Your thoughts on communism?

[Pandeeria]

Were they not conquered?

In time yes.

Is the American defeat in Vietnam proof that the American system doesn't work?
Is the fact that France was crushed in WW2 proof that capitalism doesn't work?
Is the red victory in the Russian civil war proof of Bolshevikism's validity?

Of course not; even if the examples I mentioned were easily defeated and not only vanquished after long bloody struggles your point would be invalid.

I never really made a point. I just stated that you argued "Hey. They fell because of outside conflict instead if internal conflict!" and I simply stated that just proves more that they fail if anything.

[Clone Creatures]

Because you happen to be the CEO of Boeing or what? Hello? You want a depression, or worse, civil war?
Capitalism is a dead end, and it isn't even a political ideology. It's a form of economics. Not a way to
rule a nation unless you like fascism of course, because that's what you got pretty much.

Fascism also ends the same way every time. Under the rain of bombs by an outraged world. Think about it.

Outlawing lobbyists and Unions aren't the way to go if worker's rights are in your mind.

I'm pretty sure organized business isn't going to start a civil war.

That is all.

Look, you explain why the real unemployment is nearing 23% in the US then. Suddenly people who worked all their lives just don't feel like living any more? No, it's that the opportunities to free enterprise are being cut off and blocked by self serving interest.

Congress passed 40,000 laws last year alone. It' an axiom that the more laws, the less justice. You can only have a totalitarian system when you can condense control, and all state labor laws are being condensed to match federal code. I know about this. Forget states rights.

[4years]

1. I said nothing of the sort, I have separate the arguments for why it would work in developed nations after the socialist transitional period. That was just to prove he claim that it "always failed" wrong.

2. The Commune lasted months, not days.

The commune lasted 10 days.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Commune

26 March to 28 May is not ten days.

Besides the mutiny occurred on 18 March 1871, Central Committee of the Guard was formed in was formed in February 1871, and one can reasonable date the Commune beginning on 4 September 1870 with the election of the Committees of Vigilance since two governments existed from their election onwards and the Prussian siege severed to isolate Paris.

In short, your chronology is faulty, something which your own source proves.

[The Norgan Alliance]

Outlawing lobbyists and Unions aren't the way to go if worker's rights are in your mind.

I'm pretty sure organized business isn't going to start a civil war.

That is all.

Look, you explain why the real unemployment is nearing 23% in the US then. Suddenly people who worked all their lives just don't feel like living any more? No, it's that the opportunities to free enterprise are being cut off and blocked by self serving interest.

Congress passed 40,000 laws last year alone. It' an axiom that the more laws, the less justice. You can only have a totalitarian system when you can condense control, and all state labor laws are being condensed to match federal code. I know about this. Forget states rights.

Real unemployment? What is this?

[Pandeeria]

Outlawing lobbyists and Unions aren't the way to go if worker's rights are in your mind.

I'm pretty sure organized business isn't going to start a civil war.

That is all.

Look, you explain why the real unemployment is nearing 23% in the US then. Suddenly people who worked all their lives just don't feel like living any more? No, it's that the opportunities to free enterprise are being cut off and blocked by self serving interest.

Congress passed 40,000 laws last year alone. It' an axiom that the more laws, the less justice. You can only have a totalitarian system when you can condense control, and all state labor laws are being condensed to match federal code. I know about this. Forget states rights.

Fuck state's rights. More power to the unified federal government.
Perhaps maybe there is a 23% unemployment[Citation Needed] in the US of A because of unregulated business and an overall poor world economy?

[New Acardia]

A Orwellian idlogy.

[Pandeeria]

The commune lasted 10 days.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Commune

26 March to 28 May is not ten days.

Besides the mutiny occurred on 18 March 1871, Central Committee of the Guard was formed in was formed in February 1871, and one can reasonable date the Commune beginning on 4 September 1870 with the election of the Committees of Vigilance since two governments existed from their election onwards and the German siege.

In short, your chronology is faulting which your own source proves.

Oops, sorry. I misread that.

[Solovinia (Ancient)]

I believe Communism is a fine idea. Crime is all but none, everyone is equal, and the government can focus more on international affairs instead of worring about their own people.

[Pandeeria]

I believe Communism is a fine idea. Crime is all but none, everyone is equal, and the government can focus more on international affairs instead of worring about their own people.

Forcing equality onto everyone is fine?

And the government doesn't that've to worry about it's own citizens? That doesn't sound like a fine idea.

[Clone Creatures]

Americans had no problems with invading British in two invasions, but we need a Global Identity. Like what? The Chinese people who crushed rocks with their bare hands to make runways for B-29 Bombers are now suddenly different people who what to skewer me with a bayonet? No.

Ever hear of the Central Bank and Warfare Model? Katherine Austin Fitts is credited with that term. This is what has ruled the planet. It's a game, and we are the pawns.

What are you getting at exactly?

Capitalism is about money. People are resources. Wars make money. War is a racket.
Politics is an illusion because it doesn't control the money, the money controls the politics.

[Clone Creatures]

I believe Communism is a fine idea. Crime is all but none, everyone is equal, and the government can focus more on international affairs instead of worring about their own people.

LOL! Yea, my former associate could agree with you on that one. Secret Policeman he was in Romania.
Thanks, but I'll keep my corporate slave masters for the time being.

[4years]

In time yes.

Is the American defeat in Vietnam proof that the American system doesn't work?
Is the fact that France was crushed in WW2 proof that capitalism doesn't work?
Is the red victory in the Russian civil war proof of Bolshevikism's validity?

Of course not; even if the examples I mentioned were easily defeated and not only vanquished after long bloody struggles your point would be invalid.

I never really made a point. I just stated that you argued "Hey. They fell because of outside conflict instead if internal conflict!" and I simply stated that just proves more that they fail if anything.

And the fact is that the circumstances their defeat by outside forces would give weight to arguments that has communism been successful as all of them held out much longer than could be expected. Anarchist Catalonia, for example, was more successful from a military standpoint than France.

[4years]

A Orwellian idlogy.

Most amusing since Orwell was a committed socialist.

[Pandeeria]

What are you getting at exactly?

Capitalism is about money. People are resources. Wars make money. War is a racket.
Politics is an illusion because it doesn't control the money, the money controls the politics.

Capitalism is about making money. People are citizens that get rights. People are not mere resources, even to corporations. Wars make money, dispute the cost? How do they make a siginifcant amount of money?

If money controls politics, then what's up with Communism? What's up with Socialism and Totalitairanism. Money alone does not control politics.

[4years]

I believe Communism is a fine idea. Crime is all but none, everyone is equal, and the government can focus more on international affairs instead of worring about their own people.

Communism, when it arrived will be a world system and the communist government will be tool in the hands of its people. The underlined is directly counter to communist thought.

[Pandeeria]

I never really made a point. I just stated that you argued "Hey. They fell because of outside conflict instead if internal conflict!" and I simply stated that just proves more that they fail if anything.

And the fact is that the circumstances their defeat by outside forces would give weight to arguments that has communism been successful as all of them held out much longer than could be expected. Anarchist Catalonia, for example, was more successful from a military standpoint than France.

It doesn't give weight to any side.

How was Catalonia more successful militarly then France? Because it held out longer?

[New Rlyeh]

It is a detestable philosophy. My grandparents left Romania due to a lack of opportunity under the yolk of communism. It is an artificial condition imposed by ruling elite under the guise of equality and fairness. If you aspire to the status quo comrade, it is for you. Read anything written by the people who lived in East Berlin or Yugoslavia (Josip Broz Tito). Remember that purged is another word for executed. I hate to source Wikipedia but "Mass killings occurred under some Communist regimes during the twentieth century with an estimated death toll numbering between 85 and 100 million”. If you abandon independence and individualism you get the collective.

[4years]

And the fact is that the circumstances their defeat by outside forces would give weight to arguments that has communism been successful as all of them held out much longer than could be expected. Anarchist Catalonia, for example, was more successful from a military standpoint than France.

1. It doesn't give weight to any side.

2. How was Catalonia more successful militarly then France? Because it held out longer?

1. If you believe that, then why did you say of the the military defeats of communist societies "that just proves more that they fail if anything"? Surely if communism being easily conquered is evidence of it being more likely to fail than communism succeeding military is equally eve diced for it being more likely to succeed?

2. Because it held out longer against a more powerful enemy despite having less resources and less outside support.

[Pandeeria]

1. It doesn't give weight to any side.

2. How was Catalonia more successful militarly then France? Because it held out longer?

1. If you believe that, then why did you say of the the military defeats of communist societies "that just proves more that they fail if anything"? Surely if communism being easily conquered is evidence of it being more likely to fail than communism succeeding military is equally eve diced for it being more likely to succeed?

2. Because it held out longer against a more powerful enemy despite having less resources and less outside support.

1. Because if it gives weight to any side, it gives weight to the anti-communist side. However it doesn't really give weight to either side

2. So is Vietnam militarily superior to the US?

[4years]

1. If you believe that, then why did you say of the the military defeats of communist societies "that just proves more that they fail if anything"? Surely if communism being easily conquered is evidence of it being more likely to fail than communism succeeding military is equally eve diced for it being more likely to succeed?

2. Because it held out longer against a more powerful enemy despite having less resources and less outside support.

1. A) Because if it gives weight to any side, it gives weight to the anti-communist side. B) However it doesn't really give weight to either side

2. So is Vietnam militarily superior to the US?

1. A) No, it doesn't. Given the circumstances, the military performance of the communist societies in question was remarkable and far better than any capitalist society has ever done. Evaluated from a purely military standpoint, the societies I mentioned were a validation of communism. B) Then why mention it?

2. No, Vietnam was merely more military successful during the war than the US. More successful does not necessarily mean superior, especially as the criteria for more successful often includes achieving compatible or greater results with inferior material.

[Pandeeria]

1. A) Because if it gives weight to any side, it gives weight to the anti-communist side. B) However it doesn't really give weight to either side

2. So is Vietnam militarily superior to the US?

1. A) No, it doesn't. Given the circumstances, the military performance of the communist societies in question was remarkable and far better than any capitalist society has ever done. Evaluated from a purely military standpoint, the societies I mentioned were a validation of communism. B) Then why mention it?

2. No, Vietnam was merely more military successful during the war than the US. More successful does not necessarily mean superior, especially as the criteria for more successful often includes achieving compatible or greater results with inferior material.

1A. So they were far better then the US? No, just their military strength. The USSR had military strength, is that a validation that it's system was successful and worked? 1B. I was just point it out.

2. Didn't the US army have a better military and more resources then Vietnam?

[4years]

1. A) No, it doesn't. Given the circumstances, the military performance of the communist societies in question was remarkable and far better than any capitalist society has ever done. Evaluated from a purely military standpoint, the societies I mentioned were a validation of communism. B) Then why mention it?

2. No, Vietnam was merely more military successful during the war than the US. More successful does not necessarily mean superior, especially as the criteria for more successful often includes achieving compatible or greater results with inferior material.

1A. So they were far better then the US? No, just their military strength. The USSR had military strength, is that a validation that it's system was successful and worked? 1B. I was just point it out.

2. Didn't the US army have a better military and more resources then Vietnam?

1. A) you were the one who began talking about military strength the the first place! Don't try to move the goalposts now. We can talk about the internal policies of the societies I mentioned (which were much better than those of the US, I might add), but it was you who made this about military success, you who lost that argument, and I have zero reason to allow you to worm your way out of it. B) And you pointed to an area where the communist societies in question preformed remarkably well.

2. Yes they did, which was part of my point.

[Liberaxia]

A movement whose legacy has poisoned the American right-wing with utter fucking nonsense.

[4years]

A movement whose legacy has poisoned the American right-wing with utter fucking nonsense.

Turing right-wingers into nonsense spouting morons is just a side benefit.

[Marsisian]

Good on paper, bad in practice. That's why I stick with my trusted good friend, Mr. Capitalism.