Nigeria denies fundamental rights to homosexuals

[Olivaero]

Damn it's just like the early 20th century all over again...

The lessons of Munich end up being relearned all too often.

It seems every other day on NSG...

[Ostroeuropa]

You know what I am so sick of liberals sitting behind their computer and convincing themselves they call the shots. Our troops go through alot, and liberals, communist, your all alike, all you want is international intervention and war.

Oh I get it.
When it's about invading a country to get their oil, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul pacifist commies.
When it's about international sanctions against a country to make them stop oppressing a minority, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul interventionist commies.

What a sorry excuse for an argument you have there.

Risottia.
If sanctions were applied and Nigeria refused to budge, and then a second African nation flipped to death penalty for gays, would you then be in favor of armed intervention?

[Risottia]

when someone believes in a left wing ideology, I am going to call them a liberal in that field.

Liberals, for your own information, are on the right side of the spectrum. That's because they want to lower the regulations and the governmental intervention in the economy.

[United Misotheist]

Oh so killing innocent civilians is worth it? Killing thousands of people is worth it? This is a small minority and their not worth it. I mean war costs money, resources, and lives. And you know what your not one of the troops that has to go over there and fight.

Hahahahaha. Hilarious. Take a look at your sig. Do you really think I'm too thick to notice you're willing to play any card possible to ensure that people are okay with Nigeria murdering LGBT citizens?

I could care less what happens to gays in Nigeria, but I do care about our troops and I want to bring'm home. They should be over here, defending the AMERICAN people not a bunch of foreigners.

[The New Lowlands]

But it wouldn't.

We won't know until we try.

I also won't know for certain whether dropping ice in a bathtub to heat up the water will work. Doesn't mean I can't make reasonable assumptions.

[Swedish Realm]

You know what I am so sick of liberals sitting behind their computer and convincing themselves they call the shots. Our troops go through alot, and liberals, communist, your all alike, all you want is international intervention and war.

Oh I get it.
When it's about invading a country to get their oil, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul pacifist commies.
When it's about international sanctions against a country to make them stop oppressing a minority, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul interventionist commies.

What a sorry excuse for an argument you have there.

Well then there is me, I didn't like the oil intervention, just like I wouldn't want an LGBT intervention. None of it is worth it.

[Farnhamia]

Don't avoid my question. I don't automatically assume that a woman will cheat on her husband, it is true, but it happens anyway.

How did I avoid your question? I answered it.

I'm done here. I'm done with this thread. You've proven to be incapable of rational thought, and you've proven to be a hateful, bigoted fuckwit. I cannot argue with your circular logic, as you keep spouting the same annoying bullshit. I think you should actually try using logic for once

Good night.

*** Warned for flaming ***

[Risottia]

Damn it's just like the early 20th century all over again...

The lessons of Munich end up being relearned all too often.

Damn, who gets to invade Prague and Pilsen this time?
*invests in British breweries*

[Luveria]

Hahahahaha. Hilarious. Take a look at your sig. Do you really think I'm too thick to notice you're willing to play any card possible to ensure that people are okay with Nigeria murdering LGBT citizens?

I could care less what happens to gays in Nigeria, but I do care about our troops and I want to bring'm home. They should be over here, defending the AMERICAN people not a bunch of foreigners.

Wow, homophobia and xenophobia in one post. Lovely.

[Risottia]

Oh I get it.
When it's about invading a country to get their oil, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul pacifist commies.
When it's about international sanctions against a country to make them stop oppressing a minority, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul interventionist commies.

What a sorry excuse for an argument you have there.

Well then there is me, I didn't like the oil intervention, just like I wouldn't want an LGBT intervention. None of it is worth it.

And what about the sanctions?

[Olivaero]

Oh I get it.
When it's about invading a country to get their oil, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul pacifist commies.
When it's about international sanctions against a country to make them stop oppressing a minority, the US right-wing complains about the lefties being ebul interventionist commies.

What a sorry excuse for an argument you have there.

Risottia.
If sanctions were applied and Nigeria refused to budge, and then a second African nation flipped to death penalty for gays, would you then be in favor of armed intervention?

It's funny Sanctions indiscriminately cause harm and yet are the humane face of interventionism... at least you can aim missiles and bullets.

[The New Lowlands]

Hahahahaha. Hilarious. Take a look at your sig. Do you really think I'm too thick to notice you're willing to play any card possible to ensure that people are okay with Nigeria murdering LGBT citizens?

I could care less what happens to gays in Nigeria, but I do care about our troops and I want to bring'm home. They should be over here, defending the AMERICAN people not a bunch of foreigners.

>Maurice Gustave Gamelin: "I could care less what happens to people in Germany, but I do care about our troops and I want to keep them home. They should be over here, defending the FRENCH people not liberating a bunch of Germans."

[Luveria]

We won't know until we try.

I also won't know for certain whether dropping ice in a bathtub to heat up the water will work. Doesn't mean I can't make reasonable assumptions.

It is better to do something than to do nothing. To do nothing is to say that what Nigeria is doing is acceptable. It sets a precedent that any African country can now start killing LGBT citizens and no one will do anything to stop it.

[Vitaphone Racing]

Well then there is me, I didn't like the oil intervention, just like I wouldn't want an LGBT intervention. None of it is worth it.

And what about the sanctions?

Tbh, they likely wouldn't have an effect unless Russia + China also follow through with them. I highly doubt they would too, there's a lot of foreign investment into Nigeria right now.

[Risottia]

I could care less what happens to gays in Nigeria, but I do care about our troops and I want to bring'm home. They should be over here, defending the AMERICAN people not a bunch of foreigners.

Wow, homophobia and xenophobia in one post. Lovely.

Now don't act surprised. I bet a bottle of Amarone against a fake Serbian dinar we all expected it.

[Soldati Senza Confini]

Hahahahaha. Hilarious. Take a look at your sig. Do you really think I'm too thick to notice you're willing to play any card possible to ensure that people are okay with Nigeria murdering LGBT citizens?

I could care less what happens to gays in Nigeria, but I do care about our troops and I want to bring'm home. They should be over here, defending the AMERICAN people not a bunch of foreigners.

Well, funny that because the U.S. has been since the cold war wanting to keep an international presence via their military might.

In other words, the U.S. has taken an international track which is hard to get out of now. We should have thought of that half a century ago.

[Luveria]

Risottia.
If sanctions were applied and Nigeria refused to budge, and then a second African nation flipped to death penalty for gays, would you then be in favor of armed intervention?

It's funny Sanctions indiscriminately cause harm and yet are the humane face of interventionism... at least you can aim missiles and bullets.

Yeah, it is rather warped logic saying "NO NO DON'T USE AIMED AND PRECISE MISSILES, THAT'S BAD! I would rather make every person in the country suffer instead."

[Swedish Realm]

I also won't know for certain whether dropping ice in a bathtub to heat up the water will work. Doesn't mean I can't make reasonable assumptions.

It is better to do something than to do nothing. To do nothing is to say that what Nigeria is doing is acceptable. It sets a precedent that any African country can now start killing LGBT citizens and no one will do anything to stop it.

Let the citizens and the Homosexual community handle it, it isn't our fight.

[The New Lowlands]

I also won't know for certain whether dropping ice in a bathtub to heat up the water will work. Doesn't mean I can't make reasonable assumptions.

It is better to do something than to do nothing. To do nothing is to say that what Nigeria is doing is acceptable. It sets a precedent that any African country can now start killing LGBT citizens and no one will do anything to stop it.

I'm not saying we should do nothing, but armed intervention would be counterproductive at the very least.

[Ostroeuropa]

And what about the sanctions?

Tbh, they likely wouldn't have an effect unless Russia + China also follow through with them. I highly doubt they would too, there's a lot of foreign investment into Nigeria right now.

Here is an ulterior benefit to interventionism.
We'd end up breaking a lot of Russia and Chinas toys.

Awww sorry guys, looks like investing in backward states with a poor civil rights record and helping to prop up their regime isn't a good investment after all ;(

[Ifreann]

Pretty much, yeah. There shouldn't be different laws from place to place. Generally, if I am allowed to do something, then I should be allowed to do it everywhere, and if I'm not then I should face the same punishment everywhere.

Hmm. Well, at least you're consistent. Since you believe that all places should have the exact same laws, then I can understand why you see Nigeria's criminalization of homosexuality as an incorrect act, as that criminalization takes it farther away from the mainstream body of definition of criminal acts. As a follow-up question then: is this universal definition of crime and punishment you see as optimal determined by mass consensus, or some other concern? For instance, if seventy years from now the human population decides that non-consensual sex, as long as it doesn't pass a threshold of violence, is not a criminal act, would that be a legitimate removal from the common consensus of crime?

Ideally the government would shield people's rights from changes in public opinion, and there would be social programs to discourage such opinions and encourage better ones, but realistically if enough people are behind it then even the highest laws could be changed to decriminalise or legalise non-violent rape. Or anything else, really.

I'm not aware of it violating anyone's rights. That doesn't mean it could not possibly do so. And contrary to what you said earlier, this doesn't mean that governments are irrelevant. One can believe governments and courts to be fallible without being an anarchist.

Yes, that was a bit of an overreach for effect in hindsight. Better stated, my point would be: if the prosecution and conviction of a criminal is not an infringement on that person's rights, and the crime they are being prosecuted and convicted for is defined as a crime by the preeminent authority in their jurisdiction of law, can their rights be being violated?

Not their rights under the laws of that jurisdiction, obviously. But it should go without saying that the law is not always right, even if it is always legal.

[Luveria]

It is better to do something than to do nothing. To do nothing is to say that what Nigeria is doing is acceptable. It sets a precedent that any African country can now start killing LGBT citizens and no one will do anything to stop it.

Let the citizens and the Homosexual community handle it, it isn't our fight.

Uhuh, it's amazingly no longer your fight the moment it involves LGBT rights.

[Luveria]

Tbh, they likely wouldn't have an effect unless Russia + China also follow through with them. I highly doubt they would too, there's a lot of foreign investment into Nigeria right now.

Here is an ulterior benefit to interventionism.
We'd end up breaking a lot of Russia and Chinas toys.

Awww sorry guys, looks like investing in backward states with a poor civil rights record and helping to prop up their regime isn't a good investment after all ;(

All the more reason to use armed intervention.

[Blackledge]

You're missing the point that a warmongering dictator is often very bad for regional stability, just as Nigeria refusing to allow LGBT citizens to get AIDs treatment is creating an international health situation that needs to be addressed.

... By bombing a democratic nation, right.

Since when has rule by mob, be they oppressive or well-intentioned, meant they have a "get out of Human Rights Violations Free" card?

Democracy for the sake of democracy needs to stop being interpreted as some sacred virtue. AIDs is enough of a serious issue, even if you hate homosexuals, to want to see its spread curbed and the infected people treated.

[The New Lowlands]

Let the citizens and the Homosexual community handle it, it isn't our fight.

Uhuh, it's amazingly no longer your fight the moment it involves LGBT rights.

Luveria, don't be unfair. Swedish Realm is at least consistent in not caring about anyone outside of his race, nationality, sex, and orientation.