Schappelle, Spying & Refugees, Australia-Indonesia Thread

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

You don't have to be a bogan to go to Thailand, you'd be surprised as to who goes there. Australia is literally on the opposite side of the world to the places most people dream of going so Thailand or Bali or some other south east asian nation is the budget way of having a holiday, with or without Jetstar. As far as Australians being the worst tourists goes, we are no worse than people from any other nation from what I've seen.

This is so frustrating no one could ever comprehend. >_>

I've always dreamt of Japan and Oceania. And it's far more expensive than North America and Europe, maybe more expensive than Africa.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Too bad Nauru's pretty much a shithole that no one should want to visit, beaches or no beaches.

Eh, speak for yourself. As horrible as it may be, it would make for a memorable journey. I really want to see those useless office blocks the government built in the 90s as part of their money laundering scheme.

Was it irony?

An evil-concentrated micro-Brasília to me seems like a really interesting place. As is all the arid landscape after they mined all the guano in the interior of an extremely wet, warm place.

[Respawn]

Basically the same reason they visit Phuket - it's "exotic".

You Anglos are too hard on yourselves. In Brazil 99% of people are as mindless as this or even more and no one thinks we suck.

We have this thing here called 'the cultural cringe'. Basically it's a fancy way of saying 'self-hating'.

As you might know, our generic term for the underclass is 'bogan', such people are typified as racist, drunk and uneducated. Typically this character is parodied by the upper and middle classes who look down on the bogan, thinking that the presence of bogans is proof that Australians are all uncultured swine. Every Australian has a bit of the cultural cringe in them and that's okay, but to the hardcore followers, no matter where they look, the grass is always greener. That is why aside from sporting events, Australians are very harsh on themselves.

The comedy show 'Kath and Kim' hits pretty much every aspect of our cultural cringe.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

You Anglos are too hard on yourselves. In Brazil 99% of people are as mindless as this or even more and no one thinks we suck.

We have this thing here called 'the cultural cringe'. Basically it's a fancy way of saying 'self-hating'.

As you might know, our generic term for the underclass is 'bogan', such people are typified as racist, drunk and uneducated. Typically this character is parodied by the upper and middle classes who look down on the bogan, thinking that the presence of bogans is proof that Australians are all uncultured swine. Every Australian has a bit of the cultural cringe in them and that's okay, but to the hardcore followers, no matter where they look, the grass is always greener. That is why aside from sporting events, Australians are very harsh on themselves.

The comedy show 'Kath and Kim' hits pretty much every aspect of our cultural cringe.

Australia is suddenly so similar in Brazil, except that the bogan figure here is more often deeply otherized as something culturally, linguistically and racially "foreign" as well.

Yeah, I kinda felt it. I have a very acute smell sense for classist prejudice.

[AiliailiA]

We have this thing here called 'the cultural cringe'. Basically it's a fancy way of saying 'self-hating'.

As you might know, our generic term for the underclass is 'bogan', such people are typified as racist, drunk and uneducated. Typically this character is parodied by the upper and middle classes who look down on the bogan, thinking that the presence of bogans is proof that Australians are all uncultured swine. Every Australian has a bit of the cultural cringe in them and that's okay, but to the hardcore followers, no matter where they look, the grass is always greener. That is why aside from sporting events, Australians are very harsh on themselves.

The comedy show 'Kath and Kim' hits pretty much every aspect of our cultural cringe.

Australia is suddenly so similar in Brazil, except that the bogan figure here is more often deeply otherized as something culturally, linguistically and racially "foreign" as well.

Yeah, I kinda felt it. I have a very acute smell sense for classist prejudice.

Brazil may well have deeper class distinctions. GINI* suggests so: Brazil is among the most inequitable counties in the world, developed or not. Australia up until the 1990's was one of the most equitable, near Scandinavian levels, and still ranks rather well.

It seems that racism is more entrenched in Australia though. Australia is largely free of the taint of slavery: a few hundred pacific islanders were taken as slaves and put to work on sugar plantations, and convicts were slaves in a sense, but the colonization of Australia happened during the anti-slavery push in Europe and slavery never gained a legal foothold in Australia as it did in the US.

But racism was institionalized in the White Australia policy, and Aborigines were not even permitted to vote until 1967. Racism is always bubbling away, directed at the latest arrivals (as with the US, and for the same reason of geographical isolation from the sources of immigration, immigration to Australia has happened in 'waves' of five to ten years predominantly from one region) but the melting pot works. Nothing brings people of disparate background together more effectively than working together. Like the US, Australia has always attracted immigrants with the prospect of a well-paid job.

Unfortunately, Australia seems to be moving towards the model of another low-population high-resource nation: Saudi Arabia. Australia welcomes foreign workers, already educated and trained in a profession by some other country, and after some years of working in Australia and paying their taxes may allow them citizenship (so the comparison with Saudi Arabia is maybe a bit excessive on my part) but maybe doesn't, throwing them back to the country which invested in their education and training, to provide for them in retirement. After Australia has reaped the benefit of productive years of that person's life.

Perhaps even worse than that, the emerging system of "guest workers" throws the worker at the mercy of their employer. To establish that working and tax-paying record to move from legal resident to citizen, immigrant workers rely on their patron employer to renew their working visa. This directly undermines the minimum wage system of Australia, which is a universal minimum wage then higher minimum wages per industry. And the undermining of minimum wage happens exactly where you would expect: in agriculture, in shipping, in telemarketing, and in all kinds of piece-work.

*

GINI is a rather rough measure though. I think one reason Brazil rates so badly for income inequality is a significant portion of the population living subsistence lifestyles. Even if they do have cash income it isn't declared for tax purposes -- tax collectors simply don't go there -- yet in GINI calculations that shows up as zero income, which implies that they suffer from poverty. In fact, those living a traditional subsistence lifestyle may not be suffering at all: very often they have a safe place to sleep, plenty to eat, and a strong culture.
Australia by contrast has a much lower proportion of population living those subsistence lifestyles: about 3% self-identify as Aboriginal in the Census, and of those less than a quarter live the traditional Arboriginal lifestyle outside of any tax or subsidy. There may be more, particularly in the NT and WA, who aren't counted in the Census, but therefore they aren't counted in calculating Australia's GINI either.

[Respawn]

Unfortunately, Australia seems to be moving towards the model of another low-population high-resource nation: Saudi Arabia.

Another thing to consider. We will soon be joining Saudi Arabia as the only nations in the G20 without an automotive industry.

[Gravlen]

Australia has every right to turn back refugees...

Incorrect. Australia gave up that right when they signed the Refugee Convention.