What do you think about UKIP?

[Parti Ouvrier]

Jesus Christ. I never said ukip were generally a racist organisation. I wish you would stop conflating racism and Xenophobia.

They are essentially synonymous.

The point still stands though. Wanting to limit immigration doesn't make you xenophobic; even the Lib Dems want to do this to a degree. UKIP just have a strong stance on it and some of their members are making a few passionate remarks because of recent trends. Is Australia a xenophobic country because of its immigration policy? UKIP want essentially a similar policy to that. I don't agree with it, but I don't see it as xenophobia.

Yes, I'd say the Australian government is pretty close to being or encouraging xenophobia. The Lib Dems *yawn* do not show nearly the same irrationality on the immigration issue. As it goes, they're fairly vague on limits to immigration, ukip on the hand, 29millon Romanians and Bulgarians could come here?As if all of them would just up sticks and leave their respective countries empty. That's not just a councillor, NF defended this position himself!

'3. UKIP would introduce a five year freeze on immigration for permanent settlement (with some exceptions) until we regain control of our borders, put in effective immigration controls, and deal with the issue of illegal immigrants. Overstaying a visa would become a criminal offence.'*
That's going beyond merely controlling immigration, this a freeze on permanent immigrants for a whole term of parliament.

* http://www.ukip.org/issues/policy-pages/immigration

[Scholencia]

I can't even understand the first paragraph due to your horrid grammar, but I don't know why you would think that a period of incredible academic achievements such as algebra, medical, and astronomical accomplishments is "false" in any sort of way.

Because mostly the Arabs got all that from ancient Greeks. It was not a accomplishment since they did not developed it, they just had the knowlegde since they manage to conquer cities like Alexandria and other academic centers of the ancient world and making it unavailable for the outside (non-muslim) cultures. Also, whatexactly are their accomplishment, provide some example.

They also had sharia laws, religious bigotry and slavery on their territory. So, why is that a "Golden Age" while on other hand the European history of 16th to the modern period is a period of racism and all other evil things?

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

The truth is that is was never really something special.

[Ifreann]

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

That you think this is a question worth thinking about shows a truly great ignorance on your part about a truly great number of things, bordering on a complete failure to connect with reality.

[Shove Piggy Shove]

I can't even understand the first paragraph due to your horrid grammar, but I don't know why you would think that a period of incredible academic achievements such as algebra, medical, and astronomical accomplishments is "false" in any sort of way.

Because mostly the Arabs got all that from ancient Greeks. It was not a accomplishment since they did not developed it, they just had the knowlegde since they manage to conquer cities like Alexandria and other academic centers of the ancient world and making it unavailable for the outside (non-muslim) cultures. Also, whatexactly are their accomplishment, provide some example.

They also had sharia laws, religious bigotry and slavery on their territory. So, why is that a "Golden Age" while on other hand the European history of 16th to the modern period is a period of racism and all other evil things?

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

The truth is that is was never really something special.

That's very nice, and now perhaps you would be kind enough to demonstrate how this relates to UKIP?

[Tagmatium]

I can't even understand the first paragraph due to your horrid grammar, but I don't know why you would think that a period of incredible academic achievements such as algebra, medical, and astronomical accomplishments is "false" in any sort of way.

Because mostly the Arabs got all that from ancient Greeks. It was not a accomplishment since they did not developed it, they just had the knowlegde since they manage to conquer cities like Alexandria and other academic centers of the ancient world and making it unavailable for the outside (non-muslim) cultures. Also, whatexactly are their accomplishment, provide some example.

They also had sharia laws, religious bigotry and slavery on their territory. So, why is that a "Golden Age" while on other hand the European history of 16th to the modern period is a period of racism and all other evil things?

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

The truth is that is was never really something special.

Or perhaps that progress isn't always consistent?

You yourself pointed out the "Dark Age" and the Roman Empire - it's often stated that technology regressed in many parts of Europe during that period, whether rightly or wrongly.

You're also ignoring (or are unaware) that the idea of the "Dark Age" is falling/has fallen out of favour.

[Blasveck]

I can't even understand the first paragraph due to your horrid grammar, but I don't know why you would think that a period of incredible academic achievements such as algebra, medical, and astronomical accomplishments is "false" in any sort of way.

Because mostly the Arabs got all that from ancient Greeks. It was not a accomplishment since they did not developed it, they just had the knowlegde since they manage to conquer cities like Alexandria and other academic centers of the ancient world and making it unavailable for the outside (non-muslim) cultures. Also, whatexactly are their accomplishment, provide some example.

They also had sharia laws, religious bigotry and slavery on their territory. So, why is that a "Golden Age" while on other hand the European history of 16th to the modern period is a period of racism and all other evil things?

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

The truth is that is was never really something special.

Y'know, the Romans also had slavery and some pretty nasty things, but do you still reject the existence of the Roman Golden Age as well? If not, then I call into question why Muslims can't have a Golden Age, but Romans apparently can.

I just listed their achievements. Algebra, for one.

Why is Europe from the 16th century onwards called racist and such and not a Golden Age? Well, because it wasn't one. The Renaissance, you could argue, was a European Golden Age due to its remarkable achievements and translations of ancient Greek, Roman, and Arab texts, including their own original creations.

Jesus, you expect me to sum up centuries worth of political, economic, and social conflicts within the Middle East in an attempt to explain why they're doing so horribly nowadays? No, don't act like that.

[The Archregimancy]

1) New Zealand had representative self-government in 1893; women's suffrage in New Zealand had nothing to do with the United Kingdom's parliament, and was entirely the responsibility of the New Zealand Parliament. So no, the United Kingdom wasn't the first country to grant women the right to vote.

Which does not change tha fact that New Zealand was back than a British colony and not even a dominion. It was something like the Falkands today, since there is no New Zealand etnicity the people who libed there 150 years ago were British,

2) There's been no functioning "Muslim caliphate" since the sack of Baghdad in 1258; the Mamluks kept a shadow Abbasid Caliphate running until the 16th century - though one without any temporal authority - and the Ottomans intermittently claimed the title until the abolition of the Ottoman Empire in the 1920. But since the traditional Caliphate functionally ended in the 13th century,

To be honest I dont care since their history is not worth to learn since the islamic history is not importing to the to the human kinds as the European history is or the history of the Roman Empire. So, please spare me from the history of thoose savages.

Your constant willingness to discuss topics about which you patently know virtually nothing - and in one case here openly admit you're ignorant about because you don't care about that topic - never ceases to amaze me.

It's like you're openly aiming for some sort of public award for debate humiliation masochism.

[Scholencia]

Y'know, the Romans also had slavery and some pretty nasty things, but do you still reject the existence of the Roman Golden Age as well? If not, then I call into question why Muslims can't have a Golden Age, but Romans apparently can.

Unfortunately, the "nom-biased" historians wont aknowledge a Roman Golden Age but yet doing it with an Islamic.

The ancient period was far more advanced than the Arabs. Do I really have to point that the even the half of words from your langauage has Latin roots?

I just listed their achievements. Algebra, for one.

Algebra existed before the Arabs and its is more developed by the Greeks. Also, what exactly in Algebra? Did the Arabs made Pythagorean theorem? Which formula did they achieved?

If you want I can list some great inventions from the "Dark Ages" or some earlier European phase, you name some specifically Arab invention and we can compare it.

We can also list some authors that were already known in Middle Age Europe without the Arabs.

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

That you think this is a question worth thinking about shows a truly great ignorance on your part about a truly great number of things, bordering on a complete failure to connect with reality.

questioning the islamic "Golden Age"=ignorace

What is the matter? The truth obvious hurts your political correct feelings.

Or perhaps that progress isn't always consistent?

You yourself pointed out the "Dark Age" and the Roman Empire - it's often stated that technology regressed in many parts of Europe during that period, whether rightly or wrongly.

You're also ignoring (or are unaware) that the idea of the "Dark Age" is falling/has fallen out of favour.

Yeah, there was stangantion of Europe with the fall of the Roman Empire, but at the end it managed to be develop again in the 16th century.

What do you mean by "Dark Age is falling/has fallen out of favour"?

[Scholencia]

Your constant willingness to discuss topics about which you patently know virtually nothing - and in one case here openly admit you're ignorant about because you don't care about that topic - never ceases to amaze me.

Attack the arguments, not the poster. I was actually tring to avoid the whole "islamic golden age" dsicussion but hey feel free to intervene.

It's like you're openly aiming for some sort of public award for debate humiliation masochism.

To be honest, it is not your concerne what will I do or not. You cerntainly have you own bussiness.

To be honest I personally dont care what some anonymous posters on a forum think. Calling it even "public" is even far more hillarious.

[Estormo]

I am going to say it again. Overall, I have positive opinions toward the UKIP party.

[Everia]

UKIP seems pretty cool and sensible.

I'd vote for them.

[Estormo]

UKIP seems pretty cool and sensible.

I'd vote for them.

It is a breath of fresh air that these parties exist throughout Europe.

[Ifreann]

That you think this is a question worth thinking about shows a truly great ignorance on your part about a truly great number of things, bordering on a complete failure to connect with reality.

questioning the islamic "Golden Age"=ignorace

I'd suggest that you read my post again if you're having trouble deciphering my meaning, but somehow I don't think that doing so would help you.

What is the matter? The truth obvious hurts your political correct feelings.

I'm afraid your "truth" doesn't hurt my feelings, for all that you obviously want it to.

[Estormo]

Here is a question to think about. If the muslims were really so developed than they would even today be more advanced than the rest of the world, why are they than today so undeveloped?

That you think this is a question worth thinking about shows a truly great ignorance on your part about a truly great number of things, bordering on a complete failure to connect with reality.

That is what you could call ”Soft trolling”.

[Shove Piggy Shove]

UKIP seems pretty cool and sensible.

I'd vote for them.

Care to expand on this?

[Estormo]

UKIP seems pretty cool and sensible.

I'd vote for them.

Care to expand on this?

They do not want to destroy white countries. Expanded.

[Ifreann]

Care to expand on this?

They do not want to destroy white countries. Expanded.

They do, they just don't realise it.

[Estormo]

They do not want to destroy white countries. Expanded.

They do, they just don't realise it.

Incorrect.

[Everia]

UKIP seems pretty cool and sensible.

I'd vote for them.

Care to expand on this?

I like their policies on the issues.

I don't know how you want me to expand on it. Maybe something to discuss would help.

[Shove Piggy Shove]

Care to expand on this?

They do not want to destroy white countries. Expanded.

That's not really an expansion, it's just a nonsensical statement with no supporting arguments...

[Shove Piggy Shove]

Care to expand on this?

I like their policies on the issues.

I don't know how you want me to expand on it. Maybe something to discuss would help.

Which issues? EU? Immigration? NHS? Same Sex Marriage? Environment/Power?

[Estormo]

They do not want to destroy white countries. Expanded.

That's not really an expansion, it's just a nonsensical statement with no supporting arguments...

Must I? For example, they do not allow just any random immigrant who wants into the UK

[Alyakia]

That's not really an expansion, it's just a nonsensical statement with no supporting arguments...

Must I? For example, they do not allow just any random immigrant who wants into the UK

there's no point in trying to dance around it. you've already said they don't want to "destroy white countries". it's ok for you to say "they don't allow any random immigrant or black who wants into the UK". it saves us all some time.

[Estormo]

Must I? For example, they do not allow just any random immigrant who wants into the UK

there's no point in trying to dance around it. you've already said they don't want to "destroy white countries". it's ok for you to say "they don't allow any random immigrant or black who wants into the UK". it saves us all some time.

He wanted expansion, I gave him a reason.

[L Ron Cupboard]

They do not want to destroy white countries. Expanded.

Is that an implied 'unlike the three big parties'? That would be precious.