The Republican Path To Victory II

[Gauthier]

And that's where you stumble at analogy, because the United States did not directly depose Qaddafi. At all. The Libyans did that pretty much on their own.

Except, you know, they would of lost had it not been for US air support.

And how exactly is establishing a No Flight Zone the same as sending troops in?

[Yumyumsuppertime]

I don't think that its too much to say "what have they done for me lately" when they have done nothing for African americans since they helped to pass the civil rights legislation of the 60s.

But than again, what the Democrtats did for the African-Americans? Looking at history the GOP has a little bit more credit for civil rights than the Democrats. But than again, everybody is critizing the GOP and not the Democrats, it is not fair.

Okay. Let's just look at, say, the past 30 years. That's well over a generation. What has the GOP done for minorities in that period of time?

[Gauthier]

I don't think that its too much to say "what have they done for me lately" when they have done nothing for African americans since they helped to pass the civil rights legislation of the 60s.

But than again, what the Democrtats did for the African-Americans? Looking at history the GOP has a little bit more credit for civil rights than the Democrats. But than again, everybody is critizing the GOP and not the Democrats, it is not fair.

Because nothing says doing more for African Americans than consistently trying to pass voter registration laws that disproportionately disenfranchised poor minorities even before the Supreme Court castrated the Voting Rights Act and the Republican House is cockblocking the necessary legislations to uncastrate it.

[Viritica]

A. They're welcome to their own interpretations of things.

This was not a matter of an interpretation of the truth. This was a direct, and intentional misrepresentation of basic facts. In other words, a lie. "You are entitled to your own opinion. You are not entitled to your own facts." -Sen. Daniel Moynihan.

B. Which I find to be better than the baby pictures other networks were showing to try and make him look like a sweet and innocent child.

You think that intentionally darkening and blurring a picture in order to make him look more intimidating is ethical journalistic practice?

C. Both the Fox chart and the MMFA chart are using distorted information.

That's...that's not just distorted information. That is a basic mathematical impossibility.

D. That's the fault of Rasmussen. Not them. Though they probably should of reviewed that poll.

No. If you'd bothered to read the article, you would have seen that Fox admitted to intentionally doing that, and claimed that it was proper to do so, since they never outright said that it would add up to 100%. Seriously, if you're going to blatantly and dishonestly shill on behalf of them, at least make sure that you're telling the same story.

E. Relatively minor fuck ups. Though they do need to correct themselves.

How many minor fuck-ups do they need to make, all of which portray conservatives and conservative causes in a favorable light (and liberals and liberal causes in a negative one) before you begin to think that there might just be an intentional pattern of deceit?

Don't bother answering that. You've already shown that there is no length of tortured reasoning that you won't go to on their behalf, no lie that you won't repeat for them, no gnat that you won't strain at while swallowing a camel.

Let me just sum this up all nice and sweet for you: they're open to their own interpretation of things. What they do is simply portray the truth in a light that makes conservatives appear better. You can post as many useless quotes and sayings as you want but it makes no difference. Every news source is biased, like it or not. I don't condone everything that Fox has done but every network has had its fuck ups and every news source has made mistakes. Fox News is weeded out simply because it's one of the few conservative news sources out there. This is something you can't deny.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

This was not a matter of an interpretation of the truth. This was a direct, and intentional misrepresentation of basic facts. In other words, a lie. "You are entitled to your own opinion. You are not entitled to your own facts." -Sen. Daniel Moynihan.



You think that intentionally darkening and blurring a picture in order to make him look more intimidating is ethical journalistic practice?



That's...that's not just distorted information. That is a basic mathematical impossibility.



No. If you'd bothered to read the article, you would have seen that Fox admitted to intentionally doing that, and claimed that it was proper to do so, since they never outright said that it would add up to 100%. Seriously, if you're going to blatantly and dishonestly shill on behalf of them, at least make sure that you're telling the same story.



How many minor fuck-ups do they need to make, all of which portray conservatives and conservative causes in a favorable light (and liberals and liberal causes in a negative one) before you begin to think that there might just be an intentional pattern of deceit?

Don't bother answering that. You've already shown that there is no length of tortured reasoning that you won't go to on their behalf, no lie that you won't repeat for them, no gnat that you won't strain at while swallowing a camel.

Let me just sum this up all nice and sweet for you: they're open to their own interpretation of things. What they do is simply portray the truth in a light that makes conservatives appear better. You can post as many useless quotes and sayings as you want but it makes no difference. Every news source is biased, like it or not. I don't condone everything that Fox has done but every network has had its fuck ups and every news source has made mistakes. Fox News is weeded out simply because it's one of the few conservative news sources out there. This is something you can't deny.

So in other words, it's okay because everyone does it.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque

[Spartan Philidelphia]

I don't think that its too much to say "what have they done for me lately" when they have done nothing for African americans since they helped to pass the civil rights legislation of the 60s.

But than again, what the Democrtats did for the African-Americans? Looking at history the GOP has a little bit more credit for civil rights than the Democrats. But than again, everybody is critizing the GOP and not the Democrats, it is not fair.

The Republican and Democratic parties are empty labels. The people within those parties and their core ideologies have changed considerably over the generations.

[Saiwania]

Okay. Let's just look at, say, the past 30 years. That's well over a generation. What has the GOP done for minorities in that period of time?

*Puts on best Sean Hannity voice* "We have great men such as Herman Cain, Allen West, Clarence Thomas, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Alan Keyes. We also have great thinkers such as Thomas Sowell, honestly- we're at a loss for why we're doing so poorly, you would think they'd realise that the past 8 years of this administration has been absolutely dreadful and grow tired of it."

[Viritica]

Let me just sum this up all nice and sweet for you: they're open to their own interpretation of things. What they do is simply portray the truth in a light that makes conservatives appear better. You can post as many useless quotes and sayings as you want but it makes no difference. Every news source is biased, like it or not. I don't condone everything that Fox has done but every network has had its fuck ups and every news source has made mistakes. Fox News is weeded out simply because it's one of the few conservative news sources out there. This is something you can't deny.

So in other words, it's okay because everyone does it.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque

I do so hate it when people put words in my mouth. No. I never said it was okay.

[Gauthier]

Okay. Let's just look at, say, the past 30 years. That's well over a generation. What has the GOP done for minorities in that period of time?

*Puts on best Sean Hannity voice* "We have great men such as Herman Cain, Allen West, Clarence Thomas, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Alan Keyes. We also have great thinkers such as Thomas Sowell, honestly- we're at a loss for why we're doing so poorly, you would think they'd realise that the past 8 years of this administration has been absolutely dreadful and grow tired of it."

Only you would think tokenism was a major achievement for civil rights.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Okay. Let's just look at, say, the past 30 years. That's well over a generation. What has the GOP done for minorities in that period of time?

*Puts on best Sean Hannity voice* "We have great men such as Herman Cain, Allen West, Clarence Thomas, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Alan Keyes. We also have great thinkers such as Thomas Sowell, honestly- we're at a loss for why we're doing so poorly, you would think they'd realise that the past 8 years of this administration has been absolutely dreadful and grow tired of it."

Right.

"We have minority members."

That's what's been done for minority groups as a whole. Certain people of color have achieved positions of prominence in the party. Why, I'm surprised that they're not knocking down the doors at GOP headquarters in order to sign up.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

So in other words, it's okay because everyone does it.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque

I do so hate it when people put words in my mouth. No. I never said it was okay.

Really? Because without your fallacious argument, you have no argument whatsoever.

See, other news outlets make mistakes. Hell, a couple have even outright manipulated the news, which has led to resignations and/or public apologies when they've been called out on it.

The difference with Fox is that this is an actual pattern of behavior, and when they're called out on it, they don't apologize, or if they do, it's buried in a quick aside between Obama-bashing stories and editorial comments (which are notably difficult to tell apart). Nobody is forced to face any sort of consequences for these shenanigans. Instead, they repeat the same behavior time and again without shame, continue to tell their lies, and pretend that it's actual journalism of the same sort that Murrow and his ilk practiced.

[Gauthier]

I do so hate it when people put words in my mouth. No. I never said it was okay.

Really? Because without your fallacious argument, you have no argument whatsoever.

See, other news outlets make mistakes. Hell, a couple have even outright manipulated the news, which has led to resignations and/or public apologies when they've been called out on it.

The difference with Fox is that this is an actual pattern of behavior, and when they're called out on it, they don't apologize, or if they do, it's buried in a quick aside between Obama-bashing stories and editorial comments (which are notably difficult to tell apart). Nobody is forced to face any sort of consequences for these shenanigans. Instead, they repeat the same behavior time and again without shame, continue to tell their lies, and pretend that it's actual journalism of the same sort that Murrow and his ilk practiced.

Nobody on FOXNews was ever let go for getting caught lying.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Really? Because without your fallacious argument, you have no argument whatsoever.

See, other news outlets make mistakes. Hell, a couple have even outright manipulated the news, which has led to resignations and/or public apologies when they've been called out on it.

The difference with Fox is that this is an actual pattern of behavior, and when they're called out on it, they don't apologize, or if they do, it's buried in a quick aside between Obama-bashing stories and editorial comments (which are notably difficult to tell apart). Nobody is forced to face any sort of consequences for these shenanigans. Instead, they repeat the same behavior time and again without shame, continue to tell their lies, and pretend that it's actual journalism of the same sort that Murrow and his ilk practiced.

Nobody on FOXNews was ever let go for getting caught lying.

Yes, that's essentially my point.

[European Socialist Republic]

*Puts on best Sean Hannity voice* "We have great men such as Herman Cain, Allen West, Clarence Thomas, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Alan Keyes. We also have great thinkers such as Thomas Sowell, honestly- we're at a loss for why we're doing so poorly, you would think they'd realise that the past 8 years of this administration has been absolutely dreadful and grow tired of it."

Right.

"We have minority members."

That's what's been done for minority groups as a whole. Certain people of color have achieved positions of prominence in the party. Why, I'm surprised that they're not knocking down the doors at GOP headquarters in order to sign up.

So am I. I don't understand it at all. Must be because of the Democrats and their vicious lieberal propaganda! Yup, that's probably it. Now I'm going to continue yelling why Obama is a Muslim Marxist from Kenya and how George Soros and the UN are planning to enslave us all.

[European Socialist Republic]

Nobody on FOXNews was ever let go for getting caught lying.

Yes, that's essentially my point.

But that's only proof that they don't lie! Yup, it is.

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

Is there any chances that gerrymandering ends anytime soon?

Fox News is incredibly biased. But at least they have some liberals on their channel. MSNBC, on the other hand, is nothing but a perpetual liberal circle-jerk.

I do not see why the Leftists in the United States cry of bias when every other news channel has a liberal bias. It's intriguing, but kind've pathetic actually.

Because in an American context, liberal bias tends to be synonym with truth.

[The Black Forrest]

So in other words, it's okay because everyone does it.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque

I do so hate it when people put words in my mouth. No. I never said it was okay.

Then why bring it up?

The integrity of Fox News is being discussed and invariably "Well you KNOW MSNBC...." gets dragged out or it's lessor cousin "bias in the liberal media"

Even when considering MSNBC; they don't call themselves "fair and balanced"

Again are you assuming Fox News detractors simply watch MSNBC?

[Pilotto]

Is there any chances that gerrymandering ends anytime soon?

I do not see why the Leftists in the United States cry of bias when every other news channel has a liberal bias. It's intriguing, but kind've pathetic actually.

Because in an American context, liberal bias tends to be synonym with truth.

You have a very strange idea of the "truth", my friend.

I do so hate it when people put words in my mouth. No. I never said it was okay.

Then why bring it up?

The integrity of Fox News is being discussed and invariably "Well you KNOW MSNBC...." gets dragged out or it's lessor cousin "bias in the liberal media"

Even when considering MSNBC; they don't call themselves "fair and balanced"

Again are you assuming Fox News detractors simply watch MSNBC?

The point is that liberals constantly bring up Fox New's conservative bias, and seem unaware that the rest of the media (MSNBC being the most glaring example) has an extreme liberal bias. It is highly annoying to hear people only criticize bias when they disagree with it.

[Edlichbury]

Is there any chances that gerrymandering ends anytime soon?


Because in an American context, liberal bias tends to be synonym with truth.

You have a very strange idea of the "truth", my friend.

Then why bring it up?

The integrity of Fox News is being discussed and invariably "Well you KNOW MSNBC...." gets dragged out or it's lessor cousin "bias in the liberal media"

Even when considering MSNBC; they don't call themselves "fair and balanced"

Again are you assuming Fox News detractors simply watch MSNBC?

The point is that liberals constantly bring up Fox New's conservative bias, and seem unaware that the rest of the media (MSNBC being the most glaring example) has an extreme liberal bias. It is highly annoying to hear people only criticize bias when they disagree with it.

Tell me, did MSNBC ever claim 9% is lower than 8.5% to claim unemployment went up in a certain period when it didn't?
Did MSNBC ever run a poll and refuse to publish the results because they didn't line up with official party line?
Did MSNBC ever demand that all Democratic Presidential debates be only hosted by MSNBC?
Everything has a bias. Some biases just happen to mesh with the truth. That cannot be said for FOX and the insistence that the other media is just out to destroy Republicans is a massive part of the Republican's issue. Overwhelmingly, the best way to have consistently high approval ratings is constant interaction with a wide variety of news sources. By deciding to ignore all others, you sign your party's death warrant.

[Edlichbury]

really?

isn't their economic message "cut taxes for the rich and fuck everyone else with austerity"?

You are confusing Neo-cons with the entire GOP. The more libertarian-leaning Republicans like Ron/Rand/Cruz want to cut taxes across the board.

Despite that doing so would either require more debt (against party line), cuts to the military (against party line) or broad social cuts (electoral suicide). Cruz and Rand have completely unworkable budget plans, as nearly every budget office would report.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

You have a very strange idea of the "truth", my friend.


The point is that liberals constantly bring up Fox New's conservative bias, and seem unaware that the rest of the media (MSNBC being the most glaring example) has an extreme liberal bias. It is highly annoying to hear people only criticize bias when they disagree with it.

Tell me, did MSNBC ever claim 9% is lower than 8.5% to claim unemployment went up in a certain period when it didn't?
Did MSNBC ever run a poll and refuse to publish the results because they didn't line up with official party line?
Did MSNBC ever demand that all Democratic Presidential debates be only hosted by MSNBC?
Everything has a bias. Some biases just happen to mesh with the truth. That cannot be said for FOX and the insistence that the other media is just out to destroy Republicans is a massive part of the Republican's issue. Overwhelmingly, the best way to have consistently high approval ratings is constant interaction with a wide variety of news sources. By deciding to ignore all others, you sign your party's death warrant.

Let's not forget another question: Did the President of MSNBC ever actively attempt to recruit someone to run for the Democratic nomination?

[European Socialist Republic]

Is there any chances that gerrymandering ends anytime soon?


Because in an American context, liberal bias tends to be synonym with truth.

You have a very strange idea of the "truth", my friend.

Then why bring it up?

The integrity of Fox News is being discussed and invariably "Well you KNOW MSNBC...." gets dragged out or it's lessor cousin "bias in the liberal media"

Even when considering MSNBC; they don't call themselves "fair and balanced"

Again are you assuming Fox News detractors simply watch MSNBC?

The point is that liberals constantly bring up Fox New's conservative bias, and seem unaware that the rest of the media (MSNBC being the most glaring example) has an extreme liberal bias. It is highly annoying to hear people only criticize bias when they disagree with it.

So liberal that Obama received more negative than positive coverage.
http://www.journalism.org/2012/11/02/wi ... aign-2012/
Oh, you might complain that "Romney got more bad coverage!" but if the American media is sooo liberal, why would they give Obama more negative than positive coverage?

More numbers:
http://election2012.4thestate.net/elect ... usa-today/
http://election2012.4thestate.net/negat ... t-outlets/
http://specialreports.4thestate.net/lib ... r-fiction/

[The Black Forrest]

Then why bring it up?

The integrity of Fox News is being discussed and invariably "Well you KNOW MSNBC...." gets dragged out or it's lessor cousin "bias in the liberal media"

Even when considering MSNBC; they don't call themselves "fair and balanced"

Again are you assuming Fox News detractors simply watch MSNBC?

The point is that liberals constantly bring up Fox New's conservative bias, and seem unaware that the rest of the media (MSNBC being the most glaring example) has an extreme liberal bias. It is highly annoying to hear people only criticize bias when they disagree with it.[/quote]

And again, the discussion is about integrity of Fox. MSNBC is irrelevant or at best a deflection.

You would have an argument if somebody was saying MSNBC is better.

Again; are you assuming the fox detractors watch MSNBC?

[Silent Majority]

We also have great thinkers such as Thomas Sowell

"Great thinkers" and Thomas Sowell do not belong in the same sentence

[Mike the Progressive]

We also have great thinkers such as Thomas Sowell

"Great thinkers" and Thomas Sowell do not belong in the same sentence

Well I'm sure he thinks a great deal.