"Santa Claus should be white"

[Lunamyst]

tell me how purposely changing the race of a character just to be more comfortable with them isn't racist.

[Mavorpen]

there's a reason why EVERY bloody picture of him on the wikipedia page depicts a white man.

Because people like drawing him that way...?

Also, if you read the whole article, the source of the legend is clearly European. The presumption with Europeans is that when they are looking at people like St. Nick, Odin, Sinterklass and Father Christmas... they have a white man in mind unless shown otherwise.

Now I just need a legend specifically saying that he's white.

People in China don't have mythical figures that we assume are white or black unless they expressly state so.

I don't assume they're any race, because again, these figures are typically not human and thus can't be a part of any race.

With myths, the presumption is that the people who come up with them see the figures as being of their own race... UNLESS explicitly shown otherwise.

No it isn't.

Therefore, because they all came from Europe, they are white unless shown otherwise.

You were the one who claimed the legends state he is white. Don't backpedal on me now because you've got jack shit.

Plus, as you can see from wikipedia and pretty much all depictions of him from prior to the 1900s... he has ALWAYS been shown as white.

In other words, you don't have any legends explicitly saying he's white.

Got it.

[Mavorpen]

I just want to emphasize how silly this argument is. Apparently Santa Claus can't change his race. He can break the laws of physics by going to every single house in one night. He can change his mass to fit down any chimney. He can magically monitor every child on Earth. He can sneak through house undetectable.

But he can't change his skin color or facial features?

This is seriously like arguing that Superman can't move Mars because he's never been shown to. Yet, we've seen him move the Earth in comics and thus can infer based off of that other feats. And if you seriously want to argue that Santa is incapable of changing his race but also capable of demolishing the laws of physics, well, that sounds like a personal problem.

I'm still wondering why a black/white/other race Santa is so important. Christ on his fucking rotting cross, does the colour of a mythical man matter?

Because Santa is a representation of joy, giving, etc.

And apparently a black person can't represent those things because only white people are the one true master race.

[Greed and Death]

http://satwcomic.com/merry-christmas

Seems strangely relevant.

[Liberated Dixieland]

tell me how purposely changing the race of a character just to be more comfortable with them isn't racist.

Tell me how freaking out that someone portrayed a character as black isn't racist.

[Mavorpen]

http://satwcomic.com/merry-christmas

Seems strangely relevant.

Finland's just like, "fuck this shit" for the entire comic.

[Hathradic States]

I'm still wondering why a black/white/other race Santa is so important. Christ on his fucking rotting cross, does the colour of a mythical man matter?

Because Santa is a representation of joy, giving, etc.

And apparently a black person can't represent those things because only white people are the one true master race.

Does it have to be represented by a black person, though? Is it that ungodly important?

Again, I am stating my thought: Santa should become a fucking polar bear. There is no possible way that any race can bitch about it after that.

[God Kefka]

there's a reason why EVERY bloody picture of him on the wikipedia page depicts a white man.

Because people like drawing him that way...?

Also, if you read the whole article, the source of the legend is clearly European. The presumption with Europeans is that when they are looking at people like St. Nick, Odin, Sinterklass and Father Christmas... they have a white man in mind unless shown otherwise.

Now I just need a legend specifically saying that he's white.

People in China don't have mythical figures that we assume are white or black unless they expressly state so.

I don't assume they're any race, because again, these figures are typically not human and thus can't be a part of any race.

With myths, the presumption is that the people who come up with them see the figures as being of their own race... UNLESS explicitly shown otherwise.

No it isn't.

Therefore, because they all came from Europe, they are white unless shown otherwise.

You were the one who claimed the legends state he is white. Don't backpedal on me now because you've got jack shit.

Plus, as you can see from wikipedia and pretty much all depictions of him from prior to the 1900s... he has ALWAYS been shown as white.

In other words, you don't have any legends explicitly saying he's white.

Got it.

He's white because the Europeans came up with him. Also, he has always been drawn as white prior to the second half of the 1900s...

Therefore, the presumption is that he is white UNLESS explicitly shown otherwise.

Just like when you are looking at Chinese or Japanese mythical figures... the presumption is that they are Asian UNLESS they explicitly state otherwise.

Therefore, Santa is white UNLESS you can show me a source from the canon where he is not so. And there is no such source.

Hence Santa has always been white...

[Mavorpen]

Does it have to be represented by a black person, though? Is it that ungodly important?

I don't think anyone's said he has to be represented by a black person.

Again, I am stating my thought: Santa should become a fucking polar bear. There is no possible way that any race can bitch about it after that.

Funnily, the woman who sparked the whole thing on Fox suggested that Santa just be a penguin.

If he can dance like the penguins in Happy Feet I'll be overjoyed.

[Mavorpen]

He's white because the Europeans came up with him. Also, he has always been drawn as white prior to the second half of the 1900s...

So you don't have the legends.

Just like when you are looking at Chinese or Japanese mythical figures... the presumption is that they are Asian UNLESS they explicitly state otherwise.

No, my presumption is that they are mythical figures that aren't human.

Therefore, Santa is white UNLESS you can show me a source from the canon where he is not so. And there is no such source.

Still waiting on you to quote the legends that says he's white.

[Hathradic States]

Does it have to be represented by a black person, though? Is it that ungodly important?

I don't think anyone's said he has to be represented by a black person.

Yeah, I really should read through, but I am too amazed this is an issue.

Again, I am stating my thought: Santa should become a fucking polar bear. There is no possible way that any race can bitch about it after that.

Funnily, the woman who sparked the whole thing on Fox suggested that Santa just be a penguin.

If he can dance like the penguins in Happy Feet I'll be overjoyed.

NO!

Penguins are from the South Pole, and aren't cuddly like vicious, bloodthirsty, endangered bears.

[Cameroi]

well "white" is a nonsense word, when it comes to talking about people, but the origeonal nikolas was nothern european. but then he wasn't fat either.

that came with the invention of the mythical figure. somewhere i've heard the origeonal russ ware a scandinavian stock, though of course that's not an aborigional location either. where they white white, or somewhat more healthily well tanned?

not swart nor even mediteranian olive, but not whitey white either. while of royal origen, he would not have been unfamiliar personally, with the rigors of out door living.

[Liberated Dixieland]

Does it have to be represented by a black person, though? Is it that ungodly important?

It is totally unimportant what race Santa Claus is portrayed. It doesn't matter in the slightest if he is portrayed as white, black, Asian, Australian Aborigine, as a polar bear, or as an alien, on account of the fact that Santa Claus is really none of those things and is really just some electric and chemical symbols in peoples' brains. However, there are a bunch of racists, like the one in the OP, freaking out that someone choose to portray Santa Claus as a different race from his mythological background. These freakouts are obviously racist, because they do not freak out about numerous other changes to the Santa Claus portrayal which occur every single year. Only the racial change sets them off, and it's obvious why. The correct response to someone drawing a black Santa should be "who cares", not "OMG desecration of my childhood!!!!"

[The Godly Nations]

Uh... that's not how it works at all. Every person that's actually reads a work like a comic or a manga knows that's not at all how it works. There are two things you need to make inferences about what a character can do: hype and notable feats.

Notable feats is more applicable here. When you want to determine whether a character can do something, you need to find out if the character has done something that requires more power, skill, etc. than something else than what you're claiming that they can do. Since demolishing the laws of physics, changing your mass, being able to see every child in the world at once, etc. are all feats that require more power than changing your race, it's easy to infer he can do so.

Also, still waiting on those legends.

there's a reason why EVERY bloody picture of him on the wikipedia page depicts a white man.

And it isn't a very good reason.

Also, if you read the whole article, the source of the legend is clearly European. The presumption with Europeans is that when they are looking at people like St. Nick, Odin, Sinterklass and Father Christmas... they have a white man in mind unless shown otherwise.

Really, when I hear all those, I have a Turkish fellow in mind...Anatolian, but that's not the point.

People in China don't have mythical figures that we assume are white or black unless they expressly state so.

Glad you brought China up because remember that Northern Indian, Nepalese sage, the one they call the Buddha?

Notice how Chinese he looks in China:

With myths, the presumption is that the people who come up with them see the figures as being of their own race... UNLESS explicitly shown otherwise.

What? In the long trip of King Yama from India to China to finally Japan, this is how he ended up:



I don't know any world where that looks Indian, and he is dressed in a Chinese fashion too.

Therefore, because they all came from Europe, they are white unless shown otherwise.

Now that they spread to a multicultural world, they should be multicultural, no?

I mean, they have black Jesus, chinese Jesus, white Jesus, if the founder of an entire religion gets such make over, why can't Santa?

Plus, as you can see from wikipedia and pretty much all depictions of him from prior to the 1900s... he has ALWAYS been shown as white.

The same era when it was okay to call a black lady an 'degenerate Hottentot'.

[Mavorpen]

Yeah, I really should read through, but I am too amazed this is an issue.

*shrug* Not a big deal.

NO!

Penguins are from the South Pole, and aren't cuddly like vicious, bloodthirsty, endangered bears.

Okay, they can be the Anti-Santa. *nods*

[God Kefka]

He's white because the Europeans came up with him. Also, he has always been drawn as white prior to the second half of the 1900s...

So you don't have the legends.

Just like when you are looking at Chinese or Japanese mythical figures... the presumption is that they are Asian UNLESS they explicitly state otherwise.

No, my presumption is that they are mythical figures that aren't human.

Therefore, Santa is white UNLESS you can show me a source from the canon where he is not so. And there is no such source.

Still waiting on you to quote the legends that says he's white.

Tell me why every single picture of him from before the 1900s of Santa has shown him as white?

Santa has always been white. It's not quoted because it is ASSUMED. When a certain race of people come up with a legend, the presumption is that characters in those legends are of the said race unless the story explicitly leads the reader to believe otherwise.

This is why we assume Horus in human form would look Egyptian and Zeus in human form would look like a white Greek. Got it?

[Hathradic States]

Yeah, I really should read through, but I am too amazed this is an issue.

*shrug* Not a big deal.

Some people sure seem to act like it...

NO!

Penguins are from the South Pole, and aren't cuddly like vicious, bloodthirsty, endangered bears.

Okay, they can be the Anti-Santa. *nods*

I just got a movie idea!

[Orveleca]

The dude ain't real. He can look like whatever the given artist thought he should look like. Saint Nicholas, on the other hand...

[Mavorpen]

Tell me why every single picture of him from before the 1900s of Santa has shown him as white?

Because they liked to draw him that way.

Santa has always been white. It's not quoted because it is ASSUMED. When a certain race of people come up with a legend, the presumption is that characters in those legends are of the said race unless the story explicitly leads the reader to believe otherwise.

So you admit that you LIED about the legends saying he is white.

Thanks. That's all I needed to see.

[Lunamyst]

tell me how purposely changing the race of a character just to be more comfortable with them isn't racist.

Tell me how freaking out that someone portrayed a character as black isn't racist.

tell me how it takes changing someone to their own race to be more comfortable with them is not a racist idea.

[Liberated Dixieland]

Tell me why every single picture of him from before the 1900s of Santa has shown him as white?

Santa has always been white. It's not quoted because it is ASSUMED. When a certain race of people come up with a legend, the presumption is that characters in those legends are of the said race unless the story explicitly leads the reader to believe otherwise.

This is why we assume Horus in human form would look Egyptian and Zeus in human form would look like a white Greek. Got it?

Santa has never been white, because to be white you have to be a human being, and he is not a human being.

Why does it matter to you how someone draws Santa Claus? Why do you care that you see him portrayed as black? Why should anyone care at all about how other people think about Santa Claus?

[God Kefka]

Tell me why every single picture of him from before the 1900s of Santa has shown him as white?

Because they liked to draw him that way.

Santa has always been white. It's not quoted because it is ASSUMED. When a certain race of people come up with a legend, the presumption is that characters in those legends are of the said race unless the story explicitly leads the reader to believe otherwise.

So you admit that you LIED about the legends saying he is white.

Thanks. That's all I needed to see.

the presumption is when

1. ALL pictures of him in the pre-modern era show him as white
2. Europeans came up with him
3. All the sources for his inspiration (Sinterklass, Odin, St Nicholas etc) were white

that he is white unless shown otherwise.

[Liberated Dixieland]

Tell me how freaking out that someone portrayed a character as black isn't racist.

tell me how it takes changing someone to their own race to be more comfortable with them is not a racist thing to do.

Because Santa Claus's race cannot be changed because he doesn't have a race because only real people have races.

[The Godly Nations]

Because they liked to draw him that way.

So you admit that you LIED about the legends saying he is white.

Thanks. That's all I needed to see.

the presumption is when

1. ALL pictures of him in the pre-modern era show him as white
2. Europeans came up with him
3. All the sources for his inspiration (Sinterklass, Odin, St Nicholas etc) were white

that he is white unless shown otherwise.

3. Definitely not true, St. Nick, Sinterklaas (basically the same thing) and Odin were all attested to be Anatolian.

[Mavorpen]

Some people sure seem to act like it...

I think the point that was trying to be made was that African American children find it odd when the image of white Santa is forced down their throat and thus makes it less relatable to them, so they should be able to see Santa depicted as a black man if they want.

I just got a movie idea!

I don't think it'll beat Exploding Penguins 3.