Does America need a bit of Socialism

[Galloism]

No, people can only purchase what they can afford. They cannot freely choose who they purchase on because they can't afford that luxury. Many have to work multiple jobs to barely afford to spend their entire paycheck at WalMart.

Bullshit. All monopolies are coercive by definition.

Name a single private sector monopoly that forced you to patronize their establishment against your will .

Wal-Mart.

[WRIF Army]

Then you'd stop worshiping the free market and acknowledge that starvation is an omnipresent issue that the free market doesn't magically solve.

Even better, it's a direct consequence of that free market.

There is no rational argument that says starvation is caused by allowing people the freedom to use their talents to address economic scarcity without coercion. Starvation occurs when govt thugs distort markets.

[Cyyro]

The primary places were starvation occurs in socialist command economies mismanaged by coercive govt managers, see China, N. Korea, Cambodia......
In contrast, you are never going to have starvation in more free market oriented societies like Singapore, Hong Kong.... despite the fact that these nations have precious few food resources.

So you are both showing that you still don't know what socialism is and that you are prepared to deny the reality of starvation in capitalist countries. Does the third world not exist anymore?

I wouldn't blame third world starvation on capitalism...

[Galloism]

Even better, it's a direct consequence of that free market.

There is no rational argument that says starvation is caused by allowing people the freedom to use their talents to address economic scarcity without coercion.

It's like you've never heard of a person becoming disabled.

Or the economy taking a shit, ever.

[WRIF Army]

Name a single private sector monopoly that forced you to patronize their establishment against your will .

Wal-Mart.

I would be amused to hear how WalMart's jackbooted thugs forced you to buy something in their store.

[Divair]

Even better, it's a direct consequence of that free market.

There is no rational argument that says starvation is caused by allowing people the freedom to use their talents to address economic scarcity without coercion. Starvation occurs when govt thugs distort markets.

You've yet to present any evidence starvation would be magically solved by the free market.

You've yet to present any evidence at all, really.

[Threlizdun]

So you'll just ignore the poor, I take it?

I don't ignore the poor, I offer charity and a hand-up to those that need it. In contrast, govt exploits the poor to serve itself. Govt uses the plight of the poor as an excuse to plunder more wealth, all the while the poor (conveniently) remain poor while govt claims it needs ever more money to 'solve' the problem.

Charity has existed about as long as humanity has. There has never been a time in which poverty has ceased to be an issue since the development of city-states. If you believe charity will somehow be enough to fix the problem then you are lying to yourself.

It is noteworthy that socialists tell everyone that money is needed to help the poor, yet they never give their own, they always require (demand at gun point) that other people contribute.

I suppose you can prove that no socialist has ever at any point in history given their own money to others or kindly asked for people to assist others?

If socialists learned to love the poor more than they envy the rich, we might make a dent in govt created poverty.

I don't envy the rich, I pity them

[Galloism]

Wal-Mart.

I would be amused to hear how WalMart's jackbooted thugs forced you to buy something in their store.

By intentionally losing money until all other stores in the area had closed in expectation of future profits.

Fuck, the store manager flat out admitted that's exactly what they'd done. That's not illegal.


Now it's shop at Wal-Mart, or go without clothes. Going without clothes is not an option when you drive a school bus.

[WRIF Army]

There is no rational argument that says starvation is caused by allowing people the freedom to use their talents to address economic scarcity without coercion. Starvation occurs when govt thugs distort markets.

You've yet to present any evidence starvation would be magically solved by the free market.

You've yet to present any evidence at all, really.

China instituted modest free market reforms in agriculture in the 1990's and almost instantly the decades long threat of starvation ended. Same in India.

[The Empire of Pretantia]

Starvation occurs when govt thugs distort markets.

Or maybe it occurs when people can no longer get food to eat. Maybe there was a drought. Maybe an import-dependent country couldn't get foodstuffs any more. It's not always the government's fault.

[Galloism]

The primary places were starvation occurs in socialist command economies mismanaged by coercive govt managers, see China, N. Korea, Cambodia......
In contrast, you are never going to have starvation in more free market oriented societies like Singapore, Hong Kong.... despite the fact that these nations have precious few food resources.

Did you really just pick Hong Kong? Hong Kong, with its free public school system, 50 publicly run hospitals, social security assistance for the low income, disability system, minimum wage, and compulsory savings fund for retirement?

That Hong Kong?

Missed this.

[European Socialist Republic]

You've yet to present any evidence starvation would be magically solved by the free market.

You've yet to present any evidence at all, really.

China instituted modest free market reforms in agriculture in the 1990's and almost instantly the decades long threat of starvation ended. Same in India.

Sources, people, sources!

[Divair]

You've yet to present any evidence starvation would be magically solved by the free market.

You've yet to present any evidence at all, really.

China instituted modest free market reforms in agriculture in the 1990's and almost instantly the decades long threat of starvation ended. Same in India.

Starvation has not been eliminated in either country. Try again.

[Divair]

Did you really just pick Hong Kong? Hong Kong, with its free public school system, 50 publicly run hospitals, social security assistance for the low income, disability system, minimum wage, and compulsory savings fund for retirement?

That Hong Kong?

Missed this.

He ignores most arguments. Hasn't addressed anything about social contracts or commune vs nation yet.

[Galloism]

China instituted modest free market reforms in agriculture in the 1990's and almost instantly the decades long threat of starvation ended. Same in India.

Starvation has not been eliminated in either country. Try again.

We haven't even eliminated starvation here.

[WRIF Army]

I would be amused to hear how WalMart's jackbooted thugs forced you to buy something in their store.

By intentionally losing money until all other stores in the area had closed in expectation of future profits.

Fuck, the store manager flat out admitted that's exactly what they'd done. That's not illegal.

I'll will ask you for the second time, did WalMart force you to commit the heinous act of making you buy goods at below market prices ?

Did they cuff you or beat you over the head to get you in the store and later force your wallet open at gun point ?

[European Socialist Republic]

Socialism is theft, it is perpetrated by a larger mob against a smaller mob at gun point.

Socialism requires govt coercion because nobody would subscribe to its unfair and inefficient schemes under non-coercive conditions. As proof, if socialism really benefited society, why must force be used to implement it ?

I don't think you understand what workplace democracy means...

[Soldati Senza Confini]

An important fact that socialists fail to realize is that consumers have free choice, they are not compelled by force to do anything by Standard, WalMart, Starbucks..... Also they are free to compete at the drop of a hat. It is wrong to assert that in today's nimble economy that a start up firm can't materialize in months, if not weeks, when we have entire industries created in a few years that didn't existed before.

The only coercive monopoly is govt. (and it is the biggest with all the big guns) that is the salient fact that socialists can never rationally deny.

Congratulations in showing you lack the most basic knowledge of entrepreneurship or business.

Any service business takes at least several months into coming to be; manufacturing can take years. You also need capital, real estate, equipment, all of which is not possible to have at the drop of a hat.

You can't be serious in stating that anyone can open their own business as they wish. Even in Texas it takes several months/years of planning and building proper capital before trying to open up any sort of company legally (which includes having a DBA).

[Divair]

Starvation has not been eliminated in either country. Try again.

We haven't even eliminated starvation here.

Or anywhere. Starvation is omnipresent in all nations of all political ideologies. Though I wouldn't be surprised if the Nordic countries came closest to eliminating it.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

By intentionally losing money until all other stores in the area had closed in expectation of future profits.

Fuck, the store manager flat out admitted that's exactly what they'd done. That's not illegal.

I'll will ask you for the second time, did WalMart force you to commit the heinous act of making you buy goods at below market prices ?

Did they cuff you or beat you over the head to get you in the store and later force your wallet open at gun point ?

When has government done this?

[Threlizdun]

Even better, it's a direct consequence of that free market.

There is no rational argument that says starvation is caused by allowing people the freedom to use their talents to address economic scarcity without coercion. Starvation occurs when govt thugs distort markets.

Fucking Africa. Do I have to keep saying this?

So you are both showing that you still don't know what socialism is and that you are prepared to deny the reality of starvation in capitalist countries. Does the third world not exist anymore?

I wouldn't blame third world starvation on capitalism...

It's impossible not to connect the two. The means of production in third world countries are owned by foreign capitalists while the populace suffers from inequatable distribution measures.

Wal-Mart.

I would be amused to hear how WalMart's jackbooted thugs forced you to buy something in their store.

What part of "that is literally all the poor can afford" can't you understand?

[The Empire of Pretantia]

By intentionally losing money until all other stores in the area had closed in expectation of future profits.

Fuck, the store manager flat out admitted that's exactly what they'd done. That's not illegal.

I'll will ask you for the second time, did WalMart force you to commit the heinous act of making you buy goods at below market prices ?

Did they cuff you or beat you over the head to get you in the store and later force your wallet open at gun point ?

Is direct violence the sole means of coercion? Or is having to buy from them because all other businesses are on the other side of the county just as good?

[WRIF Army]

Missed this.

He ignores most arguments. Hasn't addressed anything about social contracts or commune vs nation yet.

I will research your assertions, nonetheless Hong Kong has a freer economy than the USA. Without govt. run institutions (except law and defense) they would do better.

[Galloism]

By intentionally losing money until all other stores in the area had closed in expectation of future profits.

Fuck, the store manager flat out admitted that's exactly what they'd done. That's not illegal.

I'll will ask you for the second time, did WalMart force you to commit the heinous act of making you buy goods at below market prices ?

Did they cuff you or beat you over the head to get you in the store and later force your wallet open at gun point ?

No, but then again I don't patronize Wal-Mart because of their slave-labor wages and poor treatment of employees - unless I have to.

However, enough people did that now I have no choice but to buy at extortion prices or go without clothes. Unless you want me to give up my job and stay home, then die of starvation (because you're against government assistance), I need clothes. There's only one place to buy them.

Is that not coercion?

[Divair]

Without govt. run institutions (except law and defense) they would do better.

Source.