Canada Post to phase out home delivery services

[Freiheit Reich]

There are good and bad things about where we live. The boonies might have cleaner air, lower housing costs, and less gang violence BUT they also have higher costs for most goods (less competition) and possibly no (or expensive) mail service.

You take the good, you take the bad,
you take them both and there you have
The Facts of Life, the Facts of Life.

Or if it remains nationalized, their mail service isn't any more expensive.

And we depend on the govt. for another aspect of our lives. We should try to have the least govt. possible, only for essential things. Govt. should not provide transportation services (ex. Amtrak), postal service, or university education.

[Luveria]

Or if it remains nationalized, their mail service isn't any more expensive.

And we depend on the govt. for another aspect of our lives. We should try to have the least govt. possible, only for essential things. Govt. should not provide transportation services (ex. Amtrak), postal service, or university education.

Uhuh, because providing higher education isn't at all benefiting the collective good of the country.

[Nationalist Eminral Republic]

Or if it remains nationalized, their mail service isn't any more expensive.

And we depend on the govt. for another aspect of our lives. We should try to have the least govt. possible, only for essential things. Govt. should not provide transportation services (ex. Amtrak), postal service, or university education.

And how do you define essential? Just the military and police?

[Luveria]

And we depend on the govt. for another aspect of our lives. We should try to have the least govt. possible, only for essential things. Govt. should not provide transportation services (ex. Amtrak), postal service, or university education.

And how do you define essential? Just the military and police?

I'll provide a source for him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night-watchman_state

[Entre Rios]

Doesn't this just defeat the purpose of a postal service!? Pretty soon, Canada Post will be asking people to deliver their own mail... Harper might have more money for Canada Post if he hadn't blown billions of dollars on not buying F-35s.

[Luveria]

Doesn't this just defeat the purpose of a postal service!? Pretty soon, Canada Post will be asking people to deliver their own mail... Harper might have more money for Canada Post if he hadn't blown billions of dollars on not buying F-35s.

How does it defeat the purpose of it?
Rural deliveries are unaffected by the changes.

[Flaxxony]

Putting financial pressure to move to the city isn't all bad. Just ask planet earth. After all, the industrial revolution was started that very way.

[Czechanada]

I don't want to crawl out in the middle of icy cold Canadian winter in my pyjamas all the way to a P.O. box just to pick up my copy of PC Gamer.

[Lucanda]

Who cares? I've had a community mail box for years and have yet to have any problems with it, All that's in the mail nowadays anyways is 95% junk and advertisements. The people who are crying about this are the same people who complained when the milkman got phased out.

[The Liberated Territories]

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

[Freiheit Reich]

And how do you define essential? Just the military and police?

I'll provide a source for him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night-watchman_state

Good definition and probably the closest to what I would support. Of course we would have to gradually wean people off the govt. teat so they don't go nuts. Cut one string at a time. Why not start with postal service?

[Oneracon]

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

It's the job of the government to subsidize services that are necessary but not necessarily profitable to the private sector, in a way that still makes them affordable to those who require them.

[Czechanada]

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

That's the whole point of a state: To provide services.

[Hardened Pyrokinetics]

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

Because private companies suck at it.

[Alien Space Bats]

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

Absentee voting and the delivery of legal notices by mail.

We can't trust private corporations to maintain the proper legal chain of possession for such documents; if a private company handles a ballot, that ballot must necessarily be considered spoiled; if a private company handles a legal notice (such as a summons), the recipient can effectively argue that the chain of possession has been broken and challenge whether or not the document was ever legally delivered.

The truth is, some government functions rely upon the existence of a delivery service than can be considered a legally sworn an impartial messenger acting on behalf of the courts and/or the local clerk's office for the sake of handling legal documents (including ballots). Of course, I'm not surprised that some libertarians prefer to ignore this; they think that even courts should be privatized (and thus justice be dispensed to the highest bidder) and that democracy is undesirable (since in a perfect libertarian society, the rich own and run everything and the poor are merely tenant wage slaves).

[Luveria]

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

Absentee voting and the delivery of legal notices by mail.

We can't trust private corporations to maintain the proper legal chain of possession for such documents; if a private company handles a ballot, that ballot must necessarily be considered spoiled; if a private company handles a legal notice (such as a summons), the recipient can effectively argue that the chain of possession has been broken and challenge whether or not the document was ever legally delivered.

The truth is, some government functions rely upon the existence of a delivery service than can be considered a legally sworn an impartial messenger acting on behalf of the courts and/or the local clerk's office for the sake of handling legal documents (including ballots). Of course, I'm not surprised that some libertarians prefer to ignore this; they think that even courts should be privatized (and thus justice be dispensed to the highest bidder) and that democracy is undesirable (since in a perfect libertarian society, the rich own and run everything and the poor are merely tenant wage slaves).

That is the best post I have read for why states should retain a mail service.

[Empire of Narnia]

The mail should be considered an essential service. They should run it the same way regardless of whether or not it makes money. Just use tax money to balance it out. They don't cut down the military or healthcare just because they don't make a profit.

[Luveria]

The mail should be considered an essential service. They should run it the same way regardless of whether or not it makes money. Just use tax money to balance it out. They don't cut down the military or healthcare just because they don't make a profit.

I would prefer a mail service isn't run so inefficiently that it requires taxes to sustain itself. The USPS has a debt of $45 billion last time I checked.

It's entirely possible to reform a mail service like Canada Post is doing so that it doesn't require taxes.

[Souseiseki]

The mail should be considered an essential service. They should run it the same way regardless of whether or not it makes money. Just use tax money to balance it out. They don't cut down the military or healthcare just because they don't make a profit.

I would prefer a mail service isn't run so inefficiently that it requires taxes to sustain itself. The USPS has a debt of $45 billion last time I checked.

It's entirely possible to reform a mail service like Canada Post is doing so that it doesn't require taxes.

you've already been told that USPS is run very efficiently, makes a profit and all of its problems come from external intervention. unless you think regulations on business mean they are inefficiently run, in which case hey they could just make the same law for private companies as well if they felt like it.

Now why should the government be in charge of the basic services? Like sausage making or mail? You tell me.

sausage making and mail are not comparable sorry

[Luveria]

I would prefer a mail service isn't run so inefficiently that it requires taxes to sustain itself. The USPS has a debt of $45 billion last time I checked.

It's entirely possible to reform a mail service like Canada Post is doing so that it doesn't require taxes.

you've already been told that USPS is run very efficiently, makes a profit and all of its problems come from external intervention. unless you think regulations on business mean they are inefficiently run, in which case hey they could just make the same law for private companies as well if they felt like it.

Part of a postal service being run inefficiently is having a $45 billion dollar debt regardless of where it comes from. That is why I said there should be reforms.

As far as I'm aware, the USPS problem is unique to the USPS and for some reason doesn't happen to private mail businesses in the US, so there really should be some changes to the laws regarding USPS.

[Oneracon]

The mail should be considered an essential service. They should run it the same way regardless of whether or not it makes money. Just use tax money to balance it out. They don't cut down the military or healthcare just because they don't make a profit.

I would prefer a mail service isn't run so inefficiently that it requires taxes to sustain itself. The USPS has a debt of $45 billion last time I checked.

It's entirely possible to reform a mail service like Canada Post is doing so that it doesn't require taxes.

Canada Post has recorded profits for 17 of the last 18 years (the only year it did not run at a profit was 2011 due to the mail strike), it is far from inefficient.

To quote from the 2011 FY corporate annual report (emphasis mine):

Canada Post reported an unconsolidated financial loss before tax of $327 million for 2011... the unconsolidated financial loss follows 16 consecutive years of profitability at Canada Post.

[Luveria]

I would prefer a mail service isn't run so inefficiently that it requires taxes to sustain itself. The USPS has a debt of $45 billion last time I checked.

It's entirely possible to reform a mail service like Canada Post is doing so that it doesn't require taxes.

Canada Post has recorded profits for 17 of the last 18 years (the only year it did not run at a profit was 2011 due to the mail strike), it is far from inefficient.

To quote from the 2011 FY corporate annual report (emphasis mine):

Canada Post reported an unconsolidated financial loss before tax of $327 million for 2011... the unconsolidated financial loss follows 16 consecutive years of profitability at Canada Post.

Then with higher profits it is a source of revenue for the government.

[Oneracon]

Canada Post has recorded profits for 17 of the last 18 years (the only year it did not run at a profit was 2011 due to the mail strike), it is far from inefficient.

To quote from the 2011 FY corporate annual report (emphasis mine):

Canada Post reported an unconsolidated financial loss before tax of $327 million for 2011... the unconsolidated financial loss follows 16 consecutive years of profitability at Canada Post.

Then with higher profits it is a source of revenue for the government.

It is a source of revenue for the government, over the last decade it has returned over $1.5 billion to the federal government.

Plus it is has diversified into owning other sectors of the postal business. Canada Post Corporation owns: 91% of Purolator (the largest courier and freight company in Canada), 98.7% of SCI Group (one of the largest logistics companies in Canada), and 51% of Innovapost (an IT services company developed as a joint venture)... collectively these make up up the Canada Post Group of Companies.

[Luveria]

Then with higher profits it is a source of revenue for the government.

It is a source of revenue for the government, over the last decade it has returned over $1.5 billion to the federal government.

Plus it is has diversified into owning other sectors of the postal business. Canada Post Corporation owns: 91% of Purolator (the largest courier and freight company in Canada), 98.7% of SCI Group (one of the largest logistics companies in Canada), and 51% of Innovapost (an IT services company developed as a joint venture)... collectively these make up up the Canada Post Group of Companies.

I approve.

If only the US could learn from Canada Post's ways.

[Oneracon]

It is a source of revenue for the government, over the last decade it has returned over $1.5 billion to the federal government.

Plus it is has diversified into owning other sectors of the postal business. Canada Post Corporation owns: 91% of Purolator (the largest courier and freight company in Canada), 98.7% of SCI Group (one of the largest logistics companies in Canada), and 51% of Innovapost (an IT services company developed as a joint venture)... collectively these make up up the Canada Post Group of Companies.

I approve.

If only US could learn from Canada Post's ways.

It seems the opposite has happened.

At least one Republican is praising us and the CEO of Canada Post claims that senior citizens "want the exercise" of going to pick up their mail.