LGBT Rights & Issues Thread

[Aequalitia]

I say that is easy to change a law but is difficult to change social mentality. This is not the end of the road of course

Things are definitely improving, though.

In the US, >70% of people under 30 are in favor of LGBT rights.

Because the society in the US is a lot improving in their altitudes towards LGBT people and rights.

[Flaming Soul Forces]

I say that is easy to change a law but is difficult to change social mentality. This is not the end of the road of course

Things are definitely improving, though.

In the US, >70% of people under 30 are in favor of LGBT rights.

Yes they do, thankfully. Even in Cyprus

[Othelos]

Things are definitely improving, though.

In the US, >70% of people under 30 are in favor of LGBT rights.

Because the society in the US is a lot improving in their altitudes towards LGBT people and rights.

Yeah, exactly. But especially among younger people and more liberal areas (northeast and west coast).

Things are definitely improving, though.

In the US, >70% of people under 30 are in favor of LGBT rights.

Yes they do, thankfully. Even in Cyprus

Improvements everywhere are a good thing.

[Oneracon]

YES! ^_^

To be honest I was shocked
Malta is such a conservative country that until recently they didn't have divorce
A great leap forward:-)

Hey now, be nice... that's the land of my heritage!

But seriously, it's fantastic news that Malta is modernizing at a faster rate. I'm really glad that the new president explicitly clarified before the vote took place in Parliament that she would not use her powers to veto the bill.

EDIT: Also of note was a second bill passed the same day that amended the Maltese Constitution to explicitly include sexual orientation and gender identity in the non-discrimination guarantees.

[Valica]

I say that is easy to change a law but is difficult to change social mentality. This is not the end of the road of course

Things are definitely improving, though.

In the US, >70% of people under 30 are in favor of LGBT rights.

So it's the older fundamentalists that are holding back the passing of laws right now?
God damn it.

[Flaming Soul Forces]

To be honest I was shocked
Malta is such a conservative country that until recently they didn't have divorce
A great leap forward:-)

Hey now, be nice... that's the land of my heritage!

But seriously, it's fantastic news that Malta is modernizing at a faster rate. I'm really glad that the new president explicitly clarified before the vote took place in Parliament that she would not use her powers to veto the bill.

EDIT: Also of note was a second bill passed the same day that amended the Maltese Constitution to explicitly include sexual orientation and gender identity in the non-discrimination guarantees.

I wasn't trying to offend Malta, I was just saying that is conservative like Cyprus

[Othelos]

Things are definitely improving, though.

In the US, >70% of people under 30 are in favor of LGBT rights.

So it's the older fundamentalists that are holding back the passing of laws right now?
God damn it.

Yeah. Only 48% of baby boomers and 38% of people older than them support same sex marriage.

From the same data set, it states that 68% of Millennials (people born after 1980) support SSM. And liberals outnumber conservatives two to one in the group of people who aren't part of a religion.

[Aequalitia]

To be honest I was shocked
Malta is such a conservative country that until recently they didn't have divorce
A great leap forward:-)

Hey now, be nice... that's the land of my heritage!

But seriously, it's fantastic news that Malta is modernizing at a faster rate. I'm really glad that the new president explicitly clarified before the vote took place in Parliament that she would not use her powers to veto the bill.

EDIT: Also of note was a second bill passed the same day that amended the Maltese Constitution to explicitly include sexual orientation and gender identity in the non-discrimination guarantees.

Be I serious one of the few here who expect that in fact nothing really would be improving in Malta?

Don't understand my wrong, I support all equal laws, but put this laws in a conservative country is risky, not really risky that the government would become unstable or something, but risky because this can be the trigger for more bigoty.

Why their not starting with dismantle bigoty first before putting this equal law?

[Geilinor]

Hey now, be nice... that's the land of my heritage!

But seriously, it's fantastic news that Malta is modernizing at a faster rate. I'm really glad that the new president explicitly clarified before the vote took place in Parliament that she would not use her powers to veto the bill.

EDIT: Also of note was a second bill passed the same day that amended the Maltese Constitution to explicitly include sexual orientation and gender identity in the non-discrimination guarantees.

Be I serious one of the few here who expect that in fact nothing really would be improving in Malta?

Don't understand my wrong, I support all equal laws, but put this laws in a conservative country is risky, not really risky that the government would become unstable or something, but risky because this can be the trigger for more bigoty.

Why their not starting with dismantle bigoty first before putting this equal law?

"Bigotry still exists" isn't a reason to block equality. Bigots will quiet down when they see that their lives continue as normal after this law.

[Aequalitia]

Be I serious one of the few here who expect that in fact nothing really would be improving in Malta?

Don't understand my wrong, I support all equal laws, but put this laws in a conservative country is risky, not really risky that the government would become unstable or something, but risky because this can be the trigger for more bigoty.

Why their not starting with dismantle bigoty first before putting this equal law?

"Bigotry still exists" isn't a reason to block equality. Bigots will quiet down when they see that their lives continue as normal after this law.

Oh you totally kidding that last. If laws does wonders, then this whole country would be totally a LGBT heaven.

You don't starting also with a solution directly if you get a big problem? First you need to work out the problem, then the solution.

[Oneracon]

Hey now, be nice... that's the land of my heritage!

But seriously, it's fantastic news that Malta is modernizing at a faster rate. I'm really glad that the new president explicitly clarified before the vote took place in Parliament that she would not use her powers to veto the bill.

EDIT: Also of note was a second bill passed the same day that amended the Maltese Constitution to explicitly include sexual orientation and gender identity in the non-discrimination guarantees.

I wasn't trying to offend Malta, I was just saying that is conservative like Cyprus

I know, I was trying to be funny

But I mean it was really interesting that signing these bills into law was one of the first things the newly elected President (who also happens to be my second cousin) did.

[Oneracon]

Hey now, be nice... that's the land of my heritage!

But seriously, it's fantastic news that Malta is modernizing at a faster rate. I'm really glad that the new president explicitly clarified before the vote took place in Parliament that she would not use her powers to veto the bill.

EDIT: Also of note was a second bill passed the same day that amended the Maltese Constitution to explicitly include sexual orientation and gender identity in the non-discrimination guarantees.

Be I serious one of the few here who expect that in fact nothing really would be improving in Malta?

Don't understand my wrong, I support all equal laws, but put this laws in a conservative country is risky, not really risky that the government would become unstable or something, but risky because this can be the trigger for more bigoty.

Why their not starting with dismantle bigoty first before putting this equal law?

Looking at Maltese public opinion, there is no massive backlash against the recognition of same-sex couples by the government. The only part of the law that caused any debate (and resulted in the opposition Nationalist Party abstaining en masse) was the provision that granted same-sex couples the right to adopt children as a couple.

To quote the Maltese government spokesman who made the announcement on Twitter: "We could have chosen comfort zone, but we challenged prejudice"

[Aequalitia]

Be I serious one of the few here who expect that in fact nothing really would be improving in Malta?

Don't understand my wrong, I support all equal laws, but put this laws in a conservative country is risky, not really risky that the government would become unstable or something, but risky because this can be the trigger for more bigoty.

Why their not starting with dismantle bigoty first before putting this equal law?

Looking at Maltese public opinion, there is no massive backlash against the recognition of same-sex couples by the government. The only part of the law that caused any debate (and resulted in the opposition Nationalist Party abstaining en masse) was the provision that granted same-sex couples the right to adopt children as a couple.

To quote the Maltese government spokesman who made the announcement on Twitter: "We could have chosen comfort zone, but we challenged prejudice"

And how do you know the largely part of the public in Malta are supporting this and be not a bigot?

[Oneracon]

Looking at Maltese public opinion, there is no massive backlash against the recognition of same-sex couples by the government. The only part of the law that caused any debate (and resulted in the opposition Nationalist Party abstaining en masse) was the provision that granted same-sex couples the right to adopt children as a couple.

To quote the Maltese government spokesman who made the announcement on Twitter: "We could have chosen comfort zone, but we challenged prejudice"

And how do you know the largely part of the public in Malta are supporting this and be not a bigot?

Well first-off: the Maltese people elected a majority Labour Party government that explicitly stated that they were going to introduce civil unions for same-sex couples.

Secondly: a survey conducted by Malta Today in November 2013 showed that 69.9% of respondents approved of government recognition of civil unions, with the only difference in opinion among supporters relating to the provisions regarding adoption.

[Aequalitia]

And how do you know the largely part of the public in Malta are supporting this and be not a bigot?

Well first-off: the Maltese people elected a majority Labour Party government that explicitly stated that they were going to introduce civil unions for same-sex couples.

Secondly: a survey conducted by Malta Today in November 2013 showed that 69.9% of respondents approved of government recognition of civil unions, with the only difference in opinion among supporters relating to the provisions regarding adoption.

Well, I see your point, and I be glad there is progress in Malta and did made a good step forwards in equal rights and freedoms.

However, that adoption issue is mixed, and I wonder why?

[Oneracon]

Well first-off: the Maltese people elected a majority Labour Party government that explicitly stated that they were going to introduce civil unions for same-sex couples.

Secondly: a survey conducted by Malta Today in November 2013 showed that 69.9% of respondents approved of government recognition of civil unions, with the only difference in opinion among supporters relating to the provisions regarding adoption.

Well, I see your point, and I be glad there is progress in Malta and did made a good step forwards in equal rights and freedoms.

However, that adoption issue is mixed, and I wonder why?

The Catholic Church probably, they always like to take advantage of their "state religion" status in Malta.

[Aequalitia]

Well, I see your point, and I be glad there is progress in Malta and did made a good step forwards in equal rights and freedoms.

However, that adoption issue is mixed, and I wonder why?

The Catholic Church probably, they always like to take advantage of their "state religion" status in Malta.

Hmmm, sadly to hear that, and are the church against, for or stay neutral in this happening in Malta?

[Oneracon]

The Catholic Church probably, they always like to take advantage of their "state religion" status in Malta.

Hmmm, sadly to hear that, and are the church against, for or stay neutral in this happening in Malta?

Against, as the Archbishop himself said: "The family, created through marriage - which constitutes an everlasting bond between one man and one woman - should continue to serve as the natural and social environment in which children are born and reared. It would be beneficial if the State, through its institutions, through any laws which are promulgated, through its policies, were to endorse this institution of the family which the majority of the Maltese people still hold dear to their hearts."

[Aequalitia]

Hmmm, sadly to hear that, and are the church against, for or stay neutral in this happening in Malta?

Against, as the Archbishop himself said: "The family, created through marriage - which constitutes an everlasting bond between one man and one woman - should continue to serve as the natural and social environment in which children are born and reared. It would be beneficial if the State, through its institutions, through any laws which are promulgated, through its policies, were to endorse this institution of the family which the majority of the Maltese people still hold dear to their hearts."

Typical the same words from those who are against equal right, jeez serious, can those who are against equal rights please use an other argument? Its so predictable.

But how much people in Malta are religious, and how much power the church have in society in Malta?

Yes I ask much, but I want to know and hope that Malta really made a step forward in law and society, instead of the situation here who only de-accepting LGBT people.

[Othelos]

Hmmm, sadly to hear that, and are the church against, for or stay neutral in this happening in Malta?

Against, as the Archbishop himself said: "The family, created through marriage - which constitutes an everlasting bond between one man and one woman - should continue to serve as the natural and social environment in which children are born and reared. It would be beneficial if the State, through its institutions, through any laws which are promulgated, through its policies, were to endorse this institution of the family which the majority of the Maltese people still hold dear to their hearts."

I don't understand how people still think children will turn out badly if both parents are of the same sex.

In fact, it's probably a really good thing for children who would have otherwise had to wait longer to be adopted.

[Oneracon]

Against, as the Archbishop himself said: "The family, created through marriage - which constitutes an everlasting bond between one man and one woman - should continue to serve as the natural and social environment in which children are born and reared. It would be beneficial if the State, through its institutions, through any laws which are promulgated, through its policies, were to endorse this institution of the family which the majority of the Maltese people still hold dear to their hearts."

Typical the same words from those who are against equal right, jeez serious, can those who are against equal rights please use an other argument? Its so predictable.

But how much people in Malta are religious, and how much power the church have in society in Malta?

Yes I ask much, but I want to know and hope that Malta really made a step forward in law and society, instead of the situation here who only de-accepting LGBT people.

98% of Maltese identify as Roman Catholic (with 52% attending Mass every single Sunday), and Roman Catholicism is the official state religion of Malta according to the national constitution.

The remaining 2% is mostly Anglican Christian (British retirees and expats), with some small Jewish and Muslim populations as well.

[Degenerate Heart of HetRio]

98% of Maltese identify as Roman Catholic (with 52% attending Mass every single Sunday), and Roman Catholicism is the official state religion of Malta according to the national constitution.

The remaining 2% is mostly Anglican Christian (British retirees and expats), with some small Jewish and Muslim populations as well.

I will only be comfortable with being in a 20% very religiously Protestant country when we irreligious people are at least 16%, with atheists and agnostics being half of said number. Else, people will have more confidence to repeat stuff like "we live in a Christian culture" and stuff to make strawman arguments (criticizing the Roman Catholic Church alone is far easier than a diversity of conservative Christian beliefs).

But now they're almost 25%... and we seem to not have gotten to the 14% mark yet.

I wonder how irreligious people would feel in countries like this, where they are by the fractions of percentiles.

[Kiruri]

98% of Maltese identify as Roman Catholic (with 52% attending Mass every single Sunday), and Roman Catholicism is the official state religion of Malta according to the national constitution.

The remaining 2% is mostly Anglican Christian (British retirees and expats), with some small Jewish and Muslim populations as well.

I will only be comfortable with being in a 20% very religiously Protestant country when we irreligious people are at least 16%, with atheists and agnostics being half of said number. Else, people will have more confidence to repeat stuff like "we live in a Christian culture" and stuff to make strawman arguments (criticizing the Roman Catholic Church alone is far easier than a diversity of conservative Christian beliefs).

But now they're almost 25%... and we seem to not have gotten to the 14% mark yet.

I wonder how irreligious people would feel in countries like this, where they are by the fractions of percentiles.

I live in a country where the state religion is Roman Catholicism, I'm atheist. It's kind of frustrating because the church is so intent on getting mixed with politics. They're very influential :/

[Aequalitia]

Typical the same words from those who are against equal right, jeez serious, can those who are against equal rights please use an other argument? Its so predictable.

But how much people in Malta are religious, and how much power the church have in society in Malta?

Yes I ask much, but I want to know and hope that Malta really made a step forward in law and society, instead of the situation here who only de-accepting LGBT people.

98% of Maltese identify as Roman Catholic (with 52% attending Mass every single Sunday), and Roman Catholicism is the official state religion of Malta according to the national constitution.

The remaining 2% is mostly Anglican Christian (British retirees and expats), with some small Jewish and Muslim populations as well.

Then we got a social problem I see in Malta, and I don't even know then how trustful that poll is be nor how society really would accept this equal step forward or not.

If the church isn't accepting this, and the large population is religious, and Malta got a state region, then its only a matter of time before their go two steps back after this one step forward.

Influence can do a lot.

[Orinon]

The fact that these people get considered by some as less then subhuman is disgusting. They are human beings, same as you. And you should fucking treat them as such.