are bad, legal immigration is healthy for a nation.

Don't get me wrong, I feel sympathetic towards those that desperately want to come here, but I don't see why we should give special treatment to those that come here illegally by giving them a special pathway to citizenship. If you set the limit on how many foreign immigrants you can accept each year before it begins to negatively affect your economy, you have to think: for every immigrant you accept, you will be turning another one down. Either way, someone who wants to become a US citizen will be denied the chance, which is sad. So, in trying to pick the best people that you can to become citizens, why do illegal immigrants deserve any special consideration? It would only serve to encourage more illegal immigration.

Legal immigration isn't always easy. Why spend years trying to get citizenship, when you can hop a fence and come here? That's what's going through their minds, and I don't blame them. What we should do, is make legal immigration much easier, to discourage illegal immigration, and we should make sure deportations don't happen.

Most deportees try to come back illegally anyways, it'd be much smarter to just give them a temporary visa, and let them work and live here until they get documented.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Many of those innovations did, in fact, come from immigrants, or second generation immigrants.

And a lot of them changed their names to look more English, and definitely learned the English language. Lest we not forget that.

Some of them had no choice, especially if they came through Ellis Island. My husband's grandparents came from Slovakia and someone changed their last name to make it easier to write.

[Estormo]

And a lot of them changed their names to look more English, and definitely learned the English language. Lest we not forget that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sholem_Aleichem
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Bashevis_Singer

Definitely English names. Very English.

"A lot of them"...Reread my post if you must. "Polish-BORN American". These men spoke English, didn't they? Thought so.

[Norstal]

Not at all. I don't see how you got that idea from my post. I'm all for legal immigration, and I'm all for not deporting illegals, but instead giving them a pathway to citizenship, if they wish(maybe a temporary visa until they get documented), but you're correct about open borders. Open borders are bad, legal immigration is healthy for a nation.

Don't get me wrong, I feel sympathetic towards those that desperately want to come here, but I don't see why we should give special treatment to those that come here illegally by giving them a special pathway to citizenship. If you set the limit on how many foreign immigrants you can accept each year before it begins to negatively affect your economy, you have to think: for every immigrant you accept, you will be turning another one down. Either way, someone who wants to become a US citizen will be denied the chance, which is sad. So, in trying to pick the best people that you can to become citizens, why do illegal immigrants deserve any special consideration? It would only serve to encourage more illegal immigration.

Because some illegal immigrants used to be legal immigrants. One can be an illegal immigrant whilst being in the process of immigration itself. Illegal immigrants aren't always border hoppers from Mexico.

Trafficked children for instance, are illegal immigrants. Are you going to kick them out, putting them in danger, just because they're illegals? That's just silly.

[Libertarian California]

Looks at our history and our domestic innovations in literature, art, science, and music.

Nope. No culture here. Just immigrants, I tell ya!

Many of those innovations did, in fact, come from immigrants, or second generation immigrants.

Ironically, the Transcendentalist movement, which created the first distinct American literary style, was lead by people who were at least 4th generation old stock Americans.

[Lemanrussland]

Question: If compulsory English education for immigrants is authoritarian/wrong (I have not seen anyone contest the usefulness of English education), why is compulsory English education for children okay?

[Estormo]

In areas like that, it is a necessity. What do they plan to do? Live off the wilds, and live in the woods alone with themselves, not integrating?

No, it doesn't take much English to pick an item off the counter and bring it to the cashier, hand over the money, and then go home.

Reading the labels, being a social person, having friends, integrating into society, etc.

[The Scientific States]

We do have a culture. We have several. America is a melting pot, and has been for centuries. I don't think another culture being thrown into the pot is such a bad thing.

I don't think they'd be mad at those being offered, but I don't think they'd be to happy about the idea of being forced to do so.

We hardly have several. Americans are very monocultural. It's quite obvious in all of our social media, TV, news, etc.

Not everyone is going to be happy about being forced to do something. Kids don't like being forced to go to school so we should not make them? Corporations don't like paying minimum wage so we should just abolish the minimum wage? Sometimes the government has to do what's best
even if some people don't like it. There has to be a point in which the government says "enough is enough". Like Teddy Roosevelt and the 44 monopolies he broke up, and FDR with his New Deal. We can't always take the "freedom" route. You sound just as ridiculous as Austrian economics when you don't want any restrictions on these things.

Minimum wage is necessary. Requiring non English speakers to speak English is a violation of their personal freedom. I try to avoid supporting restrictions, unless it's necessary for the well being of the country and it's citizens. Just because restrictions are sometimes good, it doesn't mean they always are.

I do? Elaborate, please.

[Pilotto]

It seems to me that, since we only accept a very limited number of immigrants each year anyway, why would we want to accept those that are not willing to learn English? In order to be able to adequately function in American society, you need English. And, since there are always way more people applying for citizenship than we ever accept, we can afford to be picky. Why would we select someone that doesn't know English over someone who does?

They might have a lot of money. Or be extraordinary at something like mathematics, or a sport that doesn't require speaking English.

Well, if they have an extraordinary skill, such as any of the listed above, then I think we could wave the English requirement, since it is evident that they can be useful in numerous other ways.

[Libertarian California]

Looks at our history and our domestic innovations in literature, art, science, and music.

Nope. No culture here. Just immigrants, I tell ya!

You guys misread Nana's post. She didn't claim that our nation lacks a culture.

No, I know. But Libertaria does raise a good point about attitudes regarding American identity.

[AiliailiA]

Not compulsory. Classes should be payed for by government (which is no reason why charities can't help too).

One exception: immigrants who bring children with them or have children after arriving must ensure that the child learns either English or Spanish, or both. This is in the interests of the child. Of course that would be paid for by the government too.

[Sibirsky]

also, if an immigrant is somehow angry over getting free language and assimilation courses so that they can assimilate into the country they immigrated to then they shouldn't be here at all.

Sign up for the army. You get a free gun, free money, and free vacation time.

I don't think anyone will oppose the idea of free English classes. What everyone will oppose is that it is compulsory.

There is no such thing as free money or free vacation time. There are no free guns either. Once you leave, they take it away. Alas it was never yours. You just got to use it.

I oppose both.

[Norstal]

Question: If compulsory English education for immigrants is authoritarian/wrong (I have not seen anyone contest the usefulness of English education), why is compulsory English education for children alright?

Because children are not adults? Immigrant children have to have compulsory education, if it makes you feel better.

[Pilotto]

Question: If compulsory English education for immigrants is authoritarian/wrong (I have not seen anyone contest the usefulness of English education), why is compulsory English education for children okay?

Good point! I never thought to bring it up.

[The Scientific States]

Question: If compulsory English education for immigrants is authoritarian/wrong (I have not seen anyone contest the usefulness of English education), why is compulsory English education for children okay?

Because they need to know at least one language.

Making English compulsory for adults who are already capable of communicating with others seems silly. It's extremely helpful if they do learn English, but forcing them to do so is silly.

Also, non-English speaking immigrants, who are kids, would learn English at whatever school they go to.

[Nationes Pii Redivivi]

Many of those innovations did, in fact, come from immigrants, or second generation immigrants.

Ironically, the Transcendentalist movement, which created a distinct American literary style, was lead by people who were at least 4th generation old stock Americans.

One group of writers.

I could name, say, Shalom Aleichem, Amy Tan, Albert Einstein, etc. as immigrant or second generation immigrant writers and scientists.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Question: If compulsory English education for immigrants is authoritarian/wrong (I have not seen anyone contest the usefulness of English education), why is compulsory English education for children okay?

These children are, undoubtedly, going to be sent to school. In that case, learning English is necessary because, as far as I know, most public schools in the US teach in English.

[The Scientific States]

You guys misread Nana's post. She didn't claim that our nation lacks a culture.

No, I know. But Libertaria does raise a good point about attitudes regarding American identity.

He does, but that's not what Nana said.

Cultural Marxists do annoy me, culture is a good thing. But opposing one's culture and attempting to wipe that culture out of a country is equally annoying.

[Sibirsky]

Not at all. I don't see how you got that idea from my post. I'm all for legal immigration, and I'm all for not deporting illegals, but instead giving them a pathway to citizenship, if they wish(maybe a temporary visa until they get documented), but you're correct about open borders. Open borders are bad, legal immigration is healthy for a nation.

Don't get me wrong, I feel sympathetic towards those that desperately want to come here, but I don't see why we should give special treatment to those that come here illegally by giving them a special pathway to citizenship. If you set the limit on how many foreign immigrants you can accept each year before it begins to negatively affect your economy, you have to think: for every immigrant you accept, you will be turning another one down. Either way, someone who wants to become a US citizen will be denied the chance, which is sad. So, in trying to pick the best people that you can to become citizens, why do illegal immigrants deserve any special consideration? It would only serve to encourage more illegal immigration.

Stop lying. You do not care, and you want to condemn them to a life of poverty, misery, and cost them decades of it.

[Nationes Pii Redivivi]

No, it doesn't take much English to pick an item off the counter and bring it to the cashier, hand over the money, and then go home.

Reading the labels, being a social person, having friends, integrating into society, etc.

Again, one doesn't need English to recognise what fruit is what, or what spice it is, the next two can be supplied by his community, and the third is not necessary to be a law abiding American citizen.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Reading the labels, being a social person, having friends, integrating into society, etc.

Again, one doesn't need English to recognise what fruit is what, or what spice it is, the next two can be supplied by his community, and the third is not necessary to be a law abiding American citizen.

And in the US, most labels are also in Spanish (in the case of Hispanics).

[Norstal]

We do have a culture. We have several. America is a melting pot, and has been for centuries. I don't think another culture being thrown into the pot is such a bad thing.

I don't think they'd be mad at those being offered, but I don't think they'd be to happy about the idea of being forced to do so.

We hardly have several. Americans are very monocultural. It's quite obvious in all of our social media, TV, news, etc.

Lol you serious? I just watched anime in American television.

[Libertarian California]

Ironically, the Transcendentalist movement, which created a distinct American literary style, was lead by people who were at least 4th generation old stock Americans.

One group of writers.

I could name, say, Shalom Aleichem, Amy Tan, Albert Einstein, etc. as immigrant or second generation immigrant writers and scientists.

Aleichem and Tan did not innovate though. They can in no way be compared to the Transcendentalists in the formation of American culture.

Einstein yes, but he was part of what was largely an international effort.

[Sibirsky]

We hardly have several. Americans are very monocultural. It's quite obvious in all of our social media, TV, news, etc.

Not everyone is going to be happy about being forced to do something. Kids don't like being forced to go to school so we should not make them? Corporations don't like paying minimum wage so we should just abolish the minimum wage? Sometimes the government has to do what's best
even if some people don't like it. There has to be a point in which the government says "enough is enough". Like Teddy Roosevelt and the 44 monopolies he broke up, and FDR with his New Deal. We can't always take the "freedom" route. You sound just as ridiculous as Austrian economics when you don't want any restrictions on these things.

Minimum wage is necessary. Requiring non English speakers to speak English is a violation of their personal freedom. I try to avoid supporting restrictions, unless it's necessary for the well being of the country and it's citizens. Just because restrictions are sometimes good, it doesn't mean they always are.

I do? Elaborate, please.

Minimum wage is not necessary. It is counter productive and racist.