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Guidelines on drawing up Islamic wills issued

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Wind in the Willows
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Guidelines on drawing up Islamic wills issued

Postby Wind in the Willows » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:25 pm

No, the British Government is not enforcing Sharia Law where you will get your hands cut off for stealing, or anything like that. It is a group campaigning for the change of how Muslims will be able to manage their inheritances and wills.

Please don't come into this thread and start the racist propaganda. If you wish to debate if Islam is a racist religion, or any topic like that please take it to another thread.




Sharia principles are to become enshrined in the UK legal system for the first time, with The Law Society publishing guidelines for drawing up documents according to Islamic rules, which would exclude non-believers and encroach on women’s rights.

The new guidelines were produced by The Law Society earlier this month. Under the guidance, High Street solicitors will be able to write Islamic wills which will have the power to exclude non-believers completely and deny women an equal share of an inheritance.

“The male heirs in most cases receive double the amount inherited by a female heir of the same class. Non-Muslims may not inherit at all, and only Muslim marriages are recognized,” states the document.

Any children who have been born outside of marriage and even kids who have been adopted will also not be recognized as legitimate heirs.

It also advises lawyers to draft special exclusions from the Wills Act 1837, which would allow gifts or money to pass to the children of an heir who has died, as this practice isn’t recognized in Islamic law.

Sharia law only recognizes Muslim weddings, so anyone who was married in a Christian church or in a civil ceremony would also be excluded from succession.

At the moment, Sharia law is not formally included in the UK’s laws, though a network of unofficial Sharia courts has developed in Muslim communities to deal with issues within Muslim families.

A few are official tribunals which operate under the Arbitration Act, drafted in 1996 to help settle personal disputes within Britain’s diverse community. They mainly operate in commercial disputes, but can also deal with issues of domestic violence and other family disputes including battles over inheritance.

There is also a large network of more informal Sharia tribunals, also called “councils,” which are normally based around a mosque and deal with child custody issues and divorces in line with Islamic religious teaching. Their hearings are laid out like courts.

A study compiled four years ago by Civitas think-tank found more than 80 unofficial Sharia courts operating in the UK.

Nicholas Fluck, president of the Law Society, told The Sunday Telegraph that publishing the new guidance would promote “good practice” in applying Islamic principles in the British legal system.

“This is the first time such advice has been published and we hope it will assist solicitors with Sharia probate matters. There is a wide variety of spiritual, religious and cultural beliefs within our population, and the Law Society wants to support its members so they can help clients from all backgrounds,” he said.

However, Sadikur Rahman of the Lawyers Secular Society, said this new guidance legitimizes discrimination towards women and so-called "illegitimate children," and is contrary to the Equality Act by which UK solicitors must abide.

“This raises serious questions about professional ethics and the role of The Law Society. The guidance seems not to recognize that there is a serious potential conflict between the Code of Conduct for solicitors and the guidance,” he said.

Baroness Cox, a cross-bench peer who leads a parliamentary campaign to protect women from religious discrimination, said she thought The Law Society's publishing of the guidance was “deeply disturbing” and vowed to raise the issue with ministers.

“Everyone has freedom to make their own will and everyone has freedom to let those wills reflect their religious beliefs. But to have an organization such as The Law Society seeming to promote or encourage a policy which is inherently gender discriminatory in a way which will have very serious implications for women and possibly for children is a matter of deep concern,” she said.

http://rt.com/news/sharia-law-uk-legal-713/
Last edited by Wind in the Willows on Sun Mar 23, 2014 4:23 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Postby European Socialist Republic » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:28 pm

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Postby Wind in the Willows » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:29 pm

Last edited by Wind in the Willows on Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby The Scientific States » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:34 pm

The OP is certainly misleading.
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Postby Anglo-Saxon Wessex » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:34 pm

Thanks Cameron!

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Postby Dayaar Mongol » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:36 pm

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Postby Lordieth » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:37 pm

I was under the impression you could impose such conditions in a normal Will and Testament, surely?

Not really seeing what the fuss is about. It's their inheritances to give away. Let them stipulate as they please.
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Postby Wind in the Willows » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:37 pm

The Scientific States wrote:The OP is certainly misleading.


No, it's not.

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Postby European Socialist Republic » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:38 pm

I don't think it does what you think it does.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religio ... quiry.html

"The society denied promoting Sharia and insisted that it was simply responding to demand."

"The Law Society responded to requests from its members for guidance on how to help clients asking for wills that distribute their assets in accordance with Sharia practice.

Our practice note focuses on how to do that, where it is allowed under English law.

The Law of England and Wales will give effect to wishes clearly expressed in a valid will in so far as those wishes are compliant with the law of England."
Last edited by European Socialist Republic on Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby The Scientific States » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:39 pm

Wind in the Willows wrote:
The Scientific States wrote:The OP is certainly misleading.


No, it's not.


The OP made it seem like the UK was going to start using bits and pieces of Sharia Law.

I'm going to read the other articles. I'm deeply, deeply opposed to Sharia Law, as it's discriminatory and bigoted, so I'll look at it again.
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Postby Wind in the Willows » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:39 pm

Lordieth wrote:I was under the impression you could impose such conditions in a normal Will and Testament, surely?

Not really seeing what the fuss is about. It's their inheritances to give away. Let them stipulate as they please.


But it will increase the discrimination against non-believers and females. For example, a Muslim man could block a non-believing relative from receiving their inheritance, or block a female from receiving it as well.

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Postby Liriena » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:39 pm

European Socialist Republic wrote:I don't think it does what you think it does.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religio ... quiry.html

"The society denied promoting Sharia and insisted that it was simply responding to demand."

"The Law Society responded to requests from its members for guidance on how to help clients asking for wills that distribute their assets in accordance with Sharia practice.

Our practice note focuses on how to do that, where it is allowed under English law.

The Law of England and Wales will give effect to wishes clearly expressed in a valid will in so far as those wishes are compliant with the law of England."

Thanks, ESR. :hug:
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Postby Farnhamia » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:39 pm

Actually, Sharia is not being adopted into UK law. The Law Society of England and Wales is not a government agency. All that's happening here is that the Society has issued guidelines for drawing up wills for Muslims that follow Islamic principles. Whether those wills would be contestable under British law is another question.

And RT as your sole source is like citing Pravda during the Cold War. Not exactly "fair and balanced."
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Postby Liriena » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:40 pm

Wind in the Willows wrote:
Lordieth wrote:I was under the impression you could impose such conditions in a normal Will and Testament, surely?

Not really seeing what the fuss is about. It's their inheritances to give away. Let them stipulate as they please.


But it will increase the discrimination against non-believers and females. For example, a Muslim man could block a non-believing relative from receiving their inheritance, or block a female from receiving it as well.

I take it that Christian and atheists don't have the same authority over their inheritance under British law?
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Postby The British Stratocracy » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:40 pm

Its only for British Citizens of the Islamic faith who wish to be buried with respect. Nothing more.

As a patriot (for whatever its worth) I support the move. Brits of all shapes and sizes deserve to have their bodies treated with respect to their faiths after death.

This scary "Sharia law is upon us!" bullshit shows that the far-right can piss me off just as much as the left can. Cheers guys! :)
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Postby Roski » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:40 pm

Sharia law...


Fuck. Britian is the first to fall under the rising Muslim Empire.
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Postby Wind in the Willows » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:40 pm

Farnhamia wrote:Actually, Sharia is not being adopted into UK law. The Law Society of England and Wales is not a government agency. All that's happening here is that the Society has issued guidelines for drawing up wills for Muslims that follow Islamic principles. Whether those wills would be contestable under British law is another question.

And RT as your sole source is like citing Pravda during the Cold War. Not exactly "fair and balanced."


I have posted other sources too. :palm:

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Postby European Socialist Republic » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:41 pm

Liriena wrote:
European Socialist Republic wrote:I don't think it does what you think it does.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religio ... quiry.html

"The society denied promoting Sharia and insisted that it was simply responding to demand."

"The Law Society responded to requests from its members for guidance on how to help clients asking for wills that distribute their assets in accordance with Sharia practice.

Our practice note focuses on how to do that, where it is allowed under English law.

The Law of England and Wales will give effect to wishes clearly expressed in a valid will in so far as those wishes are compliant with the law of England."

Thanks, ESR. :hug:

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Postby Dayaar Mongol » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:41 pm

Farnhamia wrote:Actually, Sharia is not being adopted into UK law. The Law Society of England and Wales is not a government agency. All that's happening here is that the Society has issued guidelines for drawing up wills for Muslims that follow Islamic principles. Whether those wills would be contestable under British law is another question.

And RT as your sole source is like citing Pravda during the Cold War. Not exactly "fair and balanced."


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Postby The Scientific States » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:41 pm

Roski wrote:Sharia law...


Fuck. Britian is the first to fall under the rising Muslim Empire.


Someone didn't read the OP.

Do you honestly think that Britain would adapt Sharia Law? No, read the articles.
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Postby Farnhamia » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:41 pm

Wind in the Willows wrote:
Lordieth wrote:I was under the impression you could impose such conditions in a normal Will and Testament, surely?

Not really seeing what the fuss is about. It's their inheritances to give away. Let them stipulate as they please.


But it will increase the discrimination against non-believers and females. For example, a Muslim man could block a non-believing relative from receiving their inheritance, or block a female from receiving it as well.

I daresay that's possible now. All it requires is not leaving those people anything. I'm not required to leave anything to anyone in my will.
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Postby European Socialist Republic » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:42 pm

Farnhamia wrote:Actually, Sharia is not being adopted into UK law. The Law Society of England and Wales is not a government agency. All that's happening here is that the Society has issued guidelines for drawing up wills for Muslims that follow Islamic principles. Whether those wills would be contestable under British law is another question.

According to the Law Society, it's allowed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religio ... quiry.html

"The Law Society responded to requests from its members for guidance on how to help clients asking for wills that distribute their assets in accordance with Sharia practice. Our practice note focuses on how to do that, where it is allowed under English law."
Last edited by European Socialist Republic on Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Auxatia » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:42 pm

It has no place there. Britain for the British.

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Lordieth
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Postby Lordieth » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:42 pm

Wind in the Willows wrote:
Lordieth wrote:I was under the impression you could impose such conditions in a normal Will and Testament, surely?

Not really seeing what the fuss is about. It's their inheritances to give away. Let them stipulate as they please.


But it will increase the discrimination against non-believers and females. For example, a Muslim man could block a non-believing relative from receiving their inheritance, or block a female from receiving it as well.


This seems pretty in-line with some Islamic cultural behaviours. Again, it's their inheritance to give away. I don't have to like it, but it's theirs. They can be as sexist or discriminatory as they please. I'm honestly not surprised by this, and nor am I particularly indignant.
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Postby Tahar Joblis » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:42 pm

The Telegraph wrote:The guidance, quietly published this month and distributed to solicitors in England and Wales, details how wills should be drafted to fit Islamic traditions while being valid under British law.

So what they're saying is that someone's giving advice on how to write an Islamic will that won't get thrown out in British courts.

I mean, there's sort of a principle of property rights that lets people dispose of their property as they see fit for whatever silly reasons they may have. That doesn't seem at all odd.

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