At what level should education curriculum be decided?

[Chinese Regions]

Curriculum should be decided by the student and no one else.

The Student? You mean moi?
5 years old: Multivariable Calculus, Graph Theory, Topology
Thank me later.

[Shnercropolis]

Not bad enough to warrant a complete overhaul which may or may not improve anything.

Sounds like laziness or paranoia on your part.

Yes.

Nope. But if we start messing with the education process at its highest level, it might get way way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

If we start messing with gay rights at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

If we start messing with human trafficking at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

If we start messing with unemployment at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

gay rights, human trafficking, and unemployment aren't parts of the government.

[Post-Keynesian Economics]

Sounds like laziness or paranoia on your part.

Yes.

If we start messing with gay rights at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

If we start messing with human trafficking at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

If we start messing with unemployment at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

gay rights, human trafficking, and unemployment aren't parts of the government.

If we start messing with roads at its highest level, it might get way worse. If we leave it the way it is, we will know how well it works. And honestly, we're not doing that bad.

[The Anarchist Liberation Army]

Curriculum should be decided by the student and no one else.

Nah.

Nah....Nice argument

Obviously children once reaching a certain age suddenly lose the ability to self-teach in spite of previously learning to walk and talk. You're right, let them develop through a system that teaches them how to best serve the state and follow the status quo.

[Farnhamia]

Nah.

Nah....Nice argument

Obviously children once reaching a certain age suddenly lose the ability to self-teach in spite of previously learning to walk and talk. You're right, let them develop through a system that teaches them how to best serve the state and follow the status quo.

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

[Divair]

Nah.

Nah....Nice argument

Obviously children once reaching a certain age suddenly lose the ability to self-teach in spite of previously learning to walk and talk. You're right, let them develop through a system that teaches them how to best serve the state and follow the status quo.

Kids don't have the maturity nor experience to properly construct a curriculum that allows them to later specialize in a career of their choosing. That's why kids in democratic schools have their parents dictating curriculum when the school doesn't.

[DesAnges]

Nah....Nice argument

Obviously children once reaching a certain age suddenly lose the ability to self-teach in spite of previously learning to walk and talk. You're right, let them develop through a system that teaches them how to best serve the state and follow the status quo.

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

I taught myself to read, does that count?

[Temujinn]

State. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

It is broke.

[Divair]

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

I taught myself to read, does that count?

I taught myself negative integers. I shall dictate all your curriculums!

[The Anarchist Liberation Army]

Nah....Nice argument

Obviously children once reaching a certain age suddenly lose the ability to self-teach in spite of previously learning to walk and talk. You're right, let them develop through a system that teaches them how to best serve the state and follow the status quo.

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

Talking is an entirely new and radical concept to a mind that has not known a language. I'm not saying ban the schools and impeach the teachers. But students should pursue what they want to, natural interests should be encouraged by teachers, rather than a pre-conceived state indoctrination plan.

[Temujinn]

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

I taught myself to read, does that count?

You spontaneously derived what the little lines on paper meant with no other outside stimulus then the squiggles on the paper. Excuse me, I find that impossible to believe. Someone gave you a frame of reference and a starting point.

[Farnhamia]

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

I taught myself to read, does that count?

I'll think about it but don't hold your breath. How did you do that, by the way? I assume you mean you did it without any guidance or instruction from anyone, correct?

[Vitaphone Racing]

I think that was sarcasm.

[Vitaphone Racing]

You learned to walk and talk all by yourself?

Talking is an entirely new and radical concept to a mind that has not known a language. I'm not saying ban the schools and impeach the teachers. But students should pursue what they want to, natural interests should be encouraged by teachers, rather than a pre-conceived state indoctrination plan.

What good is a generation of useless young adults to the world?

[Imperializt Russia]

No one level should set a standard.

If we decide that education is a human right, we should assess what basic level this human right is fulfilled at, which must obviously be done at the international level. No idea what should really be sought for countries so underdeveloped they need an international standard of curriculum, but I'd imagine a moderately complex grasp of their own language, being literate and proficient at basic mathematical and scientific concepts would be a bottom-rung minimum-requirement goal.

The national level should set the guidelines for what must be achieved. The state grants its citizens passes in its education system, they need to dictate what is required to pass. It must also state what individual areas of topics must be discussed and to what degree.

The regional (state, for you Americans, I guess) and local levels should probably not be differentiated. In the US, a State should be the lowest level that grants a final curriculum guideline, to be followed by schools of that State. In smaller countries like the UK, it's probably doable to substitute "State" for "council".
I imagine this final curriculum guideline would be finalising how the national-level goals are to be achieved, what subjects are required at this regional level and guidelines for what individual schools are permitted to chop and change. In the UK we broadly manage this by (at least when I was at school) having schools pick between examination boards to teach their curriculum.

[Divair]

Talking is an entirely new and radical concept to a mind that has not known a language. I'm not saying ban the schools and impeach the teachers. But students should pursue what they want to, natural interests should be encouraged by teachers, rather than a pre-conceived state indoctrination plan.

What good is a generation of useless young adults to the world?

We'll use them for manual labour.
*nod*

[Blasveck]

I'd support a reasonable and solid international baseline standard, with some flexibility at the national and perhaps state level.

[DesAnges]

I taught myself to read, does that count?

I'll think about it but don't hold your breath. How did you do that, by the way? I assume you mean you did it without any guidance or instruction from anyone, correct?

Pretty much.

I taught myself to read, does that count?

You spontaneously derived what the little lines on paper meant with no other outside stimulus then the squiggles on the paper. Excuse me, I find that impossible to believe. Someone gave you a frame of reference and a starting point.

No direct frame of reference, certainly. I think I picked things up from TV. I was a very knowledge-osmotic child, although I've been a terrible learner since about the age of 14 or so. No work ethic at all.

[Vazdania]

This seems to be a recurring issue in American politics, and though most of the people I know support education decisions being made at local levels, the federal government consistently sets federal standards or requirements such as with No Child Left Behind or the voluntary Common Core.

I'm curious of NSG's opinion on this.

Here's one opinion:

http://truthinamericaneducation.com/common-core-state-standards/national-curriculum/

The move towards Common Core State Standards and the two consortia developing assessments have led some to advocate for a common core or national curriculum, as called for by the Albert Shanker Institute in A Call for Common Content: Core Curriculum Must Build A Bridge From Standards to Achievement. A national curriculum would further erode local control and raises other serious issues as indicated in Closing the Door on Innovation: Why One National Curriculum is Bad for America. Closing the Door on Innovation is A Critical Response to the Shanker Institute Manifesto and the U.S. Department of Education’s Initiative to Develop a National Curriculum and National Assessments Based on National Standards. This response includes the following concerns:

No constitutional or statutory basis for national standards, national assessments, or national curricula.
No consistent evidence indicates that a national curriculum leads to high academic achievement.
Developed national standards are inadequate for basing a national curriculum as planned by the administration.
No body of evidence recommends a “best” design for curriculum sequences in any subject.
No body of evidence justifies a single high school curriculum for all students.

Here's another:

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/04/why-i-support-the-common-core-reading-standards/275265/

Reading comprehension skills are not unlike physical muscles: Exercise increases strength. Hence the Common Core reading standards also emphasize the quality and complexity of texts that students read. Instead of a steady diet of watery kiddie lit, the Common Core requires students to grapple with a wide variety of content-rich, high quality texts from across a variety of cultures, eras, and genres. Such texts model for students higher, yet reasonably attainable, models of thinking and writing, better preparing them for career and college. A student will develop more reading comprehension skills during one 50-minute period spent examining one paragraph from the Declaration of Independence than a week of classroom time spent discussing rad themes in the latest young-adult novel.

Many teachers themselves have not been taught to teach this way; indeed many of them have not been taught to read this way themselves. (I know this because these teachers have been in my classroom.) But the Common Core Standards for reading include sample questions particularly to address this gap: The questions are designed for the teachers to use to cultivate the students' deep-reading skills.

Personally, I don't have a deeply formed opinion on this issue but I tend toward less curriculum restrictions by the government because I find that it promotes innovative approaches to education. That said, I don't want schools in places like my home state of Texas to turn into Bible schools when restrictions are lifted.

Preferablly state or perhaps school district.

[Blasveck]

This seems to be a recurring issue in American politics, and though most of the people I know support education decisions being made at local levels, the federal government consistently sets federal standards or requirements such as with No Child Left Behind or the voluntary Common Core.

I'm curious of NSG's opinion on this.

Here's one opinion:

http://truthinamericaneducation.com/common-core-state-standards/national-curriculum/



Here's another:

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/04/why-i-support-the-common-core-reading-standards/275265/



Personally, I don't have a deeply formed opinion on this issue but I tend toward less curriculum restrictions by the government because I find that it promotes innovative approaches to education. That said, I don't want schools in places like my home state of Texas to turn into Bible schools when restrictions are lifted.

Preferablly state or perhaps school district.

I'm starting to get the feeling that you don't ever think about consequences.

[Vazdania]

Preferablly state or perhaps school district.

I'm starting to get the feeling that you don't ever think about consequences.

Says the person who supports abortion.
In any case, why do you say that? States have a better understanding of what their students need to learn.

[Divair]

Preferablly state or perhaps school district.

I'm starting to get the feeling that you don't ever think about consequences.

Took you a while to catch on.

[DesAnges]

I'm starting to get the feeling that you don't ever think about consequences.

Says the person who supports abortion.
In any case, why do say that? States have a better understanding of what their students need to learn.

Irrelevant.

Why on earth do states know better than the feds? One deals with an insular network of neighbouring, culturally homogenous authorities on a national level, the other deals with a network of global, culturally heterogenous authorities on an international level. I know which one I'd trust to teach my kids.

[Lerodan Chinamerica]

As local as possible.

[Waldmania]

Why not have a "minimum" curriculum, the federal government sets a minimum that states' education system must meet. If they don't meet it, then the federal government can intervene and reform it to bring it up to standards. If the state is at or above the minimum, then the federal government doesn't get involved. That way states like Massachusetts and New York that are ahead in education don't get dragged down with the rest of the country.