Worst American president in history?

[Roski]

I don't know, I don't like Abraham Lincoln during the American Civil War. He just could've made North, South and the West separated, I mean all three of them have their own separate cultures. I don't like how he handled the situation

The South doomed itself when it fired the first shot, he was just making them pay for it.

They asked the USA kindly to abandon all forts, or there would be consequences. The North had ample time to leave Fort Sumter, Abraham was begging for the war.


He knew his presidency would be shit if he didn't do something drastic, so "Honest Abe" allowed the CSA to attack them, instead of having peace, to give a cause for war, which his country was mostly against.

[Jamjai]

I don't know, I don't like Abraham Lincoln during the American Civil War. He just could've made North, South and the West separated, I mean all three of them have their own separate cultures. I don't like how he handled the situation

The South doomed itself when it fired the first shot, he was just making them pay for it.

yea, a southern federation and plus a western federation

[Yumyumsuppertime]

The South doomed itself when it fired the first shot, he was just making them pay for it.

They asked the USA kindly to abandon all forts, or there would be consequences. The North had ample time to leave Fort Sumter, Abraham was begging for the war.


He knew his presidency would be shit if he didn't do something drastic, so "Honest Abe" allowed the CSA to attack them, instead of having peace, to give a cause for war, which his country was mostly against.

He allowed the CSA to attack them.

That has got to be one of the goddamdest worst defenses of the indefensible that I've heard as of late.

[The Nuclear Fist]

They asked the USA kindly to abandon all forts, or there would be consequences. The North had ample time to leave Fort Sumter, Abraham was begging for the war.

"Please leave the place you've built with your money and your resources, Pig Fucker Jeff and his Merry Band of Slavers decided they own it now."

He knew his presidency would be shit if he didn't do something drastic, so "Honest Abe" allowed the CSA to attack them, instead of having peace, to give a cause for war, which his country was mostly against.

That's some fine historical revisionism you've got there, sure you have some evidence?

[The Nuclear Fist]

The South doomed itself when it fired the first shot, he was just making them pay for it.

yea, a southern federation and plus a western federation, back then they were way different from the north

The only difference was that it was a worse place to live.

[Roski]

They asked the USA kindly to abandon all forts, or there would be consequences. The North had ample time to leave Fort Sumter, Abraham was begging for the war.


He knew his presidency would be shit if he didn't do something drastic, so "Honest Abe" allowed the CSA to attack them, instead of having peace, to give a cause for war, which his country was mostly against.

He allowed the CSA to attack them.

That has got to be one of the goddamdest worst defenses of the indefensible that I've heard as of late.

He could have left.
They had time to leave
He knew they would attack if they didn't
They didn't.


Sorry mate, He allowed it.

[The Nuclear Fist]

He could have left.
They had time to leave
He knew they would attack if they didn't
They didn't.


Sorry mate, He allowed it.

Why should they have left a fort the federal government built with its own money and its own resources? They should have offered to buy it.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

He allowed the CSA to attack them.

That has got to be one of the goddamdest worst defenses of the indefensible that I've heard as of late.

He could have left.
They had time to leave
He knew they would attack if they didn't
They didn't.


Sorry mate, He allowed it.

"If you don't leave your house, I'm going to kick in the door and punch you in the face."

Waits.

Kicks in door, punches person in face.

"Sorry, mate. You allowed it."

[Jamjai]

yea, a southern federation and plus a western federation, back then they were way different from the north

The only difference was that it was a worse place to live.

They would have problems frequently if three states were living in one region but at least everyone one of those three will have a coast line

[Roski]

They asked the USA kindly to abandon all forts, or there would be consequences. The North had ample time to leave Fort Sumter, Abraham was begging for the war.

"Please leave the place you've built with your money and your resources, Pig Fucker Jeff and his Merry Band of Slavers decided they own it now."

He knew his presidency would be shit if he didn't do something drastic, so "Honest Abe" allowed the CSA to attack them, instead of having peace, to give a cause for war, which his country was mostly against.

That's some fine historical revisionism you've got there, sure you have some evidence?

Following declarations of secession by seven Southern states, South Carolina demanded that the U.S. Army abandon its facilities in Charleston Harbor. On December 26, 1860, U.S. Major Robert Anderson surreptitiously moved his small command from the indefensible Fort Moultrie on Sullivan's Island to Fort Sumter, a substantial fortress controlling the entrance of Charleston Harbor

Oh, that isn't proof enough?

Formed in February 1861, the Confederate States of America was a republic composed of eleven Southern states that seceded from the Union in order to preserve slavery, states' rights, and political liberty for whites. Its conservative government, with Mississippian Jefferson Davis as president, sought a peaceful separation, but the United States refused to acquiesce in the secession

oh, still not enough?

As of April 1861, the US only retained control of two forts in the South: Fort Pickens at Pensacola, FL and Fort Sumter in Charleston, SC. Shortly after South Carolina seceded, the commander of the Charleston harbor defenses, Major Robert Anderson, moved his men from Fort Moultrie to Fort Sumter, located on a sandbar in the middle of the harbor. After refusing requests from the South Carolina government to vacate the fort, Anderson and the eighty-five men of his garrison settled in for what essentially became a siege

It wasn't Lincoln, but he didn't stop it Either

[Roski]

He could have left.
They had time to leave
He knew they would attack if they didn't
They didn't.


Sorry mate, He allowed it.

"If you don't leave *my* house, I'm going to kick in the door and punch you in the face."

Waits.

Kicks in door, punches person in face.

"Sorry, mate. You allowed it."

I edited for accuracy

[Aeken]

"Please leave the place you've built with your money and your resources, Pig Fucker Jeff and his Merry Band of Slavers decided they own it now."


That's some fine historical revisionism you've got there, sure you have some evidence?

Following declarations of secession by seven Southern states, South Carolina demanded that the U.S. Army abandon its facilities in Charleston Harbor. On December 26, 1860, U.S. Major Robert Anderson surreptitiously moved his small command from the indefensible Fort Moultrie on Sullivan's Island to Fort Sumter, a substantial fortress controlling the entrance of Charleston Harbor

Oh, that isn't proof enough?

Formed in February 1861, the Confederate States of America was a republic composed of eleven Southern states that seceded from the Union in order to preserve slavery, states' rights, and political liberty for whites. Its conservative government, with Mississippian Jefferson Davis as president, sought a peaceful separation, but the United States refused to acquiesce in the secession

oh, still not enough?

As of April 1861, the US only retained control of two forts in the South: Fort Pickens at Pensacola, FL and Fort Sumter in Charleston, SC. Shortly after South Carolina seceded, the commander of the Charleston harbor defenses, Major Robert Anderson, moved his men from Fort Moultrie to Fort Sumter, located on a sandbar in the middle of the harbor. After refusing requests from the South Carolina government to vacate the fort, Anderson and the eighty-five men of his garrison settled in for what essentially became a siege

It wasn't Lincoln, but he didn't stop it Either

It was illegal.

[The Nuclear Fist]

"Please leave the place you've built with your money and your resources, Pig Fucker Jeff and his Merry Band of Slavers decided they own it now."


That's some fine historical revisionism you've got there, sure you have some evidence?

Following declarations of secession by seven Southern states, South Carolina demanded that the U.S. Army abandon its facilities in Charleston Harbor. On December 26, 1860, U.S. Major Robert Anderson surreptitiously moved his small command from the indefensible Fort Moultrie on Sullivan's Island to Fort Sumter, a substantial fortress controlling the entrance of Charleston Harbor

Oh, that isn't proof enough?

Formed in February 1861, the Confederate States of America was a republic composed of eleven Southern states that seceded from the Union in order to preserve slavery, states' rights, and political liberty for whites. Its conservative government, with Mississippian Jefferson Davis as president, sought a peaceful separation, but the United States refused to acquiesce in the secession

oh, still not enough?

As of April 1861, the US only retained control of two forts in the South: Fort Pickens at Pensacola, FL and Fort Sumter in Charleston, SC. Shortly after South Carolina seceded, the commander of the Charleston harbor defenses, Major Robert Anderson, moved his men from Fort Moultrie to Fort Sumter, located on a sandbar in the middle of the harbor. After refusing requests from the South Carolina government to vacate the fort, Anderson and the eighty-five men of his garrison settled in for what essentially became a siege

It wasn't Lincoln, but he didn't stop it Either

Did you even bother to read what you write? They didn't ask, they demanded. Fuck.

You don't get to play the role of the sympathetic underdog when you get shellacked after demanding someone leaves their house because you own it now. If they weren't looking for a fight, they should have offered to pay for the fort in full.

[European Socialist Republic]

As soon as the term starts, he fires 11,000 workers that were on strike, the first president for a long time to actually have the balls to do so -Good

Kept minimum wage at 3.35/hr -Excellent

Reagan cut the budgets of non-military programs including Medicaid, food stamps, federal education programs and the EPA. -Good

You have some weird ideas of what's "good".

Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall! -Excellent

It was only a speech... What? Did you think Reagan's speech is what caused the Iron Curtain and the Soviet Union to fall?

[Gallia-]

"If you don't leave *my* house, I'm going to kick in the door and punch you in the face."

Waits.

Kicks in door, punches person in face.

"Sorry, mate. You allowed it."

I edited for accuracy

Military forts are considered US Government property.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

"If you don't leave *my* house, I'm going to kick in the door and punch you in the face."

Waits.

Kicks in door, punches person in face.

"Sorry, mate. You allowed it."

I edited for accuracy

First, when you do that, you're supposed to make the edit obvious. Strikethrough text and using a different color lettering for the edit have been used in the past. Please be more careful about that in the future, as moderators have been known to get involved in these situations, and I'd hate for that to happen here.

Second, the federal fort was not the state's property.

Third, we're way off-topic.

[Katyuscha]

Too many to pick favorites, for me.

[Sinovet]

Quite frankly, I think all of them were bad.

[Freiheit Reich]

worst: Andrew Jackson-Trail of Tears, disobeying the supreme court, slavery supporter

2nd worst: FDR-love of big govt. socialism caused problems we are suffering for today, wanted 100% for incomes above a certain level

3rd worst: Wilson-got us into WW1, federal reserve, against civil liberties, hard core racist

[Telonovic]

Woodrow Wilson.

[New Socialist South Africa]

worst: Andrew Jackson-Trail of Tears, disobeying the supreme court, slavery supporter

2nd worst: FDR-love of big govt. socialism caused problems we are suffering for today, wanted 100% for incomes above a certain level

3rd worst: Wilson-got us into WW1, federal reserve, against civil liberties, hard core racist

I agree with Andrew Jackson being the worst and Wilson being terrible.

I disagree with FDR being bad, but that is your opinion.

What I take issue with though is you calling FDR a socialist. FDR implemented Keynesian economic policies, which are very much part of capitalism. FDR never tried to give the workers the control of the means of production, and so cannot be called a socialist. He is too right wing to even be a democratic socialist (which is also actually still leftist capitalism despite the name suggesting otherwise).

[MERIZoC]

6. Lyndon B. Johnson. Vietnam was not justified. That is all.

Not only was it unjustified, if we had actually gone there to fight, and not police them, we could have lost fewer lives and actually won. I do not support the invasion of Vietnam, but we fucked up big time, and was part of the reason America became a laughing stalk.





On an unrelated note, let me address Reagan's term.
Excellent=2 Good=1 Neutral=0 Bad=-1 Terrible=-2
As soon as the term starts, he fires 11,000 workers that were on strike, the first president for a long time to actually have the balls to do so -Good
Reagan helped with the decrease of inflation, dropped it from 12.5 to 4.4 -Excellent
Unemployment rate fell from 7.5 to 5.4 -Good
Increased deficit and National Debt -Terrible
Heavily Increased defense -Excellent
TEFRA -Neutral
Job Training Partnership Act of 1982 -Good
Kept minimum wage at 3.35/hr -Excellent
"Reagan is viewed as an antitax hero despite raising taxes eleven times over the course of his presidency, all in the name of fiscal responsibility"
Reagan cut the budgets of non-military programs including Medicaid, food stamps, federal education programs and the EPA. -Good
In order to cover newly spawned federal budget deficits, the United States borrowed heavily both domestically and abroad, raising the national debt from $997 billion to $2.85 trillion -Terrible
Dropped several agreements being negotiated with the Soviets, wounding them financially -Excellent
Allowed people to use GPS freely -Excellent
Reagan introduced the Strategic Defense Initiative, a defense project -Excellent
SDI Hastened the end of the Cold War -Excellent
War on Drugs -Nuetral
Libya bombing -Terrible
Immigration -Excellent
Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall! -Excellent
His decision to go public in 1983 regarding his wearing the small, audio-amplifying device boosted their sales -Excellent
Judiciary -Good

Overall, he gets a 16, meaning he was a decent president, by my standards

You have very strange standards. Firstly, firing striking workers is not a mark of a good employer. They should listen to what the workers have to say. In addition, 3.35 an hour minimum wage is insufficient. Our current 7.25 an hour isn't enough. Cutting funding to medicaid, food stamps, and the EPA is also a terrible idea. The SDI did absolutely nothing, and was a complete failure. It had nothing to do with the end of the cold war. Also, you completely neglected to mention the Iran Contra scandal, which was the one of the worst presidential scandals in the 20th century. From your analysis of Reagan's presidency, I must conclude, good sir, that you are a half-assed idiot.

[Roski]

You have very strange standards. Firstly, firing striking workers is not a mark of a good employer. They should listen to what the workers have to say.
It is illegal to strike as a federal employee

In addition, 3.35 an hour minimum wage is insufficient. Our current 7.25 an hour isn't enough.
Minimum wage exists in jobs not supposed to be life careers, like a fry cook in McDonalds.

Cutting funding to medicaid, food stamps, and the EPA is also a terrible idea.
Medicaid yes, Food Stamps and EPA are abused beyond control.

The SDI did absolutely nothing, and was a complete failure. It had nothing to do with the end of the cold war.
The Strategic Defense Initiative terrified the Soviet Union, and they worked hard to copy it, and "progress" of the SDI was leaked, and helped to lead the USSR into bankruptcy

Also, you completely neglected to mention the Iran Contra scandal, which was the one of the worst presidential scandals in the 20th century.
I could not find information on this on the particular site I was getting these facts from, I wasn't going to make an opinion on something I had no information on. But, I just looked up on it, and I agree it was bad, but worst scandal? The Clintons stole top secret information that could lead to an arrest on them, and the selling of arms to save lifes was the worst? OR the FDR implemented policies that started and prolonged the Great Depression, after the market had rebuilt itself. And no, it wasn't all on him, the Dust Bowl was also a major cause. Johnson and Nixon "policed" a war that ultimately caused the lives of several Americans, that they still lost.
Harry S. Truman had a police action in the Korean war, which started the "Police War" in Vietnam.

I do not believe that was the worst scandal by any measures

From your analysis of Reagan's presidency, I must conclude, good sir, that you are a half-assed idiot.
You conclude on a Liberal standpoint, and though I disagree wholeheartedly with your statements, I do not believe that this qualifies as weird, just different of your opinions.

[Priory Academy USSR]

He is too right wing to even be a democratic socialist (which is also actually still leftist capitalism despite the name suggesting otherwise).

You're thinking of social democracy.

[European Socialist Republic]

2nd worst: FDR-love of big govt. socialism caused problems we are suffering for today, wanted 100% for incomes above a certain level

Are we talking about FDR or the Kingfish here?